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Nearly 50 percent of doctors ready to quit medicine if Healthcare bill passes

Catawba said:
Interesting how you either unintentionally, or purposefully, misread the survey results. Notice the keyword I highlighted?

"46.3% of primary care physicians (family medicine and internal medicine) feel that the passing of health reform will either force them out of medicine or make them want to leave medicine."

And you have heard the HCR already passed didn't you?

Where is the mass exodus from the practice?

Where are the death panels?
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Where is your logic and common sense. There is a doctor shortage now so what is it in this bill that creates more doctors. Interesting how you focus on specific words but ignore specific actions. Nothing is going to change your mind, you got what you voted for, now too bad the rest of us have to pay for it.

Noticed how you ignore anything that refutes your opinions.

A damning health care report generated by actuaries at the Health and Human Services (HHS) Department was given to HHS Secretary Kathleen Sebelius more than a week before the health care vote. She hid the report from the public until a month after democrats rammed their nationalized health care bill through Congress.

The results from the report were troubling. The report released by Medicare and Medicaid actuaries shows that medical costs will skyrocket rising $389 billion 10 years. 14 million will lose their employer-based coverage. Millions of Americans will be left without insurance. And, millions more may be dumped into the already overwhelmed Medicaid system. 4 million American families will be hit with tax penalties under this new law.

Of course, these were ALL things that President Obama and Democratic leaders assured us would not happen
 
Conservative said:
Where is your logic and common sense. There is a doctor shortage now so what is it in this bill that creates more doctors. Interesting how you focus on specific words but ignore specific actions. Nothing is going to change your mind, you got what you voted for, now too bad the rest of us have to pay for it.
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That's the way a Democracy works. When the Republicans are in office, we have to endure the government helping the upper classes at the expense of the middle classes and lower classes, and when the Democrats are in office the Republicans have to endure the government helping the middle and lower classes at the expense of the upper classes.

They both spend the same amount of money they just have different priorities for some of the spending.


A damning health care report generated by actuaries at the Health and Human Services (HHS) Department was given to HHS Secretary Kathleen Sebelius more than a week before the health care vote. She hid the report from the public until a month after democrats rammed their nationalized health care bill through Congress.
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I can see why you did not provide any links to hate radio's newest talking point/myth.

From the horses mouth that disproves the report was hidden:

The Chief Medicare Actuary, Richard Foster, called "completely inaccurate" a report that the Department of Health and Human Services buried a report on Health Care in the days before a crucial vote. "Consistent with the Office of the Actuary’s longstanding independent role on behalf of Congress, we did not seek approval or clearance from HHS (or anyone else) before issuing our analysis,"

Actuary denies delaying report - Health Care News
 
Partisan said:
Idle threats from all but the ones who should have retired already or fleeced the public enough to be able to afford to retire.....;)
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This tops the Moronomatic meter.

And what person would go to school for years only to have the Government dictate how much you can make?
Germany has got their MD costs down to about 10% of the US.
Government mandated cost control. MD's are wards of the state. A cost to control. It's why their best are leaving. The funny thing is the taxpayers pay to educate the Doc's, then they piss off to other countries. Beautiful... just beautiful.

May you, in your hour of need have no Dr. to fleece your ass.

You know what?
I think Libs should have their own kind of medical care.
They can have the cheap MD's.
These Docs only go to school for 2 or 3 years; part-time. They have basic instruments like in the Russian countryside.
You know. Scalpel, scissors, needle, thread, thermometer and alcohol.
It's cheap, and the decision making process is fast.

Come to think of it, Kanuckistan isn't too far from this system. Their equipment is old and the state isn't keen to invest in new technology. It's why they have waiting lists that rival the 'ol USSR. It's why Orange County, CA has more cardiac units than all of Kanuckistan. It's why major cities (Edmundchuck and Calgaristan) can't handle a half way complicated birth and need to send the family to the nearest US village.

BTW: These Lib Doc's will also be exempt from any and all liabilities. No suing for malpractice because it increases costs. It would take money away from the purchase of scissors and scalpels.

Let's just say you get what you pay for.

ObamaKare is going to inflict great damage, as it has done in England, Germany, France and Kanuckistan. The first folks to get it in the teeth once the decay sets in is the Kanuckistani's. They used the US system as a safety net when their scissors and scalpel kare failed. Now? (Hey Hosehead, we need more pine boxes... eh?)

.
 
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Catawba said:
That's the way a Democracy works. When the Republicans are in office, we have to endure the government helping the upper classes at the expense of the middle classes and lower classes, and when the Democrats are in office the Republicans have to endure the government helping the middle and lower classes at the expense of the upper classes.

They both spend the same amount of money they just have different priorities for some of the spending.




I can see why you did not provide any links to hate radio's newest talking point/myth.

From the horses mouth that disproves the report was hidden:

The Chief Medicare Actuary, Richard Foster, called "completely inaccurate" a report that the Department of Health and Human Services buried a report on Health Care in the days before a crucial vote. "Consistent with the Office of the Actuary’s longstanding independent role on behalf of Congress, we did not seek approval or clearance from HHS (or anyone else) before issuing our analysis,"

Actuary denies delaying report - Health Care News
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Was the content of the report including costs for the Healthcare bill a myth too? Seems like there was no delay but there sure was a damning cost in the report when it was released. How about the cost?
 
zimmer said:
You know what?
I think Libs should have their own kind of medical care.
They can have the cheap MD's.
These Docs only go to school for 2 or 3 years; part-time. They have basic instruments like in the Russian countryside..
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No, those should be conservative doctors - they can work in exchange for chickens.
 
misterman said:
No, those should be conservative doctors - they can work in exchange for chickens.
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Chickens, Euro's, Dollars... who cares, so long as they aren't mandated by government to treat assholes. So long as they retain their liberty.

Assholes... they go to the state run proctologists. They're all Democrats btw, because they are trained by world-class assholes like the collection of Asshole Emeritus' Dr. Frank, Dr. Obama, Dr. Schumer, Rev. Wright, Al Sharpton, Jesse James Jackson, Dr. Pelosi, Dr. Kerry, Dr. Gore, Dr.'s Clinton, Dr. Durbin, Dr. Ried.

Comforting isn't it?

Don't worry, the Dems will have the latest in stainless steel scalpels, scissors, night sticks, needles and sterile thread. As you well know their entry into school isn't by grades, but by the length and thickness of their index fingers. Sorry... for the sorry assholes... No Vasaline. You know, cost control.

.
 
Conservative said:
You are accepting Administration claims that this will cut costs when logic and common sense based upon the details in the bill and history says differently
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I hope you won't mind that I don't consider you an expert on logic and common sense. I would prefer that you present evidence, which is the basis of logic and sense. ;)
 
zimmer said:
Chickens, Euro's, Dollars... who cares, so long as they aren't mandated by government to treat assholes.
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Who is being mandated to treat anyone?

Assholes... they go to the state run proctologists. They're all Democrats btw, because they are trained by world-class assholes like the collection of Asshole Emeritus' Dr. Frank, Dr. Obama, Dr. Schumer, Rev. Wright, Al Sharpton, Jesse James Jackson, Dr. Pelosi, Dr. Kerry, Dr. Gore, Dr.'s Clinton, Dr. Durbin, Dr. Ried.
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I think you might need a psychiatrist to deal with your anger. Maybe you can pay him in chickens.
 
Boo Radley said:
I hope you won't mind that I don't consider you an expert on logic and common sense. I would prefer that you present evidence, which is the basis of logic and sense. ;)
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No problem, as long as you don't expect me to consider you an expert on business, economics, or healthcare.
 
Conservative said:
No problem, as long as you don't expect me to consider you an expert on business, economics, or healthcare.
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Don't present myself as one. I actually link to others who are. ;)
 
Boo Radley said:
Don't present myself as one. I actually link to others who are. ;)
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You link to others that you want to believe and ignore those who are also experts but are on the other side of the issue.
 
Conservative said:
You link to others that you want to believe and ignore those who are also experts but are on the other side of the issue.
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Wow! And how is this different than you and others? Fact is we link people who know something about it. We often use competing opinions by experts when such exist. And in doing so, neither side is partisan, ignorant, or any other such nonsense. ;)
 
Boo Radley said:
Wow! And how is this different than you and others? Fact is we link people who know something about it. We often use competing opinions by experts when such exist. And in doing so, neither side is partisan, ignorant, or any other such nonsense. ;)
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Difference is I use history and actual numbers from history to support my point of view. You totally ignore actual numbers and buy projections from sources who have never been accurate that far out. Apparently you don't see the difference.
 
Conservative said:
Difference is I use history and actual numbers from history to support my point of view. You totally ignore actual numbers and buy projections from sources who have never been accurate that far out. Apparently you don't see the difference.
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I know you think well of what you use, but you really pay attention to the wrong things and make broad generalizations based on the information. This is not valid no matter who does it.
 
Boo Radley said:
I know you think well of what you use, but you really pay attention to the wrong things and make broad generalizations based on the information. This is not valid no matter who does it.
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If you have better numbers than the Bureau of Economic Analysis, the Bureau of Labor Statistics, and the U.S. Treasury Dept. which is the checkbook of the United States then please offer up those sources.

You posted that the CBO scored the healthcare bill and stated it would cut the deficit in 20 years. Never has CBO been correct that far out nor are they correct past 2 years out yet you still hang on those projections.

Somehow I believe your ideology prevents you from actually objectively looking at historical data and results and that is a huge mistake on your part.
 
Conservative said:
If you have better numbers than the Bureau of Economic Analysis, the Bureau of Labor Statistics, and the U.S. Treasury Dept. which is the checkbook of the United States then please offer up those sources.

You posted that the CBO scored the healthcare bill and stated it would cut the deficit in 20 years. Never has CBO been correct that far out nor are they correct past 2 years out yet you still hang on those projections.

Somehow I believe your ideology prevents you from actually objectively looking at historical data and results and that is a huge mistake on your part.
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Those numbers you present don't tell us what we need to know. Nor do they make your generalizations accurate.

And the CBO is the best predictive numbers we have. No one claims them to be perfect, or that they won't be adjusted as time goes on and new information is added.
 
Boo Radley said:
Those numbers you present don't tell us what we need to know. Nor do they make your generalizations accurate.

And the CBO is the best predictive numbers we have. No one claims them to be perfect, or that they won't be adjusted as time goes on and new information is added.
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So no answer. Tell me why actual numbers don't tell "us" what we need to know? Who is us?

The numbers posted tell us what happened regardless how you spin it. CBO makes predictions. What is the accuracy of the CBO or does it even matter? What is it about an ideology that creates people like you who ignores actual numbers and buys projections that have never been accurate past two years?

Obviously you are having problems reconciling what you have been told vs what actually happened. Wonder if you know what those numbers posted actually mean? Need help reading them? Obviously you need help understanding them. Please seek it.
 
Conservative said:
So no answer. Tell me why actual numbers don't tell "us" what we need to know? Who is us?

The numbers posted tell us what happened regardless how you spin it. CBO makes predictions. What is the accuracy of the CBO or does it even matter? What is it about an ideology that creates people like you who ignores actual numbers and buys projections that have never been accurate past two years?

Obviously you are having problems reconciling what you have been told vs what actually happened. Wonder if you know what those numbers posted actually mean? Need help reading them? Obviously you need help understanding them. Please seek it.
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Because those numbers don't directly relate to the currant program. They cannot tell us what future programs will do, as they are different programs. All programs, both in the private sector and in the public sector rely on projections. It's the way it works.
 
Boo Radley said:
Because those numbers don't directly relate to the currant program. They cannot tell us what future programs will do, as they are different programs. All programs, both in the private sector and in the public sector rely on projections. It's the way it works.
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What they tell you is the history of govt. spending on social programs and the results. Why do you buy what the govt. is telling you now especially this govt.? Do you realize when this healthcare program goes into effect? Did you pay any attention to the CBO report on the Healthcare Bill and how long before it becomes deficit neutral and starts saving money? Think, Boo, you are too smart to sound this foolish. Why do you buy CBO numbers that far out?
 
Conservative said:
What they tell you is the history of govt. spending on social programs and the results. Why do you buy what the govt. is telling you now especially this govt.? Do you realize when this healthcare program goes into effect? Did you pay any attention to the CBO report on the Healthcare Bill and how long before it becomes deficit neutral and starts saving money? Think, Boo, you are too smart to sound this foolish. Why do you buy CBO numbers that far out?
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Not really. It's very limited in what it tells us.

And I know full well when it goes into effect. A program like this can't be pushed quickly. Nor should it be.
 
Boo Radley said:
Not really. It's very limited in what it tells us.

And I know full well when it goes into effect. A program like this can't be pushed quickly. Nor should it be.
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Boo, what is it going to take to get you to understand how much a trillion dollars is and how that is paid for? After someone explains to you how much a trillion dollars is, by the way predictions which you don't agree with say this bill will cost 2.5 trillion, then we need to get you to look at the details of the bill that does absolutely nothing to improve the quality of healthcare or the quantity of doctors and hospitals. Yes, it increases access to the system, but nothing to lower actual costs.

you are betting on projections 20 years out that have never been right that costs will be controlled and this will work. See what happened to the market today because of excessive spending in Greece? Think that cannot happen here?
 
Conservative said:
Boo, what is it going to take to get you to understand how much a trillion dollars is and how that is paid for? After someone explains to you how much a trillion dollars is, by the way predictions which you don't agree with say this bill will cost 2.5 trillion, then we need to get you to look at the details of the bill that does absolutely nothing to improve the quality of healthcare or the quantity of doctors and hospitals. Yes, it increases access to the system, but nothing to lower actual costs.

you are betting on projections 20 years out that have never been right that costs will be controlled and this will work. See what happened to the market today because of excessive spending in Greece? Think that cannot happen here?
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You're mistake is thinking I don't understand. I fully understand how much money is involved, and that there is no chance of bringing down the debt without increasing taxes, cutting spending, and addressing health care, which will require spending before seeing results. Ever hear the saying it takes money to make money?

And what I'm betting on is that this isn't the end of the effort. Nothing is set in stone. We can continue to work to improve the bill even now, after it has passed.
 
Boo Radley said:
You're mistake is thinking I don't understand. I fully understand how much money is involved, and that there is no chance of bringing down the debt without increasing taxes, cutting spending, and addressing health care, which will require spending before seeing results. Ever hear the saying it takes money to make money?

And what I'm betting on is that this isn't the end of the effort. Nothing is set in stone. We can continue to work to improve the bill even now, after it has passed.
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The problem is you have bought into the basic concept that access equals improved quality and that the govt. can do it better. Then you keep saying we can improve the bill. Please give me an example of where that has ever happened with legislation.

This bill is a multi TRILLION dollar POS that as stated many times does nothing to improve quality or quantity yet passed. You are betting with money that you don't have and that is what politicians do so they just print money.
 
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