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CBS News Poll: Most Oppose GOP Tax Plan

Z3n said:
He's right though it would be ironic and fitting if you needed some medical treatment, it wasn't covered and you went bankrupt trying to pay for it. It would be karma from all of your posts! :p
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I have a rather large insurance policy. But I don't feel a need to steal from others to pay for me.
 
TurtleDude said:
I have a rather large insurance policy. But I don't feel a need to steal from others to pay for me.
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Yes that makes logical sense. If someone has a few grand in the bank and his insurance doesn't cover his surgery what is he supposed to do? Take out LOANS for life saving surgery?
 
Protectionist said:
Maybe that's because you haven't been someone who had a master's degree, 2 skilled trades, and recently found himself (after 2 years of looking everywhere else, and not having any friend or relative connections) applying for a job at Burger King, only to be told by the manager that he wasn't taking applications. When you asked why, he opened a file drawer, and showed you a stack of applications 2 feet thick, and said "here's 700 applications taken in over the past 3 months. Why take any more ?" And you say "Uh, yeah." and walk away. Understand now ?
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with all those credentials why not start your own business like so many other people have done.
 
Z3n said:
Yes that makes logical sense. If someone has a few grand in the bank and his insurance doesn't cover his surgery what is he supposed to do? Take out LOANS for life saving surgery?
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life isn't fair but dragging down other people isn't the answer. we make failure way too easy in this country and it has created a massive explosion of people who think the government exists to take care of them and others exist to pay for what they want
 
TurtleDude said:
no I am talking about retirees who think the rest of us ought to pay their way in life

what is really funny is that you parasite class enablers constantly whine about billionaires yet your schemes really impact the upper middle class the most. why do you bitch about people like Bill Gates when you plan on screwing over your doctor or (assuming you had a job) the guy who once employed you
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If it makes you feel any better, I'd be more interested in taxing the pants off multimillion $ and billion $ incomes (and wealth) than the lower rich. Incidenatally, I wouln't call someone whose income is $250,000/year, middle class.
 
TurtleDude said:
life isn't fair but dragging down other people isn't the answer. we make failure way too easy in this country and it has created a massive explosion of people who think the government exists to take care of them and others exist to pay for what they want
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How about reforming the insurance industry?
 
Z3n said:
How about reforming the insurance industry?
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be my guest. my son was born with a birth defect-nothing awful but 17 surgeries later he is finally over them (we think) and I had no issues with my insurance company
 
TurtleDude said:
be my guest. my son was born with a birth defect-nothing awful but 17 surgeries later he is finally over them (we think) and I had no issues with my insurance company
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You are very very lucky
 
TurtleDude said:
with all those credentials why not start your own business like so many other people have done.
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Because starting ones own business requires capital which many people don't have. Last time I checked even the SBA required collateral for loans (usually liquid like bank accounts). Often times asked question to the SBA is > "if I had $30K in the bank, who needs you ?"

Also, starting one's own business requires disposeable income in the community among potential purchasers of your products. With an obscenely low minimum wage, jobs disappearing to low wage foreigners overseas in international outsourcing, more jobs disappearing to low wage foreigners inside the USA in domestic outsourcing (AKA immigration), who are you going to sell to ?
When I had a business back in the 80s & 90s, my biggest problem was all the people who couldn't afford to purchase my products, and the economy was better then than it is now. As I walk around my local mall, I see a lot of For Rent signs in the storefront windows. Needs to be more money among the lower economic classes. That's where consumer purchasing comes from. Rich people don't buy stuff here. They spend in Europe and the Caribbean.
 
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TurtleDude said:
be my guest. my son was born with a birth defect-nothing awful but 17 surgeries later he is finally over them (we think) and I had no issues with my insurance company
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If it was a life-long ailment, an accountant in that company would have tabulated the costs to the company vs. the premiums you pay. Cost is above a certain amount ? You're gone. Only way you stay covered, is with national health insurance, and you may need it someday.
 
Protectionist said:
Maybe that's because you haven't been someone who had a master's degree, 2 skilled trades, and recently found himself (after 2 years of looking everywhere else, and not having any friend or relative connections) applying for a job at Burger King, only to be told by the manager that he wasn't taking applications. When you asked why, he opened a file drawer, and showed you a stack of applications 2 feet thick, and said "here's 700 applications taken in over the past 3 months. Why take any more ?" And you say "Uh, yeah." and walk away. Understand now ?
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You seem to be consumed with you own impression of how valuable you are to the job market. If you can't find a ****ing job in two ****ing years maybe you need to rethink how precious you really are. 90% of the population has managed to find work...



.
 
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This poll is so close that its essentially meaningless.
 
Deuce said:
Yeah! If you don't pay a specific type of tax, you don't DESERVE an opinion on things! Plus, EVERY person who pays no income tax is definitely a class-envy liberal who just wants to steal money from the rich. There are definitely no poor people who vote Republican.
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Who says they dont have a right to an OPINION. I believe the point made is that it shouldnt be totally shocking that people with their hands out and constantly wanting more should have the opinion that wealthy people should be required to take care of them.

What I cant wait to see is all the people on the left that BELIEVE this philosophy start actually LIVING it without the government forcing them to. I cant weait for all the rich liberals (lets start in congress since the majority of rich in congress are democrats) to start selling off their evil excesses and living a much more spartan lifestyle...not becaus ehte government tells them they have to but because its what they truly believe. Keep ONLY that 250k a year...and maybe a little in the bank to live on. Donate all of their excess to charities. No more mansions, or private islands, or yachts. Live what you pretend to believe without the government doing it to you or everyone else.
 
VanceMack said:
Who says they dont have a right to an OPINION. I believe the point made is that it shouldnt be totally shocking that people with their hands out and constantly wanting more should have the opinion that wealthy people should be required to take care of them.

What I cant wait to see is all the people on the left that BELIEVE this philosophy start actually LIVING it without the government forcing them to. I cant weait for all the rich liberals (lets start in congress since the majority of rich in congress are democrats) to start selling off their evil excesses and living a much more spartan lifestyle...not becaus ehte government tells them they have to but because its what they truly believe. Keep ONLY that 250k a year...and maybe a little in the bank to live on. Donate all of their excess to charities. No more mansions, or private islands, or yachts. Live what you pretend to believe without the government doing it to you or everyone else.
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rich dem politicians realize that they have to cater to class envy to remain rich. If they lose elections their access to the government gravy train is limited so they will pretend to advocate positions contrary to their economic self interest when in reality higher taxes is helpful to them because it gets them elected.

those in the lower economic rungs think that all the rich are the same. In reality there are those of us who are wealthy DESPITE the government and there are those who are wealthy only because of the government.
 
Protectionist said:
FALSE ! Every American citizen has a right to voice an opinion (1st Amendment). What amount of tax one pays has nothing to do with it.
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I never said anyone should be denied their opinion. I just stated that if you are not paying federal taxes then you have no business suggesting that other people should or should not get a tax cut. I never said they should be denied the right to voice their opinion.
 
jamesrage said:
I never said anyone should be denied their opinion. I just stated that if you are not paying federal taxes then you have no business suggesting that other people should or should not get a tax cut. I never said they should be denied the right to voice their opinion.
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that argument goes against everything that it means to be a citizen. My tax dollars - be they city, county, state or national go for a variety of things. Some I use, some I never use. It matters not because paying taxes is not like going to the local COSTCO where you load up a basket and pay at the checkout for what you want. If you transfer that type of mentality to taxes, you are basing your case on an extremely false premise.

This whole 'no representation with taxation' is one of the more bogus ideas i have ever seen floated in all my years. it is a sad testimony to the extent of our swing to the far right that such garbage is even being put forth as an idea worth discussing.
 
haymarket said:
that argument goes against everything that it means to be a citizen. My tax dollars - be they city, county, state or national go for a variety of things. Some I use, some I never use. It matters not because paying taxes is not like going to the local COSTCO where you load up a basket and pay at the checkout for what you want. If you transfer that type of mentality to taxes, you are basing your case on an extremely false premise.

This whole 'no representation with taxation' is one of the more bogus ideas i have ever seen floated in all my years. it is a sad testimony to the extent of our swing to the far right that such garbage is even being put forth as an idea worth discussing.
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it is bogus to you because it would castrate the power of your leaders to gain wealth and power by promising the money of others in exchange for the votes that give them wealth and power. And what is even more disgusting is that people like you want to expand the number of those beholden to government entitlements paid for by increased taxes on the most productive tax payers
 
haymarket said:
that argument goes against everything that it means to be a citizen. My tax dollars - be they city, county, state or national go for a variety of things. Some I use, some I never use. It matters not because paying taxes is not like going to the local COSTCO where you load up a basket and pay at the checkout for what you want. If you transfer that type of mentality to taxes, you are basing your case on an extremely false premise.

This whole 'no representation with taxation' is one of the more bogus ideas i have ever seen floated in all my years. it is a sad testimony to the extent of our swing to the far right that such garbage is even being put forth as an idea worth discussing.
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Its a sad testimony to our decline that so many crippled and dependent pets think that other people should be responsible for their care and well being. :doh
 
VanceMack said:
Its a sad testimony to our decline that so many crippled and dependent pets think that other people should be responsible for their care and well being. :doh
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NOthing yells "I AM A HELPLESS PAWN" louder than those who whine about "the wealthy"
 
We live in a time when the radical right has decided to emerge from under their rocks and make another stand to repeal the political advances of the 20th century. But this time it has gone even further than the Goldwater campaign of 64 or even the Reagan years. We are hearing ideas floated from radical libertarian groups like the Cato Insitiute and Von Mises Institute, which attack the basic right to vote, the popular election of Senators, Social Security, medicare, unions, government regulation of certain industries, civil rights, and other advancements of the past 100 years.

These worshipers at the altar of the 18th and 19th century want to return us to a modern equal of the Gilded Age when corporation ran roughshod over America and the people were little more than serfs. It is funny that one of their bibles is The Road To Serfdom and now that same title is coming true in a way that Hayek never thought it would.

A healthy democratic republic cannot exist when the widening gulf between the very rich and everyone else only gets worse month by month. Senator Bernie Sanders, in his heroic and valiant speech this week before the Senate asked the question of our century regarding the rich "when is enough enough?"

But change is coming. It will shake your windows and rattle your bones and it is coming. And for many they will not see it until it is far too late from them to prevent it.
 
radical right seems to be the current talking point of the dems these days. actually it is the dems who are far more leftwing than they were a few years ago.

the gulf increases due to a party that wants lots of dependent pawns and has enacted 70+ years of policies that create such pawnage. Not because the "rich" aren't taxed enough.
 
TurtleDude said:
radical right seems to be the current talking point of the dems these days. actually it is the dems who are far more leftwing than they were a few years ago.

the gulf increases due to a party that wants lots of dependent pawns and has enacted 70+ years of policies that create such pawnage. Not because the "rich" aren't taxed enough.
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As the right goes further to the right they become blinded to what actually is left and what is center. Bill Clinton governed from the middle and Obama has angered many of more progressive supporters who are now offering criticism of his moderate positions.

It is a sad commentary on how far to the right some people and organizations have gone that they confuse the center or slightly left of center with far left.
 
haymarket said:
As the right goes further to the right they become blinded to what actually is left and what is center. Bill Clinton governed from the middle and Obama has angered many of more progressive supporters who are now offering criticism of his moderate positions.

It is a sad commentary on how far to the right some people and organizations have gone that they confuse the center or slightly left of center with far left.
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the current dem leadership-the leadership that got bitched slapped a month ago but is whining about Obama now (who is moving right to bolster his waning re-election chances for 2012) is the most leftwing we have ever seen. and the problem is, many on this board crave outright eurosocialism and they pretend that far left is communism or anarcho-syndicalism when in the context of America, welfare-socialism is far left for our society
 
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