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Sexual assault in airports

TSA Groping Out Of Control carries the flag a bit further.

Heathrow authorities were unable to deny a later example of the scanners being abused, when it emerged that a Heathrow worker had perved over a naked image of a female colleague after she passed through one of the devices, before commenting, “I love those gigantic tits”.

Jo Margetson, 29, reported John Laker, 25, to the police after she had entered the x-ray machine by mistake and Laker took the image before making lewd comments.

Airport security staff workers are among the least trustworthy people to operate these machines. These individuals are routinely caught abusing their authority for their own ego trip or sexual perversion.

The systems are being manned by people like a TSA agent who flipped out and began screaming, “I am god, I’m in charge,” shortly after he got off duty at LAX earlier this year.

With innumerable reports over the past ten years of TSA agents completely abusing their authority and going on petty power trips with little other motivation than to humiliate and degrade old people, pregnant women, and the physically disabled, while proclaiming themselves to be “Gods,” the fact that these people are now feeling up our children is revolting.

This is not just "disgruntled" or "rude" behavior, although I am sure there is more than a fair share of that also.
 
A couple things.

First, did she swipe your hands twice with the little circle thing? Or did she do your hands then something else? If she did your hands the only reason it'd be done twice is if for some reason the swipe they did was not done correctly to get a decent reading off the machine.

Second, was there X-ray machines as you were going through (Gotta imagine there was unless it was a tiny flight). In general what you're saying with undoing your whole bag like that would be unusual I believe...then again, I did not do checkpoint and their x-rays worked different than baggage so admittedly there may be other policies there. It seems weird that she'd go through all your stuff but it may due to two reasons. Which takes me to...

Third, "Secondary" means secondary screening. This is screening that is beyond the standard procedures of running you through the metal detector (and sniffer if they have one) and having your stuff go through the x-ray. If they have to have you walk over and get a more thurough inspection that is called "secondary screening". This happens when people have issues that require it, such as medical devices or issues when someone has significant metal in their body. It also happens at random intervals as well I believe. There are strict protocols on what to do with regards to this and everything is supposed to be articulated to the passenger and asked of them prior to acting.

Fourth, this all leads me to a conclussion about Carla. Carla was probably a rather new person into the field and one that didn't, sadly, listen to closely during training. The lack of knowing what a secondary means helps lead me to believe this. The rather disorganized way you seem to suggest she acted with your bag also sounds like someone whose relatively new and hasn't fully had their supervisors come down on them yet for the poor workmanship. Its also why it likely took you far longer than it should've. Secondary screening is more time intensive but even then if everything is going smoothly it shouldn't be more than 10 or so minutes at the upper end as the purpose is primarily to get people moving and get them to their flights saftely.

If this was at a major airport this all makes even more sense to me as to the reasons it happens. While yes, I understand and would agree part of it is arguably overbearing TSA policy, another part of it is the sad state of things with the agency. Many in the public dislike the notion of TSA as a whole and having to deal with it, many of which don't just attribute the heightened saftey procedures to them but even forget that much of what they do was already done by private companies prior to it anyways. The various regulations passed by higher up that people dislike end up being vented at the employees on the line as they are the face of TSA for so many people. The pay, especially in places like DC, is attrociously low and promotion potential is very small. Due to this turnover is high which means you're always likely on any trip to have a decent chance of likely running into, either directly or as your bag travels, someone who is 4 months or less on the job.

Which I think is where most of the issue comes in when you get complaints that aren't about attitude but about actions. The training is uniformed across all the agency, and its good training. But you're advertising a position that could use intelligent people to fill it, but only requires a high school diploma and only pays like a job that you'd get with only a high school diploma. So you have continually new people, some of which who may not have cared all that much about paying attention or grasping the training, and when that happens procedures sometimes get messed up...sometimes erring on the side of overzealous in hopes of not getting in trouble for not doing enough. I'm not saying that's right, its not, but I think that's where most of these cases come in more than people trying to "abuse power" or purposefully "incompotent".

The public simply wants the impossible, as is so often with people. They want skilled, intelligent, professional people who know what they're doing...and they hate that there's so many of them and demand that the agency doesn't spend a ton of money while having many people take their TSA general frustrations out on the ground level people. The two desires don't mix well.
 
prisonplanet and infowars.

Stop the presses. Maybe next we'll get a link to a guys cousins friends account on their local message board.

/sigh
 
A couple things.

First, did she swipe your hands twice with the little circle thing? Or did she do your hands then something else? If she did your hands the only reason it'd be done twice is if for some reason the swipe they did was not done correctly to get a decent reading off the machine.

Second, was there X-ray machines as you were going through (Gotta imagine there was unless it was a tiny flight). In general what you're saying with undoing your whole bag like that would be unusual I believe...then again, I did not do checkpoint and their x-rays worked different than baggage so admittedly there may be other policies there. It seems weird that she'd go through all your stuff but it may due to two reasons. Which takes me to...

Third, "Secondary" means secondary screening. This is screening that is beyond the standard procedures of running you through the metal detector (and sniffer if they have one) and having your stuff go through the x-ray. If they have to have you walk over and get a more thurough inspection that is called "secondary screening". This happens when people have issues that require it, such as medical devices or issues when someone has significant metal in their body. It also happens at random intervals as well I believe. There are strict protocols on what to do with regards to this and everything is supposed to be articulated to the passenger and asked of them prior to acting.

Fourth, this all leads me to a conclussion about Carla. Carla was probably a rather new person into the field and one that didn't, sadly, listen to closely during training. The lack of knowing what a secondary means helps lead me to believe this. The rather disorganized way you seem to suggest she acted with your bag also sounds like someone whose relatively new and hasn't fully had their supervisors come down on them yet for the poor workmanship. Its also why it likely took you far longer than it should've. Secondary screening is more time intensive but even then if everything is going smoothly it shouldn't be more than 10 or so minutes at the upper end as the purpose is primarily to get people moving and get them to their flights saftely.

If this was at a major airport this all makes even more sense to me as to the reasons it happens. While yes, I understand and would agree part of it is arguably overbearing TSA policy, another part of it is the sad state of things with the agency. Many in the public dislike the notion of TSA as a whole and having to deal with it, many of which don't just attribute the heightened saftey procedures to them but even forget that much of what they do was already done by private companies prior to it anyways. The various regulations passed by higher up that people dislike end up being vented at the employees on the line as they are the face of TSA for so many people. The pay, especially in places like DC, is attrociously low and promotion potential is very small. Due to this turnover is high which means you're always likely on any trip to have a decent chance of likely running into, either directly or as your bag travels, someone who is 4 months or less on the job.

Which I think is where most of the issue comes in when you get complaints that aren't about attitude but about actions. The training is uniformed across all the agency, and its good training. But you're advertising a position that could use intelligent people to fill it, but only requires a high school diploma and only pays like a job that you'd get with only a high school diploma. So you have continually new people, some of which who may not have cared all that much about paying attention or grasping the training, and when that happens procedures sometimes get messed up...sometimes erring on the side of overzealous in hopes of not getting in trouble for not doing enough. I'm not saying that's right, its not, but I think that's where most of these cases come in more than people trying to "abuse power" or purposefully "incompotent".

The public simply wants the impossible, as is so often with people. They want skilled, intelligent, professional people who know what they're doing...and they hate that there's so many of them and demand that the agency doesn't spend a ton of money while having many people take their TSA general frustrations out on the ground level people. The two desires don't mix well.

Zyph, her story is dead on. I can personally verify it happens. It happened to me because of my insulin pump almost word for word. The have to physically go through your things and wipe them down with the bomb material pad. They also pat you down and frisk you.

I don't know why you want to discount the story. Many insulin pump wearers can tell you exactly the same story.

PS: they make you sit there while they go through your stuff. It takes time. I had 2 bags and it took a long time because they are being careful. Not like they want to throw your stuff around willy nilly.
 
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Zyph, her story is dead on. I can personally verify it happens. It happened to me because of my insulin pump almost word for word. The have to physically go through your things and wipe them down with the bomb material pad. They also pat you down and frisk you.

I don't know why you want to discount the story. Many insulin pump wearers can tell you exactly the same story.

Huh? I'm not discounting it. I absolutely think it happened.

The only thing I'm discounting was the notion that the near 30 minutes she talked about as being normal and the disorganized searching through her bag. Both of which I don't discount can't happen, but regulation wise with someone that's not relatively new to the job SHOULDN'T happen. But everything else...yeah, she's pretty much spot on and I'm not trying to discount it. What I was doing was attempting to give likely reasons why certain things that were odd or a bit off from the standard was occuring, and since you said it mirrored your experience, explain to you what "Secondary" screening is as opposed to "primary" screening which is the standard xray/metal detector procedure.
 
Huh? I'm not discounting it. I absolutely think it happened.

The only thing I'm discounting was the notion that the near 30 minutes she talked about as being normal and the disorganized searching through her bag. Both of which I don't discount can't happen, but regulation wise with someone that's not relatively new to the job SHOULDN'T happen. But everything else...yeah, she's pretty much spot on and I'm not trying to discount it. What I was doing was attempting to give likely reasons why certain things that were odd or a bit off from the standard was occuring, and since you said it mirrored your experience, explain to you what "Secondary" screening is as opposed to "primary" screening which is the standard xray/metal detector procedure.

Ahhhh OK. Well it took me 20 to 30 Min's as well. Like I said though it was because they were being careful with my stuff, so I did not mind. The TSA was very polite and helpful. Not his fault the rule in my opinion is overbearing.

I don't know about the secondary stuff as I heard nothing about that. I was kind of upset at first the way they shuffled me off like some kind of criminal, but again not their fault. They were just doing what they were told.
 
prisonplanet and infowars.

Stop the presses. Maybe next we'll get a link to a guys cousins friends account on their local message board.
Would you settle for the New York Times via Yahoo?

Opt Out of a Body Scan? Then Brace Yourself

As of Monday afternoon, the agency had not responded to several requests for comment on this. Last week, the agency did tell me that there were 317 of the advanced imaging technology machines now in use at 65 airports around the country.

About 500 should be online by the end of the year, the agency said, and another 500 are expected to be installed next year. Ultimately, the agency plans to have the new machines replace metal detectors at all of the roughly 2,000 airport checkpoints.

Meanwhile, both passengers and security screeners are making accommodations, and I acknowledge, change is a challenge. But hey, security folks, could we please start communicating better about the procedures, preferably without shouting or insulting our intelligence?

Unless you live way inside the liberal bubble, I'm pretty sure everyone over the age of 25 has run across at least one Napoleon wannabe with "authority issues" who takes him/herself much too seriously. Usually it's a high school teacher or a traffic cop or maybe someone at the DMV, but almost always someone in government where they are insulated from the need for public approval. In any low-paying, high turnover, dead end job like TSA screener, there are bound to be some employees who simply should not be around the public and incidents as described in the OP are going to happen.

If the traveling public does not speak up in protest, we are on our way to 1984.
 
Of course you're going to run into idiots that are authoratitive.

Guess what, I traveled prior to 2001 and ... amazingly ... airport security people were stern and generally rude. Note, this was before the TSA or the federal government running it.

Shocker I know.

And the NYT's story is far different than the info war story that's proclaiming sexual assault.
 
I also traveled prior to 2001, and agree with your assessment. Would you agree that since 2001 the screening has become a *great* deal more intrusive? Do you think it's appropriate for these "stern and rude" people to grope children? Or adults, for that matter?

Why is a virtual strip search permissible, while profiling is not?
 
TSA Groping Out Of Control carries the flag a bit further.
This is not just "disgruntled" or "rude" behavior, although I am sure there is more than a fair share of that also.

Important question: Is Heathrow an American airport? Read your damn article.

Here's the answer: No. Heathrow is not an American airport, and it is not screened by TSA agents. These were BRITISH SECURITY OFFICERS.

Could you get your airports straight, please? Stop bagging on TSA for something a brit did.
 
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I also traveled prior to 2001, and agree with your assessment. Would you agree that since 2001 the screening has become a *great* deal more intrusive?

Not really, no. There are additional things that travelers have to do, such as limiting the size of bottles of liquids and gels, and removing shoes. I don't consider these two actions that onerous, though.

Do you think it's appropriate for these "stern and rude" people to grope children? Or adults, for that matter?

You're a long ways from proving that "groping" happens, much less that it is routine. I'm guessing you've never been searched by law enforcement. That's going to be a huge culture shock for you, when you are.

Why is a virtual strip search permissible

Virtual strip search is hyperbole. It's an x-ray image that isn't particularly exciting. And guess what? I'd RATHER have an electronic scan than a pat-down. It's much less invasive.

I was visually searched in DCA last week. I could hear the officers fapping while I walked away.

/sarcasm

Wait. I should be careful. Next thing I know, you'll be taking my sarcastic statement as a complaint and using it on some other bulletin board to demean the TSA again.

while profiling is not?

So, you think profiling should be legal? What should we be looking for?

Question: When did you fly last, Diogenes?
 
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I also traveled prior to 2001, and agree with your assessment. Would you agree that since 2001 the screening has become a *great* deal more intrusive? Do you think it's appropriate for these "stern and rude" people to grope children? Or adults, for that matter?

Why is a virtual strip search permissible, while profiling is not?

I would suggest you've got a strange idea of "groping" in the way that you're IMPLYING it to mean.
 
You're a long ways from proving that "groping" happens, much less that it is routine. I'm guessing you've never been searched by law enforcement. .

I have, and compared to what is being reported about the TSA's patdown, it was NOTHING like that.

Checkmate.


Virtual strip search is hyperbole. It's an x-ray image that isn't particularly exciting. And guess what? I'd RATHER have an electronic scan than a pat-down. It's much less invasive.

Really? And what proof do you have for that? The TSA's publically released images, being nothing near full size/resolution and very clearly altered for public consumption? When the TSA shows FULL resolution, FULL size, UNALTERED images that show something contrary to what TSOs have reported so faer, then I'll believe you. So far, the TSA has systematically REFUSED to give us the real view of what is being shown.

And how in bloody hell is a non-law-enforcement seeing an ex-ray, being neither cop nor medical professional NOT invasive, especially when a COP can't legally do that barring extremely extremely controlled, extremely extremely limited circumstances for which he or she was PROPERLY trained?



I was visually searched in DCA last week. I could hear the officers fapping while I walked away.

/sarcasm

Your blatant dismissal of the serious implications the body imaging technology, especially when in the hands of the competence questionable TSA, makes it hard to believe you want an honest debate when it comes to the very real privacy issues associated with it.

Wait. I should be careful. Next thing I know, you'll be taking my sarcastic statement as a complaint and using it on some other bulletin board to demean the TSA again.

Strawmen and ad hoc, is this really the best argument in defense of the TSA and the body imaging technology? :doh



So, you think profiling should be legal? What should we be looking for?
This I agree on - profiling is not a very good alternative because of the unknowns in regards of what to look for - if you create a stereotype to base whom you profile on you'll end up missing the crafty - as in those who see the flaw and pass through the workaround with ease - and pissing off a lot of people in the process.
 
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I guess there really are some travelers who don't mind...

YouTube - Best Bob Hope movie line

May I conclude that you are both calling the woman in the OP a liar?

Your posts are inflammatory, hyperbolic, and riddled with errors. Is it too much to ask that you defend your opinions with credible sources? Clearly, it is.

Carry on. Your failure to prove your ridiculous claims are duly noted.
 
Important question: Is Heathrow an American airport? Read your damn article.

Here's the answer: No. Heathrow is not an American airport, and it is not screened by TSA agents. These were BRITISH SECURITY OFFICERS.

Could you get your airports straight, please? Stop bagging on TSA for something a brit did.

Would you consider reading the rest of the article? I've been through Heathrow and I'm well aware of where it is located.

Your faith in the integrity of TSA personnel is touching, but I really don't understand why you are so eager to dismiss any claims of wrongdoing on their part. If you have any points or arguments to make, I'll be glad to read them; otherwise, have a nice day.
 
I have, and compared to what is being reported about the TSA's patdown, it was NOTHING like that.

Checkmate.

I call bull****. Clearly, you didn't get the special search with the latex glove. But I can help you with that, if you'd like. I just need your name and location.

Really? And what proof do you have for that? The TSA's publically released images, being nothing near full size/resolution and very clearly altered for public consumption? When the TSA shows FULL resolution, FULL size, UNALTERED images that show something contrary to what TSOs have reported so faer, then I'll believe you. So far, the TSA has systematically REFUSED to give us the real view of what is being shown.
I have my ways. It ain't all that, bro. But hey, get your panties in a wad. For all we know, it's pleasurable to give yourself a wedgie.

And how in bloody hell is a non-law-enforcement seeing an ex-ray, being neither cop nor medical professional NOT invasive, especially when a COP can't legally do that barring extremely extremely controlled, extremely extremely limited circumstances for which he or she was PROPERLY trained?

Well, I don't have any gross bodily abnormalities, and I do have spectacular tits. I guess I'm not sensitive about it.

Your blatant dismissal of the serious implications the body imaging technology, especially when in the hands of the competence questionable TSA, makes it hard to believe you want an honest debate when it comes to the very real privacy issues associated with it.

What serious implications are these? Someone might see my boobies? ZOMG!

Strawmen and ad hoc, is this really the best argument in defense of the TSA and the body imaging technology? :doh

Another strawman. I guess when you're clutching at straws and hysteria, that's really all you've got to grab.


This I agree on - profiling is not a very good alternative because of the unknowns in regards of what to look for - if you create a stereotype to base whom you profile on you'll end up missing the crafty - as in those who see the flaw and pass through the workaround with ease - and pissing off a lot of people in the process.
props.
 
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Your faith in the integrity of TSA personnel is touching, but I really don't understand why you are so eager to dismiss any claims of wrongdoing on their part. If you have any points or arguments to make, I'll be glad to read them; otherwise, have a nice day.

You've provided isolated complaints from disreputable sources. Yeah. I promise to treat that with all the seriousness that it deserves.

When you are able to make a rational argument, I'll give you more credibility.
 
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Drudge does a pretty good job of keeping up with this issue.

From USA Today, Airport screeners get more aggressive with pat-downs.:

From your first article:

"I stood there thinking that this is somewhat humiliating, even though I didn't know all the people around me," says Ashor, an architect from San Diego. "As a woman, it is somewhat unnerving to have someone touching you in these areas in full public view."

The TSA has private screening areas, but Ashor says she doesn't opt to use them to save time.


See, I worked in a police agency. Some detectives I worked with ended up bringing in a gang suspect and placing him in an interview. He wasn't searched thoroughly enough and eventually removed a gun that he'd taped under his testicals and almost shot one of my co-workers.

It's hard to do an accurate body search. If people are carrying metal through metal detectors, what do you recommend that we do to keep weapons and/or other objects off of planes? I'm really interested to hear, Diogenes, since this seems to be a subject that you spend a considerable degree of time thinking about.

Here's what I recommend: Flying isn't a right. If people don't want to submit to the security screening, don't fly. Drive your car or take a train or some other alternate method of transportation.

I have to fly for my job. I don't care if other passengers don't want to be searched. Coming home safe to my kids is my first priority. Everyone on the flight needs to be security screened.

You don't want to be searched? Don't fly.
 
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From your first article:




See, I worked in a police agency. Some detectives I worked with ended up bringing in a gang suspect and placing him in an interview. He wasn't searched thoroughly enough and eventually removed a gun that he'd taped under his testicals and almost shot one of my co-workers.
Metal detectors. Not a cutting edge bit of technology at all airports takes care of that.
You know... even a wand would do the trick and you don't have to touch nutt'in.

Of course plastic guns could wreak havoc.

I think we are going to see perverts start looking to the TSA instead of the church to get some of their jollies. Government sanctioned fondling with all the perks of government to boot!

.
 
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And now even the ACLU is taking notice and has web site to report abuse:
Report Abuse During Passenger Screening in U. S. Airports

CNET reports (Backlash grows over TSA's 'naked strip searches') that TSA has been upgraded from an acronym for "Thousands Standing Around" to "Thousands Squeezing Asses"

Even Reuters has taken notice: Pilots and passengers rail at new airport patdowns

These "enhanced screening procedures" were only started at the end of October; I wonder how long the public will tolerate them.
 
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"Rail" is an interesting word used in the Reuters report.

rail 3 (rl)
intr.v. railed, rail·ing, rails
To express objections or criticisms in bitter, harsh, or abusive language
 
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