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Boy Scouts of America Keep Secret Dossier on Extensive Sex Abuses

ADK_Forever said:
That may seem obvious but, it does not mean any particular God. Seriously. Their view is as long as you believe in any God. They don't care if your God is Budha. Really.
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Now YOU'RE being disingenuous. We all know and understand what god, just like when the Senate Chaplin gives his "nonsectarian" prayer. We know what god is referred to on our money and in our pledge.

To pretend that the Word's/Phrase's origin is not rooted in Christianity is purely disingenuous. We may WANT it to be nonsectarian but we do know the truth. Do we not?
 
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NoJingoLingo said:
Now YOU'RE being disingenuous. We all know and understand what god, just like when the Senate Chaplin gives his "nonsectarian" prayer. We know what god is referred to on our money and in our pledge.

To pretend that the Word's/Phrase's origin is not rooted in Christianity is purely disingenuous. We may WANT it to be nonsectarian but we do know the truth. Do we not?
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Please show evidence of this "truth" or you're just pulling stuff out of your ass.
 
NoJingoLingo said:
Yeah, now show us when each of those badges were first introduced/available to all Scouts. I doubt you'd be able to track it all down but I ASSURE you they were added LONG after the BSA was formed.
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So what? As kids came along, with new religions, BSA added those badges. What's your point?

BSA should be secular.
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Show me how it's not.
 
NoJingoLingo said:
Now YOU'RE being disingenuous. We all know and understand what god, just like when the Senate Chaplin gives his "nonsectarian" prayer. We know what god is referred to on our money and in our pledge.

To pretend that the Word's/Phrase's origin is not rooted in Christianity is purely disingenuous. We may WANT it to be nonsectarian but we do know the truth. Do we not?
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I never said it wasn't "rooted in Christianity". Obviously it is. My point is that BSA does not "teach" or "preach" religion. The LDS units I believe treat this different.
 
UtahBill said:
Sounds like a big lie to me, got links or evidence?
My experience with LDS and BSA is that the LDS like the BSA program enough to make use of it, and support it, but in no way controls it. It may seen so in Utah, where the majority is LDS, but it just isn't so.
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I'm not here pushing a BSA agenda. It wouldn't take long to Google it. I suspect whatever source I linked to you would have a problem with.

I'm in New York.

Other christian churches who don't like LDS make up their own form of BSA, like the "Royal Rangers".
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This certainly happens.
 
NoJingoLingo said:
Yeah, now show us when each of those badges were first introduced/available to all Scouts. I doubt you'd be able to track it all down but I ASSURE you they were added LONG after the BSA was formed.

BSA should be secular.
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The BSA has a right to be whatever it wants to be, not what you wish it to be. It's a private organization.
 
NoJingoLingo said:
Thanks for that info. Although, isn't the Scouts credo:
On my honor, I will do my best
To do my duty to God and my country and to obey the Scout Law;
To help other people at all times;
To keep myself physically strong, mentally awake and morally straight.

I think we all know which god... same one on our money and in the pledge. ;)
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What's your point, you still have said anything that contradicts ADK's post.
 
American said:
What's your point, you still have said anything that contradicts ADK's post.
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Please stop agreeing with me and supporting me. I'm tired of ducking expected ice balls from hell.

A friend in Scouting is a friend indeed. :cheers:
 
ADK_Forever said:
I'm not here pushing a BSA agenda. It wouldn't take long to Google it. I suspect whatever source I linked to you would have a problem with.
I'm in New York.



This certainly happens.
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So you are outing yourself as a mormon hater, I got that much immediately.
If you are going to make such charges, you should be prepared to back them up with some facts....
 
UtahBill said:
So you are outing yourself as a mormon hater, I got that much immediately.
If you are going to make such charges, you should be prepared to back them up with some facts....
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And just where the hell do you get that I'm a "Mormon hater"? Holy ****, Batman! Maybe you're looking in the mirror? :doh
 
ADK_Forever said:
And just where the hell do you get that I'm a "Mormon hater"? Holy ****, Batman! Maybe you're looking in the mirror? :doh
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You said that the BSA doesn't do anything without LDS approval, or words to that affect.
Question is, why do you think this?
My involvement with BSA as a Baptist, and as a Mormon, leads me to believe that you are very wrong in your opinion.
The BSA is a good program, and the LDS supports it and makes use of it, as does many other religions, and it could be that some financial support was withheld over some issue in the past, but that is hardly enough to suggest that the LDS routinely controls the BSA.
Making such a suggestion indicates that you have some kind of problem with the LDS.
If I am wrong, I apologize. If you are not making yourself clear on the issue, perhaps you should make a greater effort to explain your words....
 
UtahBill said:
You said that the BSA doesn't do anything without LDS approval, or words to that affect.
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And that makes you think I hate the Mormons?

I may hate LDS' unashamed discrimination and its aggressive campaign against gays but, I assure you I hate no Mormons.

Question is, why do you think this?
My involvement with BSA as a Baptist, and as a Mormon, leads me to believe that you are very wrong in your opinion.
The BSA is a good program, and the LDS supports it and makes use of it, as does many other religions, and it could be that some financial support was withheld over some issue in the past, but that is hardly enough to suggest that the LDS routinely controls the BSA.
Making such a suggestion indicates that you have some kind of problem with the LDS.
If I am wrong, I apologize. If you are not making yourself clear on the issue, perhaps you should make a greater effort to explain your words....
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Perhaps you should read all of my posts in this thread. I believe I have been crystal clear. Not only have I supported BSA programs, if not the politics it allows to control it, I have not attacked LDS. I was only pointing out the fact that LDS controls BSA. Without their money BSA would fold. BSA knows this. LDS knows this. LDS holds this constant threat over the neck of BSA to mold it the way it wishes, sometimes going against the ideals of Baden-Powell.

If you're a Mormon and you are not aware of this relationship then maybe you're just not that into what goes on behind the scenes at BSA. No biggee. But remember, just because you're not aware of this relationship does not mean it doesn't exist.

I wasn't intending to get into an LDS bashing debate. Like I said, do your own research see for yourself.
 
ADK_Forever said:
And that makes you think I hate the Mormons?

I may hate LDS' unashamed discrimination and its aggressive campaign against gays but, I assure you I hate no Mormons.



Perhaps you should read all of my posts in this thread. I believe I have been crystal clear. Not only have I supported BSA programs, if not the politics it allows to control it, I have not attacked LDS. I was only pointing out the fact that LDS controls BSA. Without their money BSA would fold. BSA knows this. LDS knows this. LDS holds this constant threat over the neck of BSA to mold it the way it wishes, sometimes going against the ideals of Baden-Powell.

If you're a Mormon and you are not aware of this relationship then maybe you're just not that into what goes on behind the scenes at BSA. No biggee. But remember, just because you're not aware of this relationship does not mean it doesn't exist.

I wasn't intending to get into an LDS bashing debate. Like I said, do your own research see for yourself.
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This has all been covered before. There were catholic, protestant, and even black voters who helped the LDS discriminate against gays in the prop. 8 issue, and issue that should never have been put to a vote, an issue that is clearly one that must be decided in the courts. The gays in CA and UT vandalized LDS church property, in a display of THEIR tolerance.....
How is it that you know what happens behind the scenes regarding the BSA and the LDS? Just because you believe it to exist doesn't mean it does....
You are stating an opinion with no facts in evidence, and expect others to do research to refute it. YOU made the claim, YOU find the proof.....that is how it works.....
 
American said:
The BSA has a right to be whatever it wants to be, not what you wish it to be. It's a private organization.
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Hey thanks for that, Mr Obvious. I thought it was clear that it was my opinion.
 
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