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U.S. National Debt Tops Debt Limit

PeteEU said:
Funny how there was no outcry by conservatives when Bush was in office and he spent along with his Republican congress, like a drunken sailor.
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I don't know what world you were living in at the time, but conservatives were very pissed about the spending.
 
Taylor said:
I don't know what world you were living in at the time, but conservatives were very pissed about the spending.
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LOL...look at the join date beneath my name. I was here. Conservatives on this board (and in general) were not very pissed about the spending.

Yes, if you look back you may find a few - very few - that expressed concern, but for the vast majority they were extremely apologetic.
 
PeteEU said:
Funny how there was no outcry by conservatives when Bush was in office and he spent along with his Republican congress, like a drunken sailor.

Funny how there was no outcry by conservatives when it was them that were "uping" the debt limit 4 times from 2001 to 2006 and 7 times in total under Bush.

Funny how there was no outcry by conservatives when the US national debt went up 100% in the 8 years of the Bush administration.

Funny how conservatives have no solutions to the problems they at least in a big part caused... yes doing the tired old "tax cuts" bit is not a solution if you keep spending increases.. we knew that before Bush and that was yet again confirmed under Bush.

If you listen to conservatives, you could cure cancer by cutting taxes..
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There are no conservatives left in Washington. Once the Republicans gained power, the Contract with America and its proposed b alanced budget amendment went under the bed, not to be seen again until the Democrats were in power.

When Republicans were running up the deficit, it was Democrats who decried it.

When Democrats run up the deficit, it is Republicans who decry it.

Pots are good at calling kettles black. Both parties are the party of big spending, big government, and fiscal irresponsibility. There are no conservatives left any more.

Well, maybe a few Libertarians, but who listens to them?
 
BWG said:
LOL...look at the join date beneath my name. I was here. Conservatives on this board (and in general) were not very pissed about the spending.

Yes, if you look back you may find a few - very few - that expressed concern, but for the vast majority they were extremely apologetic.
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Let's use the search function and back up these claims, one way or another.


Anyone willing to do some research, even just on this board, or are we all just going to spew claims until someone gives up or gets bored?
 
Goldenboy219 said:
Might be possible if.....



We were not in a recession. Combined with a democratic majority better keep dreaming.



Nothing is better than something? Nobody should have to go broke because they cannot afford health care. That is my opinion; how we achieve such a scenario is another topic in itself.



Do you own stock/have a 401k derived in equities?



The failure of major financial institutions creates systemic risk. A complete failure of the system cannot be risked. Ever....
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Just keep printing money, this is your only answer?:confused:
 
PeteEU said:
Funny how there was no outcry by conservatives when Bush was in office and he spent along with his Republican congress, like a drunken sailor.

Funny how there was no outcry by conservatives when it was them that were "uping" the debt limit 4 times from 2001 to 2006 and 7 times in total under Bush.

Funny how there was no outcry by conservatives when the US national debt went up 100% in the 8 years of the Bush administration.

Funny how conservatives have no solutions to the problems they at least in a big part caused... yes doing the tired old "tax cuts" bit is not a solution if you keep spending increases.. we knew that before Bush and that was yet again confirmed under Bush.

If you listen to conservatives, you could cure cancer by cutting taxes..
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This is why the Republicans were thrown out of office, because no conservative complained, is this the theory you are sticking with?

There is a difference between a conservative, and a republican, just as there is a difference between a liberal, and a democrat.

Problem is, they are two in the same, there is little difference between the two party monopoly we have today.
 
PeteEU said:
Funny how there was no outcry by conservatives when Bush was in office and he spent along with his Republican congress, like a drunken sailor.

Funny how there was no outcry by conservatives when it was them that were "uping" the debt limit 4 times from 2001 to 2006 and 7 times in total under Bush.

Funny how there was no outcry by conservatives when the US national debt went up 100% in the 8 years of the Bush administration.

Funny how conservatives have no solutions to the problems they at least in a big part caused... yes doing the tired old "tax cuts" bit is not a solution if you keep spending increases.. we knew that before Bush and that was yet again confirmed under Bush.

If you listen to conservatives, you could cure cancer by cutting taxes..
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The problem with your post is that you falsely assume that Bush was a Conservative. He was not, and neither were his supporters. True Conservatives, such as myself, bashed Bush over this, as well as bash Obama today for doing the same.
 
PeteEU said:
Funny how there was no outcry by conservatives when Bush was in office and he spent along with his Republican congress, like a drunken sailor.
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Nonsense engendered by eating too much mad-cow.

The Americans complained vociferously and that is why the Repbulicans suffered major defeats in 2006 and 2008 - the party base won't vote for this socialist **** or the people that try to pass it.

The more constipated the socialists are, the happier the Americans are.
 
Kal'Stang said:
Its also funny how liberals moaned and complained when the debt ceiling was raised during the Bush administration but expects people to not moan and complain under Obama's administration for the same thing.
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They didn't really complain when the debt ceiling was raised under Bush, you know. They may have made some noises for propaganda purposes, but they didn't vote against it.

Just like they voted FOR the war in Iraq.
 
Jackboot said:
Just keep printing money, this is your only answer?:confused:
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During a deflationary environment. Yes, that is the most effective way in combating deflation Jack.... Get with the program!
 
Erod said:
How in the world are we going to fix this?
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1: Spend less than we take in
2: Apply the surplus to the debt.

Every dollar we spend is spent because weh choose to spend it.
Nothig prevents us from choosing to spend less.
 
Goobieman said:
1: Spend less than we take in
2: Apply the surplus to the debt.

Every dollar we spend is spent because weh choose to spend it.
Nothig prevents us from choosing to spend less.
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Have you considered the long term effects that will have on the nations growth?
 
EpicDude86 said:
Now is not the time to ask that question. That question should have been asked, a 'long term' ago...
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Now is an acceptable time frame due to the low birth rate that accompanies highly developed societies.
 
Goldenboy219 said:
During a deflationary environment. Yes, that is the most effective way in combating deflation Jack.... Get with the program!
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So reducing federal, state spending, this is just not an option, just print, inflate, and destroy?

How long are people going to stand for this, how about foreign investors, how long will they continue to, invest, or trust this irresponsible country, and their ponzi scheme?
 
Jackboot said:
So reducing federal, state spending, this is just not an option, just print, inflate, and destroy?
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Such an option will only facilitate deflation causing an even greater realization of animal spirits.

Keynes said:
Even apart from the instability due to speculation, there is the instability due to the characteristic of human nature that a large proportion of our positive activities depend on spontaneous optimism rather than mathematical expectations, whether moral or hedonistic or economic. Most, probably, of our decisions to do something positive, the full consequences of which will be drawn out over many days to come, can only be taken as the result of animal spirits - a spontaneous urge to action rather than inaction, and not as the outcome of a weighted average of quantitative benefits multiplied by quantitative probabilities.
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Source: John M Keynes, The General Theory of Employment, Interest and Money, London: Macmillan, 1936, pp. 161-162.
 
Goldenboy219 said:
Such an option will only facilitate deflation causing an even greater realization of animal spirits.



Source: John M Keynes, The General Theory of Employment, Interest and Money, London: Macmillan, 1936, pp. 161-162.
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You are right the **** up Keynes' ass aren't you GB? :lol:

Protip: Economists are not always right.

also, Milton chuckles at all your Keynes quotes.
milton_friedman4.jpg
 
Goldenboy219 said:
Such an option will only facilitate deflation causing an even greater realization of animal spirits.



Source: John M Keynes, The General Theory of Employment, Interest and Money, London: Macmillan, 1936, pp. 161-162.
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Does Keynes explain who will pay for the old, the young, the middle class, the unwed mother, the handicapped, the poor, the immigrant, etc, just who will pay these bills exactly?

As I said before, this country is losing their reputation around the world, this currency is in decline, our respect and the faith in our dollar is in decline, this ponzi scheme is coming to an end!
 
EpicDude86 said:
You are right the **** up Keynes' ass aren't you GB? :lol:
Protip: Economists are not always right.
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Its called an 'appeal to authority' and is a logical fallacy.
 
EpicDude86 said:
You are right the **** up Keynes' ass aren't you GB? :lol:

Protip: Economists are not always right.

also, Milton chuckles at all your Keynes quotes.
milton_friedman4.jpg
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I think Milton Friedman was just as influential as Keynes. You see, i am not a one trick all or nothing type of individual. You can learn a little from everyone.
 
Goldenboy219 said:
I think Milton Friedman was just as influential as Keynes. You see, i am not a one trick all or nothing type of individual. You can learn a little from everyone.
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What did you learn from this man??
 
Goobieman said:
Its called an 'appeal to authority' and is a logical fallacy.
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I was just explaining animal spirits. We had a good whiff of them from september '08 until april '09. Get with the program goobes, or piss of:mrgreen:
 
Goldenboy219 said:
I think Milton Friedman was just as influential as Keynes. You see, i am not a one trick all or nothing type of individual. You can learn a little from everyone.
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The Milton reference was a joke based on Milton's criticism of ol' Keynes and the fact that he's about the only one you do quote...Unless I missed you quoting other economists...I could be wrong...
 
PeteEU said:
Dont get me wrong.. I actually agree with you. While Obama is going the right way he has showed at times "failure of leadership". But in this case I dont see how Obama had any choice what so ever. Bush DID have a choice in all the 7 times he got the debt ceiling raised.

But that does not change the fact that most conservatives today blame Obama for most if not all of the debt, and that is so factually wrong. They gloss over the fact that of the 12 trillion at least 5 if not 6 trillion came during Bush's watch with a Republican (conservative) run Congress. In there lies not only the irony but the hypocrisy as well.
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I'm assuming that those are the 4 times that you singled out in your post before? Those 4 times equaled out to 3 trillion over the course of 5 years. And they want to raise the ceiling 1.8 trillion under Obama...not counting how much they raised it with the stimulus package, thats over half what Bush did in 5 years, in just one year.

As for conservatives today blaming Obama for "most if not all of the debt" that's pretty common across any party line. Depending of course on who is in charge.
 
Jackboot said:
So reducing federal, state spending, this is just not an option, just print, inflate, and destroy?
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How is feeding a deflationary economy more deflation going to help it?

How long are people going to stand for this, how about foreign investors, how long will they continue to, invest, or trust this irresponsible country, and their ponzi scheme?
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Well, they wouldn't stand for a deflationary economy. Why invest now at price x when I can invest at price Y which is $10 cheaper? Deflation is just as bad, if not worse then inflation for economic growth.
 
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