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New health insurance requirement.....was a GOP idea

Try a fine. Either way they actually pay and not opt out of paying.

Keep diverting from reality as you simply cannot defend your position. People by the millions are going to opt out and any fine they pay is not going to offset the rise in healthcare costs. Continue to buy what you are being told by an Administration that continues to lie to you.
 
Keep diverting from reality as you simply cannot defend your position. People by the millions are going to opt out and any fine they pay is not going to offset the rise in healthcare costs. Continue to buy what you are being told by an Administration that continues to lie to you.

:confused::confused::confused:

If they do, they'll be paying fines. What will you say if very few choose the fine?
 
:confused::confused::confused:

If they do, they'll be paying fines. What will you say if very few choose the fine?

I won't have to say a word because you won't be around to answer for your support for this POS. This bill does nothing to lower healthcare costs as it doesn't address healthcare costs. people will opt out, pay the fine, and the unhealthy will drive up premiums for the rest of us.
 
I won't have to say a word because you won't be around to answer for your support for this POS. This bill does nothing to lower healthcare costs as it doesn't address healthcare costs. people will opt out, pay the fine, and the unhealthy will drive up premiums for the rest of us.

That's what they are doing now. Where has your outrage been?

We'll see.
 
That's what they are doing now. Where has your outrage been?

We'll see.

My outrage is against a govt. that drives up healthcare costs by not allowing for tort reform, competition across state lines, and promoting a consumer controlled and run healthcare system.

You on the other hand buy what the govt. tells you and ignores the true costs of healthcare.
 
My outrage is against a govt. that drives up healthcare costs by not allowing for tort reform, competition across state lines, and promoting a consumer controlled and run healthcare system.

Other than tort reform, which studies show has little effect on driving up costs, you just described Obamacare. Though the competition across state lines thing isn't as strong as it was in early versions of the bill.
 
My outrage is against a govt. that drives up healthcare costs by not allowing for tort reform, competition across state lines, and promoting a consumer controlled and run healthcare system.

You on the other hand buy what the govt. tells you and ignores the true costs of healthcare.

See what Misterman says above. I'm worried about your understanding here.
 
You should be worried about what has been passed, which I do understand. The govt. is incapable of lowering costs on anything or improving quality.

FOXNews.com - Report: Health Overhaul Will Increase Nation's Tab

You think insuring another 34 million people with a bill that does nothing to lower actual healthcare costs is good for the American people?

From your article:

The report from Medicare's Office of the Actuary carried a disclaimer saying it does not represent the official position of the Obama administration. White House officials have repeatedly complained that such analyses have been too pessimistic and lowball the law's potential to achieve savings.

The report acknowledged that some of the cost-control measures in the bill -- Medicare cuts, a tax on high-cost insurance and a commission to seek ongoing Medicare savings -- could help reduce the rate of cost increases beyond 2020. But it held out little hope for progress in the first decade.

(snip)

The report found that the president's law missed the mark, although not by much. The overhaul will increase national health care spending by $311 billion from 2010-2019, or nine-tenths of 1 percent. To put that in perspective, total health care spending during the decade is estimated to surpass $35 trillion.

Administration officials argue the increase is a bargain price for guaranteeing coverage to 95 percent of Americans. They also point out that the law will decrease the federal deficit by $143 billion over the 10-year period, even if overall health care spending rises.

FOXNews.com - Report: Health Overhaul Will Increase Nation's Tab

Two things: Long term versus short term. If we don nothing, long term is bleak.

Second, cost is only part of the concern. The other is coverage and health.
 
From your article:

The report from Medicare's Office of the Actuary carried a disclaimer saying it does not represent the official position of the Obama administration. White House officials have repeatedly complained that such analyses have been too pessimistic and lowball the law's potential to achieve savings.

The report acknowledged that some of the cost-control measures in the bill -- Medicare cuts, a tax on high-cost insurance and a commission to seek ongoing Medicare savings -- could help reduce the rate of cost increases beyond 2020. But it held out little hope for progress in the first decade.

(snip)

The report found that the president's law missed the mark, although not by much. The overhaul will increase national health care spending by $311 billion from 2010-2019, or nine-tenths of 1 percent. To put that in perspective, total health care spending during the decade is estimated to surpass $35 trillion.

Administration officials argue the increase is a bargain price for guaranteeing coverage to 95 percent of Americans. They also point out that the law will decrease the federal deficit by $143 billion over the 10-year period, even if overall health care spending rises.

FOXNews.com - Report: Health Overhaul Will Increase Nation's Tab

Two things: Long term versus short term. If we don nothing, long term is bleak.

Second, cost is only part of the concern. The other is coverage and health.

Interesting how agencies cannot predict current costs are in your world better at predicting future costs. You want so badly to buy what you are told about reducing costs yet ignore basic logic and common sense. Why such passion for this POS legislation that is going to cost trillions, money that has to be borrowed and does nothing to actually lower costs or improve quality. A good first step that costs trillions should do a better job than this one.

You claim you have insurance so tell me why this is such an issue for you since 90% of this country also has insurance?
 
Interesting how agencies cannot predict current costs are in your world better at predicting future costs. You want so badly to buy what you are told about reducing costs yet ignore basic logic and common sense. Why such passion for this POS legislation that is going to cost trillions, money that has to be borrowed and does nothing to actually lower costs or improve quality. A good first step that costs trillions should do a better job than this one.

You claim you have insurance so tell me why this is such an issue for you since 90% of this country also has insurance?

Note the term "From your article".
 
Interesting how agencies cannot predict current costs are in your world better at predicting future costs. You want so badly to buy what you are told about reducing costs yet ignore basic logic and common sense. Why such passion for this POS legislation that is going to cost trillions, money that has to be borrowed and does nothing to actually lower costs or improve quality. A good first step that costs trillions should do a better job than this one.

You claim you have insurance so tell me why this is such an issue for you since 90% of this country also has insurance?


Re-read my post.
 
You think insuring another 34 million people with a bill that does nothing to lower actual healthcare costs is good for the American people?

Yes. It means we will still get our public option in a few years.
 
I quite agree. Which is why I find objection to reform so befuddling.

All you ever care about is what YOU pay not what the taxpayer has to pay or fund. The true cost of healthcare will never be reduced until you define and address them. That doesn't matter to you, does it? As is typical with most liberals you love bigger govt. that has yet to solve a social problem. You support a President who has yet to be accurate on any prediction. Debt doesn't matter to you because you don't understand it. Keep spouting rhetoric and ignoring reality.
 
Yes. It means we will still get our public option in a few years.

Now won't that be just wonderful? Don't you have an concept of history or reality? Like far too many personal responsibility doesn't resonate in your world and I am sure like many this is about someone else not you. If you truly cared so much about someone else, you wouldn't be supporting a party that keeps people dependent and has to use victims.

Everytime I see people like you posting comments promoting the Public Option, I always remember Glenn Beck's book, Arguing with Idiots. Nothing is ever going to change your mind and no matter how unsuccessful govt. is in solving social problems, arrogance prevails and liberals promote another group throwing money at the problem.
 
Other than tort reform, which studies show has little effect on driving up costs, you just described Obamacare. Though the competition across state lines thing isn't as strong as it was in early versions of the bill.

Legal costs and settlements are part of the cost of healthcare just as state and federal regulations that prevent competition as well as a tax structure that affects prices. None of that is addressed in this bill. Show me where tort reform was addressed in the Obama bill?
 
All you ever care about is what YOU pay not what the taxpayer has to pay or fund. The true cost of healthcare will never be reduced until you define and address them. That doesn't matter to you, does it? As is typical with most liberals you love bigger govt. that has yet to solve a social problem. You support a President who has yet to be accurate on any prediction. Debt doesn't matter to you because you don't understand it. Keep spouting rhetoric and ignoring reality.

We're all paying before reform. You don't seem to mind paying now. Are you not understanding my point?
 
We're all paying before reform. You don't seem to mind paying now. Are you not understanding my point?

I do indeed understand your point but this bill solves none of that and adds more that the taxpayer will have to cover. The fines for those that do not purchase healthcare do not offset the costs of healthcare for the new individuals covered, most of whom have preexisting conditions that are most costly. Don't you understand that?
 
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