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Oliver Stone: 'Jewish-Dominated Media' Prevents Hitler from Being Portrayed 'in Conte

Re: Oliver Stone: 'Jewish-Dominated Media' Prevents Hitler from Being Portrayed 'in C

Demon of Light said:
White people have the most representation, but in high-ranking positions you find more Jews, at least in the U.S.
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Prove that bull****, I want a peer reviewed research paper using statistical analysis demonstrating that Jews have a disproportional representation in the U.S. for "high ranking representation," in th emedia compared to gentiles. Until then what you are engaging in is nothing using one of the more widely known stereotypes against the Jews, IE "Jews control the media," quite honestly sir I thnk you're either a Nazi or an Islamist.

No. I am suggesting they act exactly the same. This includes acting in favor of your people.
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Congragulations you're a racist, apparently you "look out for your own people," rather than judging people on an individual basis. Why don't you go join a ****ing Volk commune or something?
 
Re: Oliver Stone: 'Jewish-Dominated Media' Prevents Hitler from Being Portrayed 'in C

Demon of Light said:
Actually fascism finds its roots in national syndicalism, which involved organized labor essentially controlling business in a corporatist structure. This is really a form of socialism. The Knight of the Long Knives was actually a purge of the elements of the Nazi party more inclined towards the Socialist portion of National Socialism.
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Bull****, it was a purge of the hierarchy of the SA which the army wanted gone and which posed as a rival power structure to Hitler's SS.
 
Re: Oliver Stone: 'Jewish-Dominated Media' Prevents Hitler from Being Portrayed 'in C

Demon of Light said:
Okey-dokes:



Robert Iger - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



Jeff Zucker - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



Sumner Redstone - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



Arthur Hays Sulzberger - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



Arthur Ochs Sulzberger - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



Eugene Isaac Meyer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



Katharine Weymouth - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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Demon, showing that some of the people in the higher positions of the media and entertainment fields in the United States are from a Jewish background does not base your claim that "Jews control the media".
You are implying here that there is a group of people who are united by their Jewish background and who conspirate together towards the control and management of the news outlets of the United States.

So someone says, but I would think the clear question is whether the Holocaust is being denied and clearly saying it less than 5 but more than 4 is not denying its occurrence or really its severity in all honesty. Why should Raul Hilberg's estimate be the minimum when documents prove he overestimated casualties in some cases?
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So does the definition say. Holocaust Denial is not existing only in its most extreme form, it varies a lot, and the denial and/or minimizing of the numbers of the Jews who have perished in the Holocaust is obviously fitting the term.
Besides that, I believe I have asked for a proof for your claim that there are documents proving his estimate is overestimated.

I'm not talking about mentality.
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Yes, but I was.

Said nothing of a hoax or a conspiracy. It would be absurd to say the Holocaust has not been used to advance political and military agendas.
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Yes, that is how you see it, I've already realized it by now.
You believe it was a political tool used by "the Jews", and not a tragic era that has naturally effected future world decisions.

Actually it said there was no "systematic" use and I noted a reason that would be the case. Wiping out the Slavs, which was a stated motive of Hitler and the Nazis, would have been a much more massive undertaking since the population is so large and distributed across so many countries.
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No, it pretty much stated that "The Gypsies were the only ones to be executed in the gas chambers alongside the Jews".

I would say Hitler is mostly identified with World War II and the Holocaust being a horrific side narrative of the war.
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I would say you're wrong. While the Holocaust identifies with World War II and World War II identifies with the Holocaust, Hitler would always be identified mostly with his plans to exterminate the "lesser races".
 
Re: Oliver Stone: 'Jewish-Dominated Media' Prevents Hitler from Being Portrayed 'in C

of course the media is controlled by jews, thats why this guy had to say this to the.....wait.......:roll:
 
Re: Oliver Stone: 'Jewish-Dominated Media' Prevents Hitler from Being Portrayed 'in C

Agent Ferris said:
Prove that bull****, I want a peer reviewed research paper using statistical analysis demonstrating that Jews have a disproportional representation in the U.S. for "high ranking representation," in th emedia compared to gentiles. Until then what you are engaging in is nothing using one of the more widely known stereotypes against the Jews, IE "Jews control the media," quite honestly sir I thnk you're either a Nazi or an Islamist.
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I actually pretty clearly pointed out how three of the major media companies in this country were run or owned by Jews and how the same applied for two of the most influential newspapers in the U.S. as well. From 1996 to 2009 a Jew was also in charge of Fox, also holding one of the most powerful positions in News Corporation in general, but I decided to only go with current leaders.

Congragulations you're a racist, apparently you "look out for your own people," rather than judging people on an individual basis. Why don't you go join a ****ing Volk commune or something?
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I didn't say I agree with it, only stating it as the reality. Unfortunately, most people do agree with it.

Agent Ferris said:
Bull****, it was a purge of the hierarchy of the SA which the army wanted gone and which posed as a rival power structure to Hitler's SS.
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The SA as a whole was more inclined towards the socialist side of the party.
 
Re: Oliver Stone: 'Jewish-Dominated Media' Prevents Hitler from Being Portrayed 'in C

Dav said:
I'm not exactly sure why you think that. In my experience, Jews are among the most racial-sensitivity-apathetic ethnicities there are (Asians in general rank up there with them). Maybe you're hanging around the wrong Jews.
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If you think asians rank up there in terms of racial sensitivity, you are seriously lacking experience, kid. Asians, especially the Japanese, are some of the most racist people you will ever come across. Just because it's "polite" racism, it doesn't negate the fact that it is still racism.

That does remind me of a story though... about my dad, a Cuban refugee, conversing with one of my mom's Jewish relatives. The relative apparently didn't know where he was from, and for some reason felt compelled to talk about what a great guy Fidel Castro was. My dad just sat and listened, and when the guy was done, started talking about all the great things Hitler did for his people. The relative was pretty horrified :lol:
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I think your dad and I would probably get along great. :lol:
 
Re: Oliver Stone: 'Jewish-Dominated Media' Prevents Hitler from Being Portrayed 'in C

Dav said:
Really? Maybe those instances are just when you notice it, since it seems to evoke the strongest reaction from you. Those instances take up a tiny minority of mentions of the Holocaust... obviously I can't prove that, but I find it extremely hard to believe that it's not true.
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Dav, do a quick search and see how many articles there are about different Jewish coalitions spewing the slur "anti-Semite" at people who said something they got all butthurt about. Hell, do a search here of the word and its variations and see how it gets bounced around followed up with "ZOMGWTF 11111eleventyone11111, you want to cause another HOLOCAUST!!!!!"

The ME forum would be a great place to start.

Nobody cared about the Holocaust before the end of WWII. Few people even knew it was going on.
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That's entirely untrue, Dav. We knew it was going on and people here in the US were speaking out against it. The UK was staunchly against it. Margaret Sanger here in the US, who often gets accused of allying with Nazis because of her stance on eugenics, was writing editorials about how the Nazis were an example of eugenics gone wrong.

But it is true that no one knew the extent of the damage until they liberated the camps.

Jewish refugees around the world were being turned away and forced to go back to get slaughtered. This is exactly the sort of apathy that people are now trying to avoid. Also, WWII itself was completely unrelated to the Holocaust, except for the fact that the Holocaust was put to a stop as a side effect of it.
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Wait...either it was the legacy of Hitler (and WW2 was entirely about Hitler on the European front) or it wasn't. Which is it? Is it just that WW2 is about Hitler and his Holocaust when we want to score points for the Jews and not about Hitler and his Holocaust when we want to make some other point? You need to stay consistent.

Every group that suffers any fraction of the amount as the Jews in Europe did try just as hard to "attention whore" their suffering, because that is exactly what they should be doing. The Jews are just the most successful, like I've already said, for reasons I've already said.
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And it's getting old. By the time the story becomes "well my grandma suffered so and so", you have zero credibility in latching onto that suffering to further your own causes. Pick up the pieces and move on because people get sick of hearing about it.
 
Re: Oliver Stone: 'Jewish-Dominated Media' Prevents Hitler from Being Portrayed 'in C

Apocalypse said:
Demon, showing that some of the people in the higher positions of the media and entertainment fields in the United States are from a Jewish background does not base your claim that "Jews control the media".
You are implying here that there is a group of people who are united by their Jewish background and who conspirate together towards the control and management of the news outlets of the United States.
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What? Where the hell are you getting that? If someone said "white people control the media" no one would automatically assume I was talking about some sort of conspiracy.

So does the definition say. Holocaust Denial is not existing only in its most extreme form, it varies a lot, and the denial and/or minimizing of the numbers of the Jews who have perished in the Holocaust is obviously fitting the term.
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How does it fit the term? Denial means suggesting something does not exist.

Besides that, I believe I have asked for a proof for your claim that there are documents proving his estimate is overestimated.
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Sure:

Raul Hilberg gave a figure of 550,000.
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It was a telegram sent by Hermann Hoefle, Operation Reinhard's Chief of Staff, which indicates that 434,508 Jews were killed in Bełżec through December 31, 1942. As the camp had ceased to operate for mass killings by then, this figure needs to be treated as almost absolute.
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Source: Wikipedia

This is focusing just on the camps, as opposed to the figures for deaths in the ghettos and killings by the Einsatzgruppen, which were likely also overstated. Granted I think Hilberg's figures are close, especially as it concerns the camps, but he made these estimates decades ago before some information came to light.

Yes, that is how you see it, I've already realized it by now.
You believe it was a political tool used by "the Jews", and not a tragic era that has naturally effected future world decisions.
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Please stop putting words in my mouth. I didn't limit it misuse to any group and I did not say this in any way diminishes the horrific nature of the event itself.

No, it pretty much stated that "The Gypsies were the only ones to be executed in the gas chambers alongside the Jews".
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It didn't say that and it wouldn't say that because it is wrong. Action T4 was a euthanasia campaign where gas chambers were used. Zyklon B was at the very least tested on Poles and Soviet POWs.
 
Re: Oliver Stone: 'Jewish-Dominated Media' Prevents Hitler from Being Portrayed 'in C

jallman said:
Dav, do a quick search and see how many articles there are about different Jewish coalitions spewing the slur "anti-Semite" at people who said something they got all butthurt about. Hell, do a search here of the word and its variations and see how it gets bounced around followed up with "ZOMGWTF 11111eleventyone11111, you want to cause another HOLOCAUST!!!!!"

The ME forum would be a great place to start.
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I was talking about in life in general, not just places where you'd expect to hear such things.

In my experience, the Holocaust is most often mentioned as a parallel for another, similar instance of genocide. Or just as a go-to example of immense human suffering. Or any number of reasons unrelated to Jews.





Wait...either it was the legacy of Hitler (and WW2 was entirely about Hitler on the European front) or it wasn't. Which is it? Is it just that WW2 is about Hitler and his Holocaust when we want to score points for the Jews and not about Hitler and his Holocaust when we want to make some other point? You need to stay consistent.
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I think you are confusing me for other posters. And either way, this logic is not consistent. WWII can be about Hitler, and the Holocaust can be Hitler's legacy, while the Holocaust can still have little to do with WWII itself; all of this is constent logic. Unless the Holocaust is the only legacy of Hitler, which I never claimed.

And it's getting old. By the time the story becomes "well my grandma suffered so and so", you have zero credibility in latching onto that suffering to further your own causes. Pick up the pieces and move on because people get sick of hearing about it.
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Well for one thing, as I've already said, while you seem to think it's only/mostly invoked by the Jews to "further their own causes", this has almost nothing to do with how mainstream it's become. In fact, I'd bet that Jews make up only a portion of the people today trying hard to make people both know and care about the Holocaust, not to further Jewish interests, but to further humanity's interests.
And so far you are the only person I've heard of who has gotten sick of hearing about it, so that's a trend I have yet to see.
 
Re: Oliver Stone: 'Jewish-Dominated Media' Prevents Hitler from Being Portrayed 'in C

Dav said:
And so far you are the only person I've heard of who has gotten sick of hearing about it, so that's a trend I have yet to see.
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Well we've already established how limited your experience is so I'm not too sure I would be of a mind to accept your seeing a trend or not as evidence (or lack of evidence) of it's existence.
 
Re: Oliver Stone: 'Jewish-Dominated Media' Prevents Hitler from Being Portrayed 'in C

Dav said:
And so far you are the only person I've heard of who has gotten sick of hearing about it, so that's a trend I have yet to see.
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You do get desensitized to the Holocaust.
I don't think there is anything about the Holocaust that can shock when you learn about the holocaust in Primary school for years 5 and 6 and then in Secondary school years 7, 8, 10 and 11. Every year some sort of remembrance ceremony where you learn it for that week.
When the generation who fought and lived during that chapter of history dies, I think some sort of line has to be drawn personally
 
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Re: Oliver Stone: 'Jewish-Dominated Media' Prevents Hitler from Being Portrayed 'in C

Laila said:
When the generation who fought and lived during that chapter of history dies, I think some sort of line has to be drawn personally
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That is precisely what I was trying to say. You just said it much better and succinctly.
 
Re: Oliver Stone: 'Jewish-Dominated Media' Prevents Hitler from Being Portrayed 'in C

I don't have a problem teaching about the Holocaust as much as they do. It's a very dark time in history, and their deaths deserve to be remembered. I'm not sure if this is true or not, but I have heard in some UK schools they don't teach the Holocaust because they fear it may offend Muslim students (for whatever reason, I don't know). The point is that we should still teach about the Holocaust, especially amidst a growing anti-semitic Holocaust denial movement.
 
Re: Oliver Stone: 'Jewish-Dominated Media' Prevents Hitler from Being Portrayed 'in C

digsbe said:
I'm not sure if this is true or not, but I have heard in some UK schools they don't teach the Holocaust because they fear it may offend Muslim students (for whatever reason, I don't know).
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There is no choice of not learning the Holocaust in UK schools.
Muslim or not, you have to sit through the lessons
 
Re: Oliver Stone: 'Jewish-Dominated Media' Prevents Hitler from Being Portrayed 'in C

digsbe said:
I don't have a problem teaching about the Holocaust as much as they do. It's a very dark time in history, and their deaths deserve to be remembered. I'm not sure if this is true or not, but I have heard in some UK schools they don't teach the Holocaust because they fear it may offend Muslim students (for whatever reason, I don't know). The point is that we should still teach about the Holocaust, especially amidst a growing anti-semitic Holocaust denial movement.
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Why do you think people are moving more toward denying the Holocaust?
 
Re: Oliver Stone: 'Jewish-Dominated Media' Prevents Hitler from Being Portrayed 'in C

Laila said:
You do get desensitized to the Holocaust.
I don't think there is anything about the Holocaust that can shock when you learn about the holocaust in Primary school for years 5 and 6 and then in Secondary school years 7, 8, 10 and 11. Every year some sort of remembrance ceremony where you learn it for that week.
When the generation who fought and lived during that chapter of history dies, I think some sort of line has to be drawn personally
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There's a half-hour documentary by Alan Resnais called Night and Fog, which shocked me when I saw it. You do hear about the Holocaust all your life, but a film like that suddenly makes you see that you've barely understood a hint of the reality.

What bothers me is how it's politicized and cynically used to fend off criticism of injustices that are happening right now in the present. If that was Stone's point, he's absolutely right.
 
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Re: Oliver Stone: 'Jewish-Dominated Media' Prevents Hitler from Being Portrayed 'in C

Winston Smith said:
There's a half-hour documentary by Alan Resnais called Night and Fog, which shocked me when I saw it. You do hear about the Holocaust all your life, but a film like that suddenly makes you see that you haven't experienced a hint of the reality.

What bothers me is how it's politicized and cynically used to fend off criticism of injustices that are happening right now in the present. If that was Stone's point, he's absolutely right.
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Exactly. Every time Israel races its tanks up and down Palestinian streets and parks one of their missiles in some Palestinian family's one room hovel, they scream Holocaust as if that makes what they are doing now ok. But it is true, the abused often become monsters themselves...
 
Re: Oliver Stone: 'Jewish-Dominated Media' Prevents Hitler from Being Portrayed 'in C

Winston Smith said:
There's a half-hour documentary by Alan Resnais called Night and Fog, which shocked me when I saw it. You do hear about the Holocaust all your life, but a film like that suddenly makes you see that you've barely understood a hint of the reality.
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Thanks, I'll look for it now to watch.
 
Re: Oliver Stone: 'Jewish-Dominated Media' Prevents Hitler from Being Portrayed 'in C

Laila said:
There is no choice of not learning the Holocaust in UK schools.
Muslim or not, you have to sit through the lessons
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That's good. Everyone should learn about it.
jallman said:
Why do you think people are moving more toward denying the Holocaust?
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I think most people are moving away from the Holocaust because there is a growing anti-semitic and anti-Israeli attitude spawning around the world. Many will believe it because Ahmedinejad openly states that the Holocaust didn't happen. Others because Hamas refuses to teach that it happened and also deny it. Apologists for Iran and Hamas typically don't want to admit that the group they support is insane and racist. Many who hate Israel and the Jews have a hard time accepting that the Jewish race was targeted for extermination by the Nazis and that they suffered one of the worst atrocities committed in human history. However, what I do think is also wrong would be to ignore the other victims. The Nazis targeted homosexuals, Christians (many Christians were sent to death camps for helping Jews, and much of the Polish clergy were killed as well), Gypsies, and other groups. However, the predominant group they targeted and the largest group that was killed was the Jews. If I were to change anything, it would be teaching the Holocaust as we do now, but also mention other groups that the Nazis targeted. However, I do believe Holocaust denial is typically rooted in some anti-Israel or anti-semitic bigotry.
 
Re: Oliver Stone: 'Jewish-Dominated Media' Prevents Hitler from Being Portrayed 'in C

Demon of Light said:
What? Where the hell are you getting that? If someone said "white people control the media" no one would automatically assume I was talking about some sort of conspiracy.
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I nearly fell of my chair.

Saying that a specific ethnicity/race are "controlling the media" is pretty much preaching on a conspiracy theory, you are saying that there are a group of people united by their Jewish background who conspirate together to control and manipulate the media.

How does it fit the term? Denial means suggesting something does not exist.
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As I said that's the definition of the term.
Denial is indeed the refusal to recognize the existence of something, and in this case the existence of the fact that 5-6 million Jews have been systematically excecuted by the Nazis during the Holocaust.

Sure:





Source: Wikipedia


This is focusing just on the camps, as opposed to the figures for deaths in the ghettos and killings by the Einsatzgruppen, which were likely also overstated. Granted I think Hilberg's figures are close, especially as it concerns the camps, but he made these estimates decades ago before some information came to light.
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So he has overestimated the figures of one camp, that doesn't mean that he didn't underestimate the figures on other areas, and you give no further indication of overestimates of his on the rest of the death toll.
Nevertheless the different estimations vary from 5.1 million to 5.9 million, and the generally accepted figure by historians was and is 5.9 million, and not Raul's figure of 5.1 million.

It didn't say that
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It said systematically, yes, but all those who were killed in the gas chambers were executed systematically, so I don't see your point.
 
Re: Oliver Stone: 'Jewish-Dominated Media' Prevents Hitler from Being Portrayed 'in C

I still see older people in Israel with the tattoos on their arms. The lucky one’s perhaps? Perhaps not. They were not people, merely numbers to be crunched in Hitler’s death camps. I lost over 200 of my extended family to the Einsatzgruppen. You’ve all seen the grainy black and white pictures of them. Row upon row of naked men, women, and children being machine gunned into mass pits. Ukraine is chock full of elevated mounds which mark the pits. You see, gasses released by decomposing bodies cause the earth to swell and rise.

I never bring up the Holocaust on this board. I’ll sometimes respond with a post in an existing thread such as this. I don’t beat anyone over the head about it, and neither do any of the other Jews on this board. But I do get highly annoyed at those who expect me to shutty-uppy because it didn’t effect them or theirs and they are tired of hearing about it. Well too bad. It’s a dark passage in human history and I hope and pray that it’s-like never befalls any of you or anyone else for that matter. And the best way to accomplish this mercy is to never forget the horrible roads we have traveled. Armenia, Nazi Germany, Cambodia, Bosnia, Rwanda, Sudan...
 
Re: Oliver Stone: 'Jewish-Dominated Media' Prevents Hitler from Being Portrayed 'in C

Honestly, I have never personally heard a pro-Israel Jew bring up the Holocaust in order to justify military actions. They usually argue that it is a national security issue (which it is). I'm not Jewish, but I am pro-Israel and I don't use the Holocaust as a straw man to justify what Israel may do. I hold my beliefs because I recognize that Israel is only protecting themselves or enforcing their laws.

On the flip side, the largest abusers the Holocaust are the Palestinians and those who support them. I can't tell you how many times they cry and talk about how there is a Palestinian Holocaust, or how Gaza is a concentration camp. They compare Jews to Nazis and the Palestinians to the murdered Jews.
 
Re: Oliver Stone: 'Jewish-Dominated Media' Prevents Hitler from Being Portrayed 'in C

digsbe said:
I think most people are moving away from the Holocaust because there is a growing anti-semitic and anti-Israeli attitude spawning around the world. Many will believe it because Ahmedinejad openly states that the Holocaust didn't happen. Others because Hamas refuses to teach that it happened and also deny it. Apologists for Iran and Hamas typically don't want to admit that the group they support is insane and racist.
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Totally agree with you on this one. It does stand to mention that there is a huge distinction between bat**** crazy holocaust denial, a la Ahmedemontard, and those who study the event in detail looking for discrepancies between the hype and what actually can be proven. In fact, I don't consider a healthy skepticism to be actual holocaust denial but clearly, from reading this thread, others are quick to say otherwise.

Many who hate Israel and the Jews have a hard time accepting that the Jewish race was targeted for extermination by the Nazis and that they suffered one of the worst atrocities committed in human history. However, what I do think is also wrong would be to ignore the other victims. The Nazis targeted homosexuals, Christians (many Christians were sent to death camps for helping Jews, and much of the Polish clergy were killed as well), Gypsies, and other groups. However, the predominant group they targeted and the largest group that was killed was the Jews. If I were to change anything, it would be teaching the Holocaust as we do now, but also mention other groups that the Nazis targeted. However, I do believe Holocaust denial is typically rooted in some anti-Israel or anti-semitic bigotry.
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I can appreciate that sentiment. I think it's important to talk about all the groups that were slaughtered when it comes to the Holocaust. I guess it just bugs me that the Jews have taken it upon themselves to monopolize an issue that wasn't just about them. I think that insensitivity on their parts adds to the growing anti-Jewish sentiment world wide. And the Israel problem certainly does them no favors either.
 
Re: Oliver Stone: 'Jewish-Dominated Media' Prevents Hitler from Being Portrayed 'in C

digsbe said:
On the flip side, the largest abusers the Holocaust are the Palestinians and those who support them. I can't tell you how many times they cry and talk about how there is a Palestinian Holocaust, or how Gaza is a concentration camp. They compare Jews to Nazis and the Palestinians to the murdered Jews.
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Well, they kinda are...
 
Re: Oliver Stone: 'Jewish-Dominated Media' Prevents Hitler from Being Portrayed 'in C

Shayah said:
I never bring up the Holocaust on this board. I’ll sometimes respond with a post in an existing thread such as this. I don’t beat anyone over the head about it, and neither do any of the other Jews on this board. But I do get highly annoyed at those who expect me to shutty-uppy because it didn’t effect them or theirs and they are tired of hearing about it. Well too bad. It’s a dark passage in human history and I hope and pray that it’s-like never befalls any of you or anyone else for that matter. And the best way to accomplish this mercy is to never forget the horrible roads we have traveled. Armenia, Nazi Germany, Cambodia, Bosnia, Rwanda, Sudan...
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I find it interesting that people believe that by learning about the Holocaust. Humans will be more quick to act against another genocide. There has been genocides after the Holocaust and I still see Europe sitting on its hand. The holocaust teaching has had little impact in that respect.
 
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