• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Ontario's Marijuana Distribution Plan is Horrible

Treat it like alcohol

Being intoxicared at work can and will get people fired. Solves the first three issues you bring up

As for the last add

Treat it like smoking as well. If the landlord can prohibit smoking, they can prohibit smoking pot.



1920's thinking. Very few smoke anymore, if they do, unlike cigarettes, there is no link whatsoever to cancer or lung disease. Cannabis is less addictive than coffee, while cigarettes are number one, alcohol number 7. Cannabis does not cause cirrhosis of the liver, and there is evidence to indicate it helps prevent heart disease as opposed to booze which is the second leading cause of heart disease behind cigarettes.

Cannabis is a healthy alternative to prescription medication for anxiety, sleep disorders, depression and a host of other ailments, all of which are aggravated by alcohol.

Alcohol has never been known to cure cancer, yet there is growing evidence to indicate cannabis is a currative, and is certainly the most effective non-addictive pain reliever known to mankind and is in increasing use in paliative care.

It has never been demonstrated under scientific conditions that cannabis affects driving at all, and the non-scientific research indicates both a dysfunction AND an improvement in driving depending on the personality. The only dysfunction proven about cannabis is short term memory loss (dude, where the hell are my keys). Meanwhile, scientific testing suggests cannabis is a strong anti-aggression medication.

There is only ONE reason the weed is illegal at all, and that had to do with cornering the rope/hemp market in the 1920's and there is no medical nor scientific evidence that cannabis should be included as a "narcotic" as no narcotic effect has ever been documented. However, tobacco IS a narcotic and the most highly addictive substance known to mankind but is sold in every state.

Further, the medicinal use of cannabis can be documented to 10,000 years before Europeans knew "America" existed and has been at various times used in a ceremonial role.

In conclusion, what has been proven to the Supreme Court of Canada is that cannabis should not be regarded as a narcotic, does have medicinal value and cannot be denied to patients.

So, its waaaaay beyond the 1920's idea of simply dismissing it as 'evil' when there is growing evidence not only of its medical benefits, but social benefits as well, ie, no one ever died from having too much pot, no one ever got stabbed because they were too stoned, and yet that **** happens nightly inn bars and back alleys across America. Time to get priorities straight, if you are attempting to prevent harm, look at booze first, prescription drugs second, street drugs third and when you figure out what to do about all that addiction THEN start talking about prohibitions on cannabis.

I have worked with addictions for the last 27 and a half years and have NEVER had to help anyone off pot; alcohol remains the number one offender and why alcoholics anonymous is alive and strong.
 
If what the provinces set up doesn't work the marketplace will take up the slack. Not like a pot network would need to be created from scratch. It's not rocket science- either make something that works or other people will.

Yes, the black/grey market certainly will, which unfortunately defies much of the point of controlled regulate and tax legalization. We do indeed need solutions that fully and properly harness the economy bolstering and revenue generating potential of commercial weed in the legitimate marketplace, and if the Liberal govt in Ontario fails to provide those solutions, another will when they're voted out.
 
So it looks like Ontario has failed the whole point of the exercise. The government wants to limit sales to most likely LCBO-run stores and online distribution, and there is only going to 40 of them to begin with. That is not going to be able to meet demand for the whole of Ontario, defeating the whole point of making it legal to take business away from illegal sources. Since it is the LCBO it also means they will probably charge insane prices further pushing people to continue buying from illegal sources.

Ontario has already failed, hopefully the other provinces don't follow.

Perhaps decriminalize marijuana so that it isnt illegal to grow, sell and smoke?
 
Treat it like alcohol

Being intoxicared at work can and will get people fired. Solves the first three issues you bring up

As for the last add

Treat it like smoking as well. If the landlord can prohibit smoking, they can prohibit smoking pot.


No. How is this different than the answer re booze?

No. How is this different than the answer re booze?

You can declare the house non-smoking and not rent to a smoker. How is this different than the answer for cigarettes?


You could easily tell when someone's been boozing.
If it's all that simple, then why are they so concerned about road safety?
 
Last edited:
1920's thinking. Very few smoke anymore, if they do, unlike cigarettes, there is no link whatsoever to cancer or lung disease. Cannabis is less addictive than coffee, while cigarettes are number one, alcohol number 7. Cannabis does not cause cirrhosis of the liver, and there is evidence to indicate it helps prevent heart disease as opposed to booze which is the second leading cause of heart disease behind cigarettes.

Cannabis is a healthy alternative to prescription medication for anxiety, sleep disorders, depression and a host of other ailments, all of which are aggravated by alcohol.

Alcohol has never been known to cure cancer, yet there is growing evidence to indicate cannabis is a currative, and is certainly the most effective non-addictive pain reliever known to mankind and is in increasing use in paliative care.

It has never been demonstrated under scientific conditions that cannabis affects driving at all, and the non-scientific research indicates both a dysfunction AND an improvement in driving depending on the personality. The only dysfunction proven about cannabis is short term memory loss (dude, where the hell are my keys). Meanwhile, scientific testing suggests cannabis is a strong anti-aggression medication.

There is only ONE reason the weed is illegal at all, and that had to do with cornering the rope/hemp market in the 1920's and there is no medical nor scientific evidence that cannabis should be included as a "narcotic" as no narcotic effect has ever been documented. However, tobacco IS a narcotic and the most highly addictive substance known to mankind but is sold in every state.

Further, the medicinal use of cannabis can be documented to 10,000 years before Europeans knew "America" existed and has been at various times used in a ceremonial role.

In conclusion, what has been proven to the Supreme Court of Canada is that cannabis should not be regarded as a narcotic, does have medicinal value and cannot be denied to patients.

So, its waaaaay beyond the 1920's idea of simply dismissing it as 'evil' when there is growing evidence not only of its medical benefits, but social benefits as well, ie, no one ever died from having too much pot, no one ever got stabbed because they were too stoned, and yet that **** happens nightly inn bars and back alleys across America. Time to get priorities straight, if you are attempting to prevent harm, look at booze first, prescription drugs second, street drugs third and when you figure out what to do about all that addiction THEN start talking about prohibitions on cannabis.

I have worked with addictions for the last 27 and a half years and have NEVER had to help anyone off pot; alcohol remains the number one offender and why alcoholics anonymous is alive and strong.

At a workshop for foster parents, we had a cop who works in Narcotics (and he deals with juveniles).
He said that marijuana LEADS to addiction to OTHER drugs.
 
You could easily tell when someone's been boozing.
If it's all that simple, then why are they so concerned about road safety?

because a check stop will be much harder to use against MJ
 
No easy analytical method to determine MJ intoxication, so they will have to go with the old fashioned field sobriety tests

Therefore.....it's not that simple.
 
At a workshop for foster parents, we had a cop who works in Narcotics (and he deals with juveniles).
He said that marijuana LEADS to addiction to OTHER drugs.

Well he is very much a liar, considering that marijuana is not even addictive to begin with so I have no idea how it would lead to other addictions. It is not addictive and it is not a gateway drug. What he is saying goes against the scientific consensus. He is is not a scientist.
 
What do you think is happening? It is being legalized.

No, its being regulated not actually decriminalized. If marijuana was decriminalized there would not be "illegal sources". In other words private sales are illegal, you can only buy weed from the government.
 
Well he is very much a liar, considering that marijuana is not even addictive to begin with so I have no idea how it would lead to other addictions. It is not addictive and it is not a gateway drug. What he is saying goes against the scientific consensus. He is is not a scientist.

But he has more experience than you! He's been dealing with drug addicts who started innocently with marijuana!
Unlike you, his claim is substantiated by studies.

Studies had shown that marijuana is a "gateway" substance.


Early exposure to cannabinoids in adolescent rodents decreases the reactivity of brain dopamine reward centers later in adulthood.48 To the extent that these findings generalize to humans, this could help explain the increased vulnerability for addiction to other substances of misuse later in life that most epidemiological studies have reported for people who begin marijuana use early in life.
https://www.drugabuse.gov/publications/research-reports/marijuana/marijuana-gateway-drug



It is very rare that a person tries heroin or cocaine as the first experience with drugs. Instead, most people who do try drugs have already been using a “gateway drug” for some time leading up to that point.

A gateway drug is one which serves to open the door to using harder drugs.
The three most common gateway drugs are:
Nicotine
Marijuana
Alcohol
The 3 Gateways to Drug Addiction | Narconon - Drug Addiction & Recovery Blog
 
At a workshop for foster parents, we had a cop who works in Narcotics (and he deals with juveniles).
He said that marijuana LEADS to addiction to OTHER drugs.



That is a common misconception among police officers. It has been scientifically established that Cannabis is NOT a gateway drug, but rather and out gateway where many hard core addicts are weaned off of whatever in favor of pot. However most hard core addicts, speed and fenatyl etc., the users do not like the effect of pot and have never used it.
Fentanyl is the number 1 killer behind alcohol, police are now charging dealers with manslaughter where they can make a case.

For the record, the biggest most ubiquitous gateway drug is alcohol.
 
Therefore.....it's not that simple.

The police have a bit more difficult job when it comes to determining if a person is driving under the influence. On the flip side the police will have a lot more time to focus on real crimes rather than possession of pot
 
At a workshop for foster parents, we had a cop who works in Narcotics (and he deals with juveniles).
He said that marijuana LEADS to addiction to OTHER drugs.

A "cop who works in narcotics" is not in a position to offer more than a personal opinion on the matter. The people in question most likely started with tobacco and/or alcohol, but I'm sure the cop didn't ask and/or consider those substances.
 
But he has more experience than you! He's been dealing with drug addicts who started innocently with marijuana!
Unlike you, his claim is substantiated by studies.

Studies had shown that marijuana is a "gateway" substance.



https://www.drugabuse.gov/publications/research-reports/marijuana/marijuana-gateway-drug




The 3 Gateways to Drug Addiction | Narconon - Drug Addiction & Recovery Blog

Well, then we need to ban and totally eradicate all three of those "gateway drugs", don't we?

Sorry, prohibition has been proven a dismal failure. The war on drugs is an expensive mess, and people are getting killed because of black market forces prohibition creates a market for.

Some people have addictive tendencies. You can't contort society to protect every minority there is. Out of tobacco, alcohol and MJ, only MJ has legit medical uses.
 
No, its being regulated not actually decriminalized. If marijuana was decriminalized there would not be "illegal sources". In other words private sales are illegal, you can only buy weed from the government.

No that is legalization, cigarette sales are regulated so is alcohol and many other things. Are those not legalized?
 
No that is legalization, cigarette sales are regulated so is alcohol and many other things. Are those not legalized?

I do not know about Canada, but in the US I can privately sell tobacco and alcohol. Indeed they are regulated, but you do not buy it from a state ran store. Nor does the government dictate how much tobacco or alcohol should cost for consumers.

The thing is that marijuana is a plant, that isnt even that hard to grow. Just dry and smoke. It is impossible to tax and regulate something that is easy to obtain safely (without even leaving your house). Whoever thought the legislation up in Canada ought to be flogged. Their entire method is naive and stupid and doomed to fail. Fail even worse then they can imagine. I mean once you assert something is legalized people tend to treat it like a right not a privilege.

From talking to my friends in Oregon, weed is becoming socially accepted. The reason being is for one it is legal there, another reason is that since it is legal the people that used to hide in the shadows are not hiding anymore. The face of weed is no longer hippies/criminals.
 
A "cop who works in narcotics" is not in a position to offer more than a personal opinion on the matter. The people in question most likely started with tobacco and/or alcohol, but I'm sure the cop didn't ask and/or consider those substances.

Well, I'm sure he knew the history of most of the juveniles he'd handled.
He was talking from what he'd learned in his field.
 
Well, then we need to ban and totally eradicate all three of those "gateway drugs", don't we?

Why didn't we ban tobacco and alcohol? It boils down to revenue, doesn't it?

Especially when you've got monopoly on alcohol. Now.....the government is going to be the marijuana "pusher." :lol:
 
Why didn't we ban tobacco and alcohol? It boils down to revenue, doesn't it?

Especially when you've got monopoly on alcohol. Now.....the government is going to be the marijuana "pusher." :lol:

Because prohibition worked so well last time.
 
Why didn't we ban tobacco and alcohol? It boils down to revenue, doesn't it?

Especially when you've got monopoly on alcohol. Now.....the government is going to be the marijuana "pusher." :lol:

In the USA we tried banning alcohol. That did not end well - it basically created a large, violent criminal industry.

We have tried to deal with tobacco through regulation and education. That seems to me to have been a better approach.
 
Back
Top Bottom