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Scientists cure cancer, but no one takes notice

Hidden? No. It's all much too complex to suggest that it would simply be hidden. But if there is no money in it it certainly wouldn't be promoted by big pharma and yes, I believe it would be discredited in some ways.

As an example, I work with 3 people who have adult onset Diabetes 2. They all take copious amounts of meds from their doctors for diabetes and related maladies. Two guys that work out at the same gym I go to had Diabetes 2. They've reversed their disease and take no drugs for anything. One guy began a reversal diet and program and was off meds including blood pressure meds, cholesterol and insulin within 6 months. He told a friend of his, who had Diabetes 2 and now his friend works out with him at the gym and HE no longer has takes any meds.

I thought they were bs-ing me. I did some reading on the Internet. Even some doctors call the lifestyle change a cure, others say reversal, but the fact remains for many, many people who are type 2 there is apparently a way to either reduce or entirely stop medication for the disease and its complications.

Why don't drug companies shout that to the roof tops? They are certainly aware of the fact that lifestyle changes can help millions of people to get off drugs and reverse diabetes 2 and complications. That's huge information. But, you'll have to surf the Net to find it.

Diet control diabetes is not something everyone can do, not everyone has the willpower.
If they suggest it and someone fails to implement the whole of the plan and dies, they could be sued.

Pharmaceutical companies are not your doctor.
Your doctor suggests lifestyle changes to help cure, alleviate, what have you, problems associated with disease.
 
Maybe they haven't considered that hundreds of "Big Pharma" executives are themselves subject to getting cancer... and so are their wives, children, parents, siblings, friends, cousins... and if the "cure" was made available only for the big shots and their families, that would still be thousands of people.... you couldn't keep it quiet. If you give The Cure to your wife's favorite Auntie, what happens when Auntie wants the cure for her daughter? Give it to her? Then what happens when Auntie's daughter wants The Cure for her boyfriend's mother? The secret would be out quickly.

Exactly right sir.
 
Hidden? No. It's all much too complex to suggest that it would simply be hidden. But if there is no money in it it certainly wouldn't be promoted by big pharma and yes, I believe it would be discredited in some ways.

As an example, I work with 3 people who have adult onset Diabetes 2. They all take copious amounts of meds from their doctors for diabetes and related maladies. Two guys that work out at the same gym I go to had Diabetes 2. They've reversed their disease and take no drugs for anything. One guy began a reversal diet and program and was off meds including blood pressure meds, cholesterol and insulin within 6 months. He told a friend of his, who had Diabetes 2 and now his friend works out with him at the gym and HE no longer has takes any meds.

I thought they were bs-ing me. I did some reading on the Internet. Even some doctors call the lifestyle change a cure, others say reversal, but the fact remains for many, many people who are type 2 there is apparently a way to either reduce or entirely stop medication for the disease and its complications.

Why don't drug companies shout that to the roof tops? They are certainly aware of the fact that lifestyle changes can help millions of people to get off drugs and reverse diabetes 2 and complications. That's huge information. But, you'll have to surf the Net to find it.


A change of lifestyle is not the same as a "cure".
 
this seems to presuppose that everyone is going to act in a nice orderly and rational fashion, and that all possible actors see themselves as profiting from this scenario.

Such circumstances are highly unlikely

This is why pure libertarianism would not work.
 
It seems you will be holding to the argument that capitalism is preventing a cure for cancer?

Nope. But, if we are discussing the profit is the only motive for things, then I would say that the psychology of greed would have an impact on the discovery of a cure.

Also, what's with the libertarian stuff? I'm pretty sure that this particular debate is only an economic issue (the profit motive). Are there social liberties involved? Anyway, I'm not a libertarian even if I defend capitalism against nonsense. If you bring some ridiculous crap against socialism, I'll defend it and next you'll be calling me is an extreme communist.

Economically, when you present an inflexible position that indicates that profit is the only motivator and fail to see the interconnectedness of other issues, you sould like a libertarian.
 
Again...holistic product manufacturers could make a killing on a product like this. Billions are spent for herbs and vitamin products every year. Consequently, the big Pharms aren't a significant issue in this matter.

By not getting in on a product that "claims" to take on one of the most deadest foes against humanity to public access - would be insanely naive on the part of major business interests who cater to the public that only produce and sell over-the-counter drugs.

Would companies involved in health care products blow off selling aspirin because it's not patentable? I don't think so. As cheap as aspirin has gotten. It's still called a miracle drug and is extremely profitable even with off brand suppliers.

If this product made its way to the market place as a holistic food supplement and thousands came forward with verifiable proof that were cured of cancer. The big Pharms would be kicking themselves in the ass for not getting involved. If nothing else it would pay for the big pharm's travel expenses for their reps who are selling designer prescription drugs.
 
A change of lifestyle is not the same as a "cure".

I didn't say it was. But in the context of this thread you don't see Big Pharma out there flogging lifestyle changes to the general public. "If you have Diabetes 2 there's a great chance that you might be able to stop taking insulin and perhaps even blood pressure medication if you change your lifestyle." Why won't Big Pharma tell you that? They could possibly save lives by doing so. We both know why, for the same reason Big Oil didn't tell you that benzene, the blowing/foaming agent they used to make fast food take out containers, was a carcinogen.
 
I think the only people who can legitimately vilify "big pharma" are people who don't take any prescription drugs, otherwise it's like a smoker criticizing big tobacco.
 
I think the only people who can legitimately vilify "big pharma" are people who don't take any prescription drugs, otherwise it's like a smoker criticizing big tobacco.

Why? Do people have a choice? Most people don't. We all know you can get prescription drugs cheaper almost anywhere in the known world than in the U.S. We also know Big Pharma lobbied to successfully stick Americans with very high prices.

That's not a good analogy anyway. If you don't want to pay the high price of cigarettes you can grow your own. It is isn't the tobacco companies that have driven the costs up. More to the point cigarettes aren't about being healthy. You can't quit smoking cigarettes and become healthier. Not that prescription drugs always make you healthier.
 
I think the only people who can legitimately vilify "big pharma" are people who don't take any prescription drugs, otherwise it's like a smoker criticizing big tobacco.

anybody knowledgeable of how they continually abuse the intent of i/p laws can rightly vilify big pharma.
 
Why? Do people have a choice? Most people don't. We all know you can get prescription drugs cheaper almost anywhere in the known world than in the U.S. We also know Big Pharma lobbied to successfully stick Americans with very high prices.

That's not a good analogy anyway. If you don't want to pay the high price of cigarettes you can grow your own. It is isn't the tobacco companies that have driven the costs up. More to the point cigarettes aren't about being healthy. You can't quit smoking cigarettes and become healthier. Not that prescription drugs always make you healthier.

I'm just saying, if you're going to paint "Big Pharma" as the very face of evil, have the integrity to not contribute to their profits or to benefit from their snake oils. ;)
 
sorry IP as in intellectual property

Trademarks, patents, things like that? How do they abuse intellectual property laws? They invest the time and money into the research (not to mention risk the law suits), they should be able to legally protect what they've created.
 
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yes, thanks to lobbyist activity, these corporations have really gotten the "disney treatment"

You probably didn't see that I modified that post;

Trademarks, patents, things like that? How do they abuse intellectual property laws? They invest the time and money into the research (not to mention risk the law suits), they should be able to legally protect what they've created.
 
If this holds up scrutiny it will revolutionize the medical profession and the pharmaceutical industry, reducing the cost and saving countless lives.

Now how to get this message out where it can do the most good.
 
If this holds up scrutiny it will revolutionize the medical profession and the pharmaceutical industry, reducing the cost and saving countless lives.

Now how to get this message out where it can do the most good.


I'm not trying to make light of your comment "holds up scruinty", but companies who make pecker stretchers and bras that increase boob size make mega bucks and there are independent scientific organizations who test such products and publish finds contrary to the manufacturers claims - but that doesn't have any major effect on the product sales.

Huge ad campaigns for non-approved by FDA products are seen in every conceivable advertising medium.

That said...I say that the idiom, "proof's in the pudding" strategy is the most appropriate way to market this product. To hell with big pharm marketing methods.
 
MrVicchio said:
Here's the thing that I find most disturbing about this entire thread. Do people actually believe this tripe that if a cure for cancer were found, it would be hidden so "big pharma" could keep raking in $$ on less effective treatments? I mean really? Some of you would actually believe that?

I do, but I have seen direct evidence that this is probably the case. Specifically, I once worked for a medical market research firm. One of our clients screwed up and sent us briefs on actual agents that had been developed for female pelvic adenosquamous carcinoma (ovarian, uterine, cervical). The survey that accompanied it (to be administered to oncologists) asked a series of questions whose aim was to discover what the minimum level of effectiveness the agent would need to have before the doctor would consider prescribing it. I had always thought that these were hypothetical questions, but the materials accompanying that survey named different agents, discussed their processes of manufacture, molecular structure, and details of small clinical trials that had been run on each. About six hours after they arrived, we got a frantic call from our client stating that we weren't supposed to have those and to return them immediately. I had been reading through them because that's what I thought I was supposed to be doing. It was clear to me, from the reading, that they actually had six agents whose effectiveness and side effect profiles were well known, and the idea was simply to discover which one they wanted to release, based on which one met the minimum marketable effectiveness.

I quit shortly after that. I wish I had had the presence of mind to photocopy that material before putting it in a Fedex box and returning it.

Goshin said:
Maybe they haven't considered that hundreds of "Big Pharma" executives are themselves subject to getting cancer... and so are their wives, children, parents, siblings, friends, cousins... and if the "cure" was made available only for the big shots and their families, that would still be thousands of people.... you couldn't keep it quiet. If you give The Cure to your wife's favorite Auntie, what happens when Auntie wants the cure for her daughter? Give it to her?

The Machiavellian answer is that you give your Aunt the cure, and when she wants it for her daughter (your cousin) you do the same. When she (your cousin) wants it for her boyfriend, you give him a placebo, he dies, and you explain that it's not really a cure, it doesn't work in every case, etc. As relationships radiate out from you (the Big Exec), there is a point before which everyone is an insider, and after which, everyone is an outsider. Those who are inside know it and know how to behave, including to whom they can give their affection. A single leak or two here or there ends up as some post on the internet somewhere, and is easy to cast as the work of a crackpot. The hullabaloo dies down pretty quickly, especially since there are plenty of real crackpots to muddy the waters.

The slightly more realistic answer is that things are more fragmented than this. The top execs have little idea what their chemists are working on, beyond finished product, but they nevertheless hold the power to release or not release a drug. The middle managers, the guys who run the chemists, do have an idea what they have, but have no power to release the drugs. And in fact there is no outright cure, just a particularly effective agent (as DCA is supposed by some to be--it doesn't work in every case). The top execs will not release for anyone without various bureaucratic hurdles being overcome and the middle managers can't argue that the agent is 100% effective, ergo, the situation you describe never arises. In the rare event it does, see paragraph above.
 
If they had found a cure to cancer this would be more mainstream, i don't buy it.
 
Why do you think that?

They have supposedly found a panacea for the biggest killer on Earth whose cure has eluded scientists for hundreds of years, for it to be mentioned only by "hub pages" which is some kind of blog website.

If such a thing where to happen it would be huge and it would be the biggest discovery in the field of medicine for years and the corner stone to modern health services. You would have to be either very desperate to believe this is true in order to believe it, or just seriously gullible.
 
They have supposedly found a panacea for the biggest killer on Earth whose cure has eluded scientists for hundreds of years, for it to be mentioned only by "hub pages" which is some kind of blog website.

If such a thing where to happen it would be huge and it would be the biggest discovery in the field of medicine for years and the corner stone to modern health services. You would have to be either very desperate to believe this is true in order to believe it, or just seriously gullible.
You have hit the nail on the head.

Our foundation funds a lot of medical research and I can assure you, if a cure for cancer was discovered, funds avalable for manufacturing and marketing it would be off the charts. Big Pharma would have to get in line to get a part of the action.

.
 
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