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Smokers Beware! Proposed New York City Smoking Ban Targets Outdoor Facilities

Goldenboy219 said:
If i asked you nicely to not smoke around me, and you told me to get the **** out, or lit it up in spite, how is my following action (taking your smoke out of your mouth) any less respectful?
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You've initiated stealing, and thus have engaged in force and violence against another. Their response is justified where as you are the initiating aggressor.
 
Goldenboy219 said:
Perhaps. But i am more than willing and able to take such a risk. Does your right to smoke in public negate my right to be smoke free in public?
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Yes, because of the nature and innate dynamics of a free society; that is necessarily true. Just like someone else's right to bring their dog out in public negates my right to be in an allergen free public. Thems the breaks man, it's called freedom. High time you learn to deal with it.
 
Goldenboy219 said:
Perhaps. But i am more than willing and able to take such a risk. Does your right to smoke in public negate my right to be smoke free in public?
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Both of us can move to separate areas, it is of no consequence.

I hate the smell of diesel vehicles, really hate it.
No one is banning them from the road.
 
Ikari said:
That all depends on where I hide your body. Hahah, but you have no right to snatch someone's property and destroy it. So don't pretend like the pistol whipping is the first move of violence. Your property grab is far more disrespectful and is the initiator of violence.
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How so? It would be just as easy for the smoker to go somewhere else so they are not to bother me. Like i said, i am more than able to take such a risk. When someone disrespects you, do you call the cops or pound them until they piss their pants?
 
Goldenboy219 said:
How so? It would be just as easy for the smoker to go somewhere else so they are not to bother me. Like i said, i am more than able to take such a risk.
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It's easy for YOU to go somewhere else as well.

Goldenboy219 said:
When someone disrespects you, do you call the cops or pound them until they piss their pants?
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I ignore them, no rule against being disrespectful. People are free to be as rude as they want. I won't call the police and I won't engage in physical violence against them unless they initiate physical violence. Just being rude doesn't cut it. As I said, I think it is far more respectful to acknowledge and accept an individual's rights and freedoms than it is to be a snobbish dick to others.
 
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Harry Guerrilla said:
Both of us can move to separate areas, it is of no consequence.
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I think the correct response is: ding ding ding.

I hate the smell of diesel vehicles, really hate it.
No one is banning them from the road.
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High sulfer diesel is actually banned from road use. The point i am trying to make is (and i believe it was made), violence can result from people having no respect for others. Any reasonable rational person, if asked not to smoke in their presence, would go somewhere else.
 
Goldenboy219 said:
If i asked you nicely to not smoke around me, and you told me to get the **** out, or lit it up in spite, how is my following action (taking your smoke out of your mouth) any less respectful?
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1) If you asked me nicely not to smoke around you, I wouldn't. Hell, I had a friend come visit me for a few days once who was allergic to cig smoke. I agreed to air out my home for days prior to her visit and not smoke in my own home during her stay to accomodate her. It was either that, or she stayed in a hotel. I wanted to spend more time with her, so I accomodated her sensitivities. Because she asked nicely. Had she said, "You're a stinky bitch and I aint setting foot in your disgusting smoke filled home unless you air it out and don't smoke in it the entire time I'm there!", I would have told her to stick her visit where the sun don't shine.

2) If we were in an area where you were unable to move out of my vicinity, then you might have an issue even IF I declined your request not to light up. But outdoors? In a public park? Walk the **** away. That's it. That's all that needs to be done. Anything else is only facilitating the disrespect you keep going on about.
 
Ikari said:
It's easy for YOU to go somewhere else as well.
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Why, i am just standing there. You have decided to pollute my area, therefore you should have a bit more respect for my rights.

I ignore them, no rule against being disrespectful. People are free to be as rude as they want. I won't call the police and I won't engage in physical violence against them unless they initiate physical violence. Just being rude doesn't cut it.
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If i was to politely ask you to not smoke in my presence, and your reply was **** you buddy, i guarantee my next reaction would not be respectful. If you cannot handle this, well i guess that's just tough rocks.
 
Goldenboy219 said:
I think the correct response is: ding ding ding.

High sulfer diesel is actually banned from road use. The point i am trying to make is (and i believe it was made), violence can result from people having no respect for others. Any reasonable rational person, if asked not to smoke in their presence, would go somewhere else.
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I'm talking about regular diesel vehicles.
They are all over the main road I use to go to work, shopping, everywhere.
They smell horrible and actually make me a bit light headed.

Banning whole places from one activity, isn't the same as going to separate places on the same area.

What about peanut products, some people get severe allergic reactions just from air particles?
Should those also be banned in public places?
 
rivrrat said:
1) If you asked me nicely not to smoke around you, I wouldn't. Hell, I had a friend come visit me for a few days once who was allergic to cig smoke. I agreed to air out my home for days prior to her visit and not smoke in my own home during her stay to accomodate her. It was either that, or she stayed in a hotel. I wanted to spend more time with her, so I accomodated her sensitivities. Because she asked nicely. Had she said, "You're a stinky bitch and I aint setting foot in your disgusting smoke filled home unless you air it out and don't smoke in it the entire time I'm there!", I would have told her to stick her visit where the sun don't shine.
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Agreed.

2) If we were in an area where you were unable to move out of my vicinity, then you might have an issue even IF I declined your request not to light up. But outdoors? In a public park? Walk the **** away. That's it. That's all that needs to be done. Anything else is only facilitating the disrespect you keep going on about.
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Why do you believe that smoking in front of others is so special? If you want to **** your lungs up, be my guest. There is simply no reason for you to have to pollute the area i was standing at. With that in mind, if i went to a park with my child (i dont have one) and people were smoking weed/cigarettes/crack at that park, yes i would most likely leave and not ask them to stop.
 
Goldenboy219 said:
Why do you believe that smoking in front of others is so special? If you want to **** your lungs up, be my guest. There is simply no reason for you to have to pollute the area i was standing at. With that in mind, if i went to a park with my child (i dont have one) and people were smoking weed/cigarettes/crack at that park, yes i would most likely leave and not ask them to stop.
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I go to the park and walking trail near my home with my kids regularly.

These people are non smokers and I have to put up with their **** regularly.
Unleashed dogs, dog ****, litter, their nasty obeseness.

I'll pitch a bitch on here but largely I have to deal with their ****ed up crap and actually help clean up the litter.
Why?
Because I'm not a jackass like them.

That's life and screwing around with smokers because of some negligible harm, is wasteful.
 
Harry Guerrilla said:
What about peanut products, some people get severe allergic reactions just from air particles?
Should those also be banned in public places?
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This is where it gets complicated. Smoking is a choice made by an individual that is proven to have a serious negative impact on the health of others. Eating a peanut in someones presence can cause them a severe allergic reaction?
 
Goldenboy219 said:
This is where it gets complicated. Smoking is a choice made by an individual that is proven to have a serious negative impact on the health of others. Eating a peanut in someones presence can cause them a severe allergic reaction?
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Sorry but second hand smoke isn't serious, except if it is repeated over long the term.

A whiff of smoke isn't going to hurt you, pumping gas at the gas station is more likely to have more long term effects.
 
Harry Guerrilla said:
What does Beck have to do with this?
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I assume you were being facetious about banning fat people in the park. But I think Beck was being a bit facitious about fat people, too when he said "let them die."

If Beck wants to smoke cigarettes or be a fatty or wear perfume, of course that is his individual right. Except if smokers or fatties don't have health insurance, then they become a burdon on society and all our insurance rates go up to help pay for their medical costs. And their medical costs far exceed those who don't smoke and aren't obese. Why should we should have to pay for smokers and fatties health care through our private insurance?

Then there is the hypocrisy of those who say they want government to stay out of their personal lives but those same people seem to have no problem wanting government to tell others who they can marry, whether to have abortions, or smoke pot. Do you understand, now?
 
Moot said:
I assume you were being facetious about banning fat people in the park. But I think Beck was being a bit facitious about fat people, too when he said "let them die."

If Beck wants to smoke cigarettes or be a fatty or wear perfume, of course that is his individual right. Except if smokers or fatties don't have health insurance, then they become a burdon on society and all our insurance rates go up to help pay for their medical costs. And their medical costs far exceed those who don't smoke and aren't obese. Why should we should have to pay for smokers and fatties health care through our private insurance?

Then there is the hypocrisy of those who say they want government to stay out of their personal lives but those same people seem to have no problem wanting government to tell others who they can marry, whether to have abortions, or smoke pot. Do you understand, now?
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Sorry but smokers don't cost anyone anything more.
Smokers tend to save people money through increases in taxes and being less burdened by the retirement social welfare system.
 
Harry Guerrilla said:
I go to the park and walking trail near my home with my kids regularly.

These people are non smokers and I have to put up with their **** regularly.
Unleashed dogs, dog ****, litter, their nasty obeseness.

I'll pitch a bitch on here but largely I have to deal with their ****ed up crap and actually help clean up the litter.
Why?
Because I'm not a jackass like them.

That's life and screwing around with smokers because of some negligible harm, is wasteful.
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I do agree that we are often forced to deal with things we deem annoying. However, annoying is not responsible for 400,000+ deaths per year. When one partakes in an activity, they have a personal responsibility to keep the affects associated with it to themselves.


P.S. I want everyone to know that i am not advocating people get violent. It was just a way to prove a point that violence can easily erupt over something as simple as smoking cigarettes.
 
Goldenboy219 said:
Agreed.



Why do you believe that smoking in front of others is so special? If you want to **** your lungs up, be my guest. There is simply no reason for you to have to pollute the area i was standing at. With that in mind, if i went to a park with my child (i dont have one) and people were smoking weed/cigarettes/crack at that park, yes i would most likely leave and not ask them to stop.
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It's not a matter of "smoking in front of others". It's a matter of someone who smokes, happens to be in a public place and chooses to smoke. Same with eating a hotdog, or walking their dog, or running around with screaming children. Do you ask the disgusting sloppy eater why they believe eating in front of others is so special? Geez.

It always pissed me off to no ****ing end when I worked on the river and at lunch, I would walk off - downwind - of everyone and light up. Sure enough, some ****ing guest would decide to come and sit down near me to eat and then get pissy with ME about my smoking near them. Mother ****ing hell. I couldn't tell THEM to **** off because they were guests of my company, but I ****ing hell wanted to. I would go out of my way to stay away from them and they would go out of their way to come near me and bitch about the smoke.

So yeah, if you're in a public area and you see someone smoking, and smoking bothers you... don't ****ing go near them. Why is that so hard for people to get? Why do people think they need the government to do that for them?
 
Goldenboy219 said:
I do agree that we are often forced to deal with things we deem annoying. However, annoying is not responsible for 400,000+ deaths per year. When one partakes in an activity, they have a personal responsibility to keep the affects associated with it to themselves.


P.S. I want everyone to know that i am not advocating people get violent. It was just a way to prove a point that violence can easily erupt over something as simple as smoking cigarettes.
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Don't count on that 400k number to be accurate.
It includes people that would of died, whether or not, they smoked or were around smoke.
 
Harry Guerrilla said:
Sorry but smokers don't cost anyone anything more.
Smokers tend to save people money through increases in taxes and being less burdened by the retirement social welfare system.
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Tobacco related illness is responsible for more than 400,000 deaths per year. The health care costs associated are very much real.
 
Harry Guerrilla said:
Don't count on that 400k number to be accurate.
It includes people that would of died, whether or not, they smoked or were around smoke.
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What would you consider accurate?
 
Goldenboy219 said:
Tobacco related illness is responsible for more than 400,000 deaths per year. The health care costs associated are very much real.
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"If people stopped smoking, there would be a savings in health care costs, but only in the short term. Eventually, smoking cessation would lead to increased health care costs."

MMS: Error
 
rivrrat said:
It's not a matter of "smoking in front of others". It's a matter of someone who smokes, happens to be in a public place and chooses to smoke. Same with eating a hotdog, or walking their dog, or running around with screaming children. Do you ask the disgusting sloppy eater why they believe eating in front of others is so special? Geez.

It always pissed me off to no ****ing end when I worked on the river and at lunch, I would walk off - downwind - of everyone and light up. Sure enough, some ****ing guest would decide to come and sit down near me to eat and then get pissy with ME about my smoking near them. Mother ****ing hell. I couldn't tell THEM to **** off because they were guests of my company, but I ****ing hell wanted to. I would go out of my way to stay away from them and they would go out of their way to come near me and bitch about the smoke.

So yeah, if you're in a public area and you see someone smoking, and smoking bothers you... don't ****ing go near them. Why is that so hard for people to get? Why do people think they need the government to do that for them?
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I agree Riv, but in my made up example (maybe it was not clearly stated as such), i was standing there with my kid and somebody came near us and lit up. Which goes hand in hand with my position that i would not even want to smoke in the direct presence of others. I have never smoked anything in front of my parents, and do not excessivly drink in their pressence as i know it would bother them (im 27). I try to apply this same behavior when i partake in something that i think will be offensive to others.
 
Goldenboy219 said:
What would you consider accurate?
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I really couldn't tell you.
There are several unreported causes of lung cancer and other associated diseases.

Gasoline is carcinogenic, almost all of us pump it into our cars and breathe the fumes over the course of our entire life.
How many smokers with lung cancer had it develop because of that?
No one can answer that because that information is not calculable.
 
Harry Guerrilla said:
"If people stopped smoking, there would be a savings in health care costs, but only in the short term. Eventually, smoking cessation would lead to increased health care costs."

MMS: Error
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LOL, i like your style! With that said, i am not arguing for smoking to be illegal, or even non existant. Only that people take responsibility for their actions. If you are in an area where people are not smoking.... Don't smoke there.
 
I don't smoke weed in public.

Not because i am afraid of getting caught and put in jail (i spent 47 days in cook county jail, probably the biggest hell hole in the nation for a felony assault charge) when i was 21.
 
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