• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Walker takes broad swipe at public employee unions

Status
Not open for further replies.
Horse****. I have said NUMEROUS times, labor is NEVER the sole fault. I have also said I dont fault teachers for trying to get as much compensation as they can nor being upset that they may lose compensation. I stated several times there is more than just one side of the story. Im also not going to blame a governor that has been in office for less thahn 2 months with creating the problem. He isnt sitting back whining about the mess he was handed by his predecessor and blaming everything on everyone else. He is addressing a problem. And instead of working WITH him to address the problem the democrat reps of Wisconsin went off into hiding. THATS going to turn out well...isnt it?

Now who is it that only see's one side?
and as i have stated, i've no problem at all with what the governor has asked for, for them to pick up more of the cost of their insurance/pensions....i think that is fair...what i have a problem with is him trying to strip them of their right to collective bargaining...the governor is within his right to ask for concessions when the state is struggling, and the unions are within their right to expect to be able to negotiate for a better benefits/pension package when the state is doing well...yeah, he has been their two months and has decided that the unions are all to blame for the states situation...no sense in that whatsoever
 
The govenor should identify as many liars as possible and have them immediately fired. If they find a doctor who tries to defraud the state by lying, then they should be stripped of their liscense to practice in Wisc.

I forget the exact wording as a doctor explained it, but they were more or less saying it was on the up and up. The worker was being seen by a licensed physician, blah blah, and they didn't have to disclose what was discussed. That also nothing said where they saw their patients etc.
 
Those teachers...the ones making 100+k in compensation...well over the state average...man...it must SUCK being treated like Egyptians making an average of 2$ a day. It also must suck that for their 'day of anger' and protests, the unions said...sure...expect them to lose some benefits to help with the state budget...all we care about is adding more people to the unions roles...dues to the coffers...
that has been debunked already...the teachers average around 44 thou if memory serves...try again.
 
Oh Hay...you are nothing if not consistent. Nothing ever fits your definition (especially when it disproves your argument, and you refuse to answer questions...so...guess who WONT be playing your stupid games?

Stupid games? Asking for evidence is stupid? Asking for verifiable support for your claims is a game? Why do you haunt a site called DEBATE POLITICS when you will not even follow the normal procedures of debate?
 
and like i said, unions have, and i suspect, continue to step up and do their part...you labor under the assumption that unions have caused this entire budget mess, and that is wrong, and i suspect that you know that that assumption is wrong, but you don't care, as it is a chance to bash unions.

I really don't blame unions.

I blame the politicians who sat at the bargaining table with them and gave up the store.
I blame the teachers themselves for not understanding they are part of the problem.

Public employees have a suhweeet deal. Better than any of the rest of us. Their defined benefit pension plans are helping to bankrupt the taxpayers.
 
that has been debunked already...the teachers average around 44 thou if memory serves...try again.

A link that the average teacher's salary in the state of Wisconsin is $44,000, please. I don't think your memory serves...at all.

Never mind. Got it. Average teacher salary $48,743. http://www.teachersalaryinfo.com/average-teacher-salary-wisconsin.html Note that fringe benefits are 50% of salary. http://dpi.state.wi.us/lbstat/xls/tasr10.xls These are school district numbers at that. I don't even trust them. Teachers get paid extra for taking study halls, lunchroom duty, yada yada yada.

Look up teachers named Smith on this link: http://www.postcrescent.com/article...evPageID=2&cpipage=1&CPIsortType=&CPIorderBy=

See how many Smiths you have to click on 'til you find on making just "average."
 
Last edited:
that has been debunked already...the teachers average around 44 thou if memory serves...try again.

You have to remember that they include teacher's assitants. Who make on less than the average. Most teachers earn way above the average of what you posted. Not all but enough do that cause a huge drain on taxpayers and then you have to include the benefits and pension they receive. Teachers get way too much.
 
You made the claim - you present your evidence. The last time I looked, the auto industry itself wanted help to preserve its labor unions and liked the arrangement and its workers. And the auto companies have turned around into profitability with UNION WORKERS.

So please give me some real evidence.

Sometimes Unions are the reasons shops end up closing down and shipping jobs overseas or to other states.
I was quite familiar with a company in marion Ohio. Tecumseh Products years ago. Almost all my friends worked there, and everyone knew someone who worked there. U.A.W. They went on strike one time even though my friends all felt they were paid fairly or even overpaid. They went on strike, even with the threat of the shop closing down altogether. No one believed that would really happen. Well it eventually did close. I fully blame the Union for that even though there were other circumstances. It was a bad time for Marion. Many who worked there were married couple's who then were both out of jobs. There were also several suicides because of it.
I have no love for Unions as a whole. They just want the dues and really don't care who gets thrown under the bus when they push too hard.
 
and as i have stated, i've no problem at all with what the governor has asked for, for them to pick up more of the cost of their insurance/pensions....i think that is fair...what i have a problem with is him trying to strip them of their right to collective bargaining...the governor is within his right to ask for concessions when the state is struggling, and the unions are within their right to expect to be able to negotiate for a better benefits/pension package when the state is doing well...yeah, he has been their two months and has decided that the unions are all to blame for the states situation...no sense in that whatsoever

And on that you disagree with the governor. And it is HIS belief that adding more unionized workers to state paid contracts would be devastating to the long term financial stability of the state. Again...it doesnt at ALL bother me that you disagree, nor do I expect you to change your mind. It IS however HIS job to govern the state. When you are in that capacity YOU will have to have a better way of ensuring your state doesnt encounter massive cost overruns.
 
And on that you disagree with the governor. And it is HIS belief that adding more unionized workers to state paid contracts would be devastating to the long term financial stability of the state. Again...it doesnt at ALL bother me that you disagree, nor do I expect you to change your mind. It IS however HIS job to govern the state. When you are in that capacity YOU will have to have a better way of ensuring your state doesnt encounter massive cost overruns.
you miss the whole point...this isnt about adding more unionized workers, this is about stripping them of rights....i don't expect you to change your mind either. the unions are not the problem here.
 
you miss the whole point...this isnt about adding more unionized workers, this is about stripping them of rights....i don't expect you to change your mind either. the unions are not the problem here.

Stripping them of their collective bargaining agreement? They arent stripping them of their rights, they are choosing to not extend the collective bargaining contract that runs out. Yes...the Unions ARE the problem. The unions bused in outraged protestors from across the country. And you have continued to skirt the reality...pay, services, or jobs. SOMETHING is going to be cut in Wisconsin to balance the budget. They are trying to do the work the taxpayers sent them to do. If the democrat reps have better ideas, they would be better served offering them in legislature as opposed to stewing in the hot tub at the holiday inn
 
you miss the whole point...this isnt about adding more unionized workers, this is about stripping them of rights....i don't expect you to change your mind either. the unions are not the problem here.

It's actually more than that, it's about stripping the Democratic Party of a major support group. This is just the beginning. I don't know if this has been mentioned, but Gov. Walker go major from the Koch Bros. The Republicans are trying to get one party rule..
 
Stripping them of their collective bargaining agreement? They arent stripping them of their rights, they are choosing to not extend the collective bargaining contract that runs out. Yes...the Unions ARE the problem. The unions bused in outraged protestors from across the country. And you have continued to skirt the reality...pay, services, or jobs. SOMETHING is going to be cut in Wisconsin to balance the budget. They are trying to do the work the taxpayers sent them to do. If the democrat reps have better ideas, they would be better served offering them in legislature as opposed to stewing in the hot tub at the holiday inn
sounds like the dems were not going to have chance to do much, as it was going to be forced down their throats....they did what was necessary to shed light on this load of crap the governor is trying to push through...apparently, you want to ignore everything i've said about the unions being willing to pick up more of the costs for their pensions, and healthcare...that doesnt matter to this governor, he wants the unions out of the picture, and he wants to dictate terms to them, instead of working with them.
 
It's actually more than that, it's about stripping the Democratic Party of a major support group. This is just the beginning. I don't know if this has been mentioned, but Gov. Walker go major from the Koch Bros. The Republicans are trying to get one party rule..
good point, and a valid one...
 
The assault on workers continues. Quote from the article:



So you have to attack workers to make sure you get enough money? What about reforming the state's 7.9% flat tax on corporations?

Also what is this:

about?

The threat of the NG is nothing but trying to use force to break the backs of the workers and make sure that they won't protest.

While unions will have to take some (economic) pain as well, there is absolutely no need to threaten the use of the National Guard.

This entire argument is unbelieveable. All public employees are paid by taxpayers not by the purchases from a private company. The people of Wisconsin will be paying for these public employees like they always have and the state just like the country is broke? Why in the hell would you jack up the prices of private sector goods to fund public employee pensions and retirement. Some people here don't have an ounce of sense.
 
Here is the official report from the State of Wisconsin Fiscal Bureau. Read it and you can see how the new Governor helped manufacture this so called crisis just to be able to attempt to do what he is now doing.

http://legis.wisconsin.gov/lfb/Misc/2011_01_31Vos&Darling.pdf


2010-11
Revenues

Opening Balance, July 1 $25,718,100
Taxes 12,691,400,000
Departmental Revenues
Tribal Gaming 22,330,300
Other 833,733,300
Total Available $13,573,181,700

Appropriations

Gross Appropriations $14,109,283,800
Compensation Reserves 95,962,700
Biennial Appropriation Adjustment -242,677,200
Sum Sufficient Reestimates -121,637,800
Less Lapses -389,112,600
Net Appropriations $13,451,818,900

Balances

Gross Balance $121,362,800
Less Required Statutory Balance -65,000,000
Net Balance, June 30 $56,362,800
 
Last edited:
good point, and a valid one...

This is about fiscal responsibility and what the taxpayers should pay. Union membership in this country is about 11% and they have outlived their usefulness. Public employee unions get all their benefits from the taxpayer and asking them to contribute to their pension and healthcare isn't out of line nor is it union busting. Doubt seriously that the taxpayers of Wisconsin will support the union demands but if they do, so be it, they pay for the mess they are creating.
 
It's actually more than that, it's about stripping the Democratic Party of a major support group. This is just the beginning. I don't know if this has been mentioned, but Gov. Walker go major from the Koch Bros. The Republicans are trying to get one party rule..

Yes - this is just the beginning. The GOP is facing demographics that spell DOOM for a political party of all white people in the next few decades. They must find a strategy that permits them to rule from a minority position in which they disenfranchise those who would vote against them. This is part of it.
 
This is about fiscal responsibility and what the taxpayers should pay. Union membership in this country is about 11% and they have outlived their usefulness. Public employee unions get all their benefits from the taxpayer and asking them to contribute to their pension and healthcare isn't out of line nor is it union busting. Doubt seriously that the taxpayers of Wisconsin will support the union demands but if they do, so be it, they pay for the mess they are creating.
apparently, you are one of the many who havent bothered to read through the multiple threads, and hence are commenting without knowing the whole story...the unions won't have a problem with contributing more to their insurance/pension...i know this will shock you, but i agree with the governor on that point....what the problem here is he is wanting to strip the unions of their rights to collective bargain....the governor has stepped way over the line on that one...that is union busting. the governor never attempted to sit down the unions. as for the rest of your post, we all know you are anti union, anti 'liberal'.....so i'm not sure what else you can contribute to this thread.
 
apparently, you are one of the many who havent bothered to read through the multiple threads, and hence are commenting without knowing the whole story...the unions won't have a problem with contributing more to their insurance/pension...i know this will shock you, but i agree with the governor on that point....what the problem here is he is wanting to strip the unions of their rights to collective bargain....the governor has stepped way over the line on that one...that is union busting. the governor never attempted to sit down the unions. as for the rest of your post, we all know you are anti union, anti 'liberal'.....so i'm not sure what else you can contribute to this thread.

Post the bill that strips the unions of collective bargaining on wages? As for contributing to the thread if you contribute anything to this one it will be the first time.
 
Yes - this is just the beginning. The GOP is facing demographics that spell DOOM for a political party of all white people in the next few decades. They must find a strategy that permits them to rule from a minority position in which they disenfranchise those who would vote against them. This is part of it.

LOL, from a minority position? Unions make up 11% of the work force so unless 11% is the majority, you are off base again as usual. take your argument to the taxpayers and see if they buy the collective bargaining agreement for public employees?
 
Post the bill that strips the unions of collective bargaining on wages? As for contributing to the thread if you contribute anything to this one it will be the first time.

they should have the ability to negotiate benefits and wages....seriously, what more can you contribute that hasnt been said already?
 
they should have the ability to negotiate benefits and wages....seriously, what more can you contribute that hasnt been said already?

Nothing takes away their right to negotiate wages, the issue is benefits. I suggest you read the bill.
 
Nothing takes away their right to negotiate wages, the issue is benefits. I suggest you read the bill.

been there, done that...the bill strips them of the right to bargain benefits, it forces the unions to have a 'vote' every year to stay certified, it makes paying dues or joining the union an 'option' ...perhaps YOU SHOULD READ THE BILL.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top Bottom