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Walker takes broad swipe at public employee unions

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haymarket said:
Conservative - this at least the third time I have to point out to you that this is the year 2011 and FDR has been dead for over seventy years now. I guess its progress that; you are fixated on FDR - but you have to accept that he is dead and the nation has moved on.
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And this is the third time I have told you that FDR got it right in the 30's and his statement stands today. Public unions should never be given collective bargaining rights to bargain with the people they fund with their political contributions as they pass on their costs to the taxpayers. How do you feel about contributing to a SS fund when hundreds of thousands of public employees don't have to and yet get pensions from the taxpayers? Make sense to you that the take home pay of public workers making the same amount as the private sector gets more take home pay because they don't contribute to SS?
 
Conservative said:
And this is the third time I have told you that FDR got it right in the 30's and his statement stands today. Public unions should never be given collective bargaining rights to bargain with the people they fund with their political contributions as they pass on their costs to the taxpayers. How do you feel about contributing to a SS fund when hundreds of thousands of public employees don't have to and yet get pensions from the taxpayers? Make sense to you that the take home pay of public workers making the same amount as the private sector gets more take home pay because they don't contribute to SS?
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Makes absolutely perfect sense to Haymarket, Conservative. He's a retired teacher with 33 years in the system; now he works for his state legislature. Can you spell "double dipping potential?" You will never convince Haymarket, Conservative. He has waaay too much to lose.
 
MaggieD said:
Makes absolutely perfect sense to Haymarket, Conservative. He's a retired teacher with 33 years in the system; now he works for his state legislature. Can you spell "double dipping potential?" You will never convince Haymarket, Conservative. He has waaay too much to lose.
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Good point, I had forgotten that. How about that double dipping Haymarket? I just love finding out about those evil greedy liberals.
 
Yes we have, and you just witnessed in Nov the direction we are going in.

No free rides Philly.

haymarket said:
Conservative - this at least the third time I have to point out to you that this is the year 2011 and FDR has been dead for over seventy years now. I guess its progress that; you are fixated on FDR - but you have to accept that he is dead and the nation has moved on.
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MaggieD said:
Makes absolutely perfect sense to Haymarket, Conservative. He's a retired teacher with 33 years in the system; now he works for his state legislature. Can you spell "double dipping potential?" You will never convince Haymarket, Conservative. He has waaay too much to lose.
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Kind of like the republican govenor of Iowa, who's getting retirement pay form the legislature and recieving a salery as governor. Don't worry, he's asking others to sacrific. Well, at least workers. No tax increases. In fact tax breaks. you know. Sharing the load. :coffeepap
 
Ockham said:
You have to realize any time management or government go into battle with the unions it's about power. Of course part of it's about power, but the rest of it is about a very real budget problem. There is no money. Walker has the basic math to give him cover for any accusations about a power grab. This isn't Walkers fault, the unions got greedy and have been for a long time. It's just their time to pay the piper.
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State's budgets are in trouble because of the 8 trillion dollar housing bubble and shady banking practices, not because teachers, firefighters and policeman are being overpaid. Get real! Why should they be penalized?
 
Boo Radley said:
Kind of like the republican govenor of Iowa, who's getting retirement pay form the legislature and recieving a salery as governor. Don't worry, he's asking others to sacrific. Well, at least workers. No tax increases. In fact tax breaks. you know. Sharing the load. :coffeepap
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how much extra money do you send to the government?
 
Why is no one mentioning that the reason that he needs to make these cuts is because he gave more tax breaks to businesses? So we are cutting our middle-class' wages so we can give business a break?

Wisconsin’s Cheesy Tax Cuts - Lee Sheppard - Taxation & Finance - Forbes (written by Lee Sheppard - a tax lawyer)

Is it possible to cut taxes while addressing a state budget deficit—leaving aside misguided folk belief in supply-side economics?

Wisconsin’s new Republican governor, Scott Walker, is cutting small business taxes while trying to reduce essential spending and threatening to prevent public employees from striking. The state has a budgetary shortfall of $3 billion over two years (Wisconsin budgets biennially). But Walker campaigned on creating a business-friendly climate, and called a special legislative session to enact his plans.
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Making sense of Wisconsin's union showdown

One old trick is to suggest a thought experiment that asks readers to consider the mirror image of what is going on. In this case, you'd be asked what the reaction would be from Republicans and business interests if a newly elected Democratic governor and legislature proposed to deal with a budget deficit by first raising unemployment benefits and then pushing through a big corporate tax increase for all but the Democratic-leaning tech sector. For good measure, the package would also contain a ban on corporations making political donations without getting the permission of each shareholder, lest they use their power to repeal the tax increase and push the budget out of balance.

This is analogous, of course, to what Gov. Scott Walker has proposed for dealing with Wisconsin's budget gap: the tax breaks for businesses, the benefit cuts for all state employees except Republican-leaning police and firefighters, the automatic decertification of all public-sector unions and the stripping of their right to bargain anything but wages. Looking at Walker's reflection in the political fun-house mirror makes it abundantly clear that the governor has a more ambitious agenda than merely closing a modest budget gap.
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Why not just lay it on the table: republicans and Walker think business is more important than the middle and lower class. Supply-side economics rears its ugly head again.
 
whysoserious said:
Why is no one mentioning that the reason that he needs to make these cuts is because he gave more tax breaks to businesses? So we are cutting our middle-class' wages so we can give business a break?

Wisconsin’s Cheesy Tax Cuts - Lee Sheppard - Taxation & Finance - Forbes (written by Lee Sheppard - a tax lawyer)



Making sense of Wisconsin's union showdown



Why not just lay it on the table: republicans and Walker think business is more important than the middle and lower class. Supply-side economics rears its ugly head again.
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Wouldn't we need to give some tax-cuts to businesses so they can start hiring again? No one is certain about their future, this includes businesses that supply jobs and employment for the lower and middle classes
 
whysoserious said:
Why is no one mentioning that the reason that he needs to make these cuts is because he gave more tax breaks to businesses? So we are cutting our middle-class' wages so we can give business a break?

Wisconsin’s Cheesy Tax Cuts - Lee Sheppard - Taxation & Finance - Forbes (written by Lee Sheppard - a tax lawyer)



Making sense of Wisconsin's union showdown



Why not just lay it on the table: republicans and Walker think business is more important than the middle and lower class. Supply-side economics rears its ugly head again.
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Psssst.... the tax breaks don't even go into effect until next year's budget, therefore have nothing to do with the $147 million shortfall this year.

The problem is poor decisions by Dems over the past five + years, which is why most of them got voted out of office.
 
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Conservative said:
Cannot defend your position, I see. That is what liberals always say when challenged. Amazing how foolish the union leadership makes their employees look.
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really no point in discussing anything having to do with unions with you...you have no clue as to what you are talking about. kinda pointless
 
randel said:
really no point in discussing anything having to do with unions with you...you have no clue as to what you are talking about. kinda pointless
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Some people are totally brainwashed and ignore the actual posted data to the contrary
 
Catawba said:
State's budgets are in trouble because of the 8 trillion dollar housing bubble and shady banking practices, not because teachers, firefighters and policeman are being overpaid. Get real! Why should they be penalized?
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You're one of 3 people in this country reading Dean Baker. You align with him because you believe in social justice and the "rich are evil, lets steal their money - they don't need it" philosophy. I understand why you like it - here's was he says:

Dean Baker - Economist said:
If members of Congress are too intimidated to do what is needed to fix the economy, then Wisconsin's legislators should do what common sense dictates: follow the money. Rather than taking pay and benefits from schoolteachers and firefighters, it makes sense to take money from the people who have it. This means taxing Wisconsin's wealthy and its corporations. The tax increase only needs to be temporary, since the state budget should be fine once the economy recovers.
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It's all Alan Greenspans fault... :lamo

Here are facts for you instead of social justice rhetoric.

Entitlements:

Medicaid deficit: $150 million in 2011, $1.8 billion by 2013.
Walker's State of the State speech warns of tough cuts, but is light on details

Pension deficit:

The Manhattan Institute for Policy Research shows Wisconsin's pension system is funded at 72% or lower, causing a $8.6 billion dollar shortfall. (April 2010)
http://www.edchoice.org/CMSModules/...r-Pension-Plans-It-s-Worse-Than-You-Think.pdf

Public school expenditures by district for health care: (Note: The WEA and Unions nepotism is evident, as the Unions and WEA are clearly connected).

http://www.publicschoolspending.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/WEA-Trust-final-report.pdf

Debt:

Wisconsin has a total state debt of $17,971,519,547 when calculated by adding the total of outstanding debt, pension and OPEB UAAL’s, unemployment trust funds and the 2010 budget gap as of July 2010.[2]
Wisconsin state budget - Sunshine Review


School deficits have been growing:

Milwaukee Public Schools built up a $10.7 million deficit this year, with 93 schools going into debt this year. Milwaukee Public Schools racked up nearly $2.4 billion in long-term, non-pension obligations to retirees and their spouses, according to new figures released August 2010.[6]

Nineteen of the schools reported deficits of more then $200,000.[7]

Wisconsin school system - Sunshine Review


It's not the "eeevvvill" corporations, it's not Greenspan or any other patsy the progressive liberal economists want to tag in the blame game. It's irresponsible practices across the board - and Public Unions are one of the causes. If you want to go on about how this is all some housing bubble mishap, you're free to do so; however I invite you to join the rest of America in the real world.
 
Ockham said:
You're one of 3 people in this country reading Dean Baker. You align with him because you believe in social justice and the "rich are evil, lets steal their money - they don't need it" philosophy.
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Yes, I believe in social justice. It makes no sense to me to give the bankers that ****** us trillions of dollars and then go after the teachers, firefighters, and policeman to try to even the books. But that's just me.

Why do you want to destroy the middle class? You think the world would be a better place if run by corporations?
 
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Catawba said:
Yes, I believe in social justice. It makes no sense to me to give the bankers that ****** us trillions of dollars and then go after the teachers, firefighters, and policeman to try to even the books. But that's just me.

Why do you want to destroy the middle class? You think the world would be a better place if run by corporations?
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Why do you want to rape your dog? ---- You see how stupid that sounds? That's how your statement above sounds, and since you cannot dispute the facts you have to resort to hyperbole and appeals to emotion to push your point of view. Look, the facts are the facts - I know you don't like them but that's the reality.
 
donc said:
You claim that you were at one time a shop steward (yet you don’t know where, or what your craft was at the time:roll:) and you still make the claim that union dues gets used for political purposes? I suggest you use goggle. Here are the key words …. Union Dues + Political Purposes
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Nice spin but we all know that unions are part of the democrat party Obama has proven that over the last 2 years
 
liblady said:
what i expect is that the media fully report what he said, and cns does not meet that challenge.
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You mean if the democrat obsessed liberal media does not report it is not true?
 
Ockham said:
Why do you want to rape your dog? ----
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The dog isn't the one getting raped here. Take a look around you as more and more of the middle class falls below the poverty line, while the wealth of the super rich grows. But I'm sure you have evidence to prove that the middle class is doing better and it is the super rich that is suffering, right?
 
Catawba said:
I corrected that. In 2010 70% of the top ten big money groups were conservative and 30% were the unions. And guess what, overwhelming support still means gave more.
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30% that have less than 20% of the work force.
 
Catawba said:
The dog isn't the one getting raped here. Take a look around you as more and more of the middle class falls below the poverty line, while the wealth of the super rich grows. But I'm sure you have evidence to prove that the middle class is doing better and it is the super rich that is suffering, right?
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Please refute the facts --- discuss the facts --- or debate the validity or invalidity of the facts. Just don't waste time making hyperbolic accusations and appeals to emotion. If all you care about is class warfare, I've really got nothing else for ya.
 
MaggieD said:
Makes absolutely perfect sense to Haymarket, Conservative. He's a retired teacher with 33 years in the system; now he works for his state legislature. Can you spell "double dipping potential?" You will never convince Haymarket, Conservative. He has waaay too much to lose.
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Maggie

Every dollar in my pocket was and is honestly earned. My average workday now is 12 hours a day. If I am fortunate, and its a light week, I only put in 8 on Monday and Friday.
 
haymarket said:
Maggie

Every dollar in my pocket was and is honestly earned. My average workday now is 12 hours a day. If I am fortunate, and its a light week, I only put in 8 on Monday and Friday.
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Poor guy. I am away from home 3 weeks at a time and home one week. Feel sorry for me yet?
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