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Trump’s Obamacare Replacement Push Has Been Totally Abandoned

Which provisions proposed by Democrats do you think aren't realistic? Do you even know what's been proposed?

In a way you're right, because McConnell will kill anything they pass in the Senate, because that's what he does best - obstruct.

But the difference between Democrats and the GOP is the Democrats did pass the ACA, and it lowered the rate for those without insurance to decades lows, and it was paid for with taxes and other offsets. So they have a record of DOING, while the GOP (and it's bizarre you're irrationally placing all the blame on the House GOP) has a record of talking a lot but doing NOTHING. Give the Democrats power and I'll bet you a nickel or posting for a year that they'll get a bunch of ACA bills through Congress and the WH in the first six months, versus the 0 the GOP got through in two years.

Everyone they tried. They didn't attempt to get any kind of agreement with Republicans. There was zero expectation they stood a chance in the Senate.

It's ridiculous to try to pan off these political games they play in Congress as some kind of legitimate effort.

The 116th Congress is a complete joke. Nothing of importance will get done.

I'm not necessarily upset about that, but there are some actual important things that should be done.

Nancy has insured that will be impossible to accomplish.
 
The NDP hasn't made taken these votes for any other reason but to create political talking points. Don't try to suggest otherwise.

When the Dems propose and vote on legislation, it's because they want it to pass. Don't confuse them with the nihilists in the GOP who need to keep the rubes in their base frothing at the mouth by churning out nonsensical bills the smarter ones in the GOP leadership understand should never become law.

The Dems are actually proposing good health policy. If the GOP ever stopped blocking it, premiums would fall, coverage would expand, competition would be enhanced. The GOP might even be able to stave off a transition to Medicare-for-all, which their nihilistic quest to destroy health care markets makes virtually inevitable.
 
LOL.

Yeah, sure.

In one post you whine about how the dems passed ACA all by themselves, in the next post you whine that they haven’t done anything.

The Dems own Obamacare with all it's serious faults. What have they done about it other than to play games?
 
Everyone they tried. They didn't attempt to get any kind of agreement with Republicans. There was zero expectation they stood a chance in the Senate.

What will the GOP vote for? Nothing. Same as it ever was.
 
When the Dems propose and vote on legislation, it's because they want it to pass. Don't confuse them with the nihilists in the GOP who need to keep the rubes in their base frothing at the mouth by churning out nonsensical bills the smarter ones in the GOP leadership understand should never become law.

The Dems are actually proposing good health policy. If the GOP ever stopped blocking it, premiums would fall, coverage would expand, competition would be enhanced. The GOP might even be able to stave off a transition to Medicare-for-all, which their nihilistic quest to destroy health care markets makes virtually inevitable.

Oh please. I take you as being more sophisticated than that.
 
What will the GOP vote for? Nothing. Same as it ever was.

When nothing of substance is presented, why should they? My way or the highway has been the SOP in Congress for too long.

The 116th Congress was doomed the moment Nancy was elected Speaker, and the moment the left created #Resist.

The era of attack and destroy, created by the actual powers behind the effort, is upon us.
 
Everyone they tried. They didn't attempt to get any kind of agreement with Republicans. There was zero expectation they stood a chance in the Senate.

It's ridiculous to try to pan off these political games they play in Congress as some kind of legitimate effort.

The 116th Congress is a complete joke. Nothing of importance will get done.

I'm not necessarily upset about that, but there are some actual important things that should be done.

Nancy has insured that will be impossible to accomplish.

Of course it's all Nancy's fault. McConnell and the GOP in the Senate don't have any agency, and are just victims along for the ride. Poor Mitch....
 
When nothing of substance is presented, why should they?

Maybe you have trouble with recognizing what "substance" looks like. Reinsurance has lowered premiums by double digits in the states already using the Dems' State Innovation Waivers to implement it.
 
Of course it's all Nancy's fault. McConnell and the GOP in the Senate don't have any agency, and are just victims along for the ride. Poor Mitch....

Is this where I bring up Reid doing the same thing when he controlled the Senate?

It's all politics.

Nancy came in and basically made sure to let the President know he should go **** himself. Well, since you kind of need the Presidents signature on bills, that pretty much slams the door on things, unless you have enough votes to override a veto.

The Dems obviously have no intention of trying anything workable. They are going all in on 2020 and hoping to take the Senate and the White House.

Ugly won't begin to describe the politics that will be on display next year. And who ever is the Dems nominee is doomed to days in hell. Win or lose.

That's where we are today, IMO.
 
When nothing of substance is presented, why should they? My way or the highway has been the SOP in Congress for too long.

The 116th Congress was doomed the moment Nancy was elected Speaker, and the moment the left created #Resist.

The era of attack and destroy, created by the actual powers behind the effort, is upon us.

Can you identify anything proposed/passed by Democrats that's without substance? The actual bill, and why the provisions included in it aren't substantive proposals?

And if the Senate was serious about healthcare reform, the standard way to do it is to take the Democratic proposal coming over from the House, and amend it to suit Republican priorities, and pass that, then work it out in committee. Or, alternatively, have his own people propose their solutions and send it over to Nancy. McConnell will do none of that because he's there to kill legislation - that's what he's good at. The OP is about the GOP "reform" team giving up likely without having a single substantive meeting. You can't blame that on Nancy.
 
The NDP hasn't made taken these votes for any other reason but to create political talking points. Don't try to suggest otherwise.

Oh, I get it.

You don’t debate, you just repeat talking points and ignore arguments that you don’t like.
 
Can you identify anything proposed/passed by Democrats that's without substance? The actual bill, and why the provisions included in it aren't substantive proposals?

Because knuckle-dragging GOPers will reflexively oppose them, of course.

The people who voted dozens and dozens of times in favor of bringing back pre-existing conditions and throwing tens of millions off their coverage aren't onboard with legislation to improve and expand affordability, competition, and coverage. So I guess that means that legislation isn't substantive!
 
Re: Trump’s Obamacare Replacement Push Has Been Totally Abandoned

Can you identify anything proposed/passed by Democrats that's without substance? The actual bill, and why the provisions included in it aren't substantive proposals?

And if the Senate was serious about healthcare reform, the standard way to do it is to take the Democratic proposal coming over from the House, and amend it to suit Republican priorities, and pass that, then work it out in committee. Or, alternatively, have his own people propose their solutions and send it over to Nancy. McConnell will do none of that because he's there to kill legislation - that's what he's good at. The OP is about the GOP "reform" team giving up likely without having a single substantive meeting. You can't blame that on Nancy.

This is how one news outlet describe the Insurance Bill the left passed in the House. I'll highlight a few things to illustrate my point.

With Insurance Bill Passage, House Democrats Begin Health Care Blitz - OmorodionPost.com


WASHINGTON — Returning to a central issue of the 2018 campaign, House Democrats on Thursday passed legislation to reverse Trump administration rules that allow expansion of health care plans that do not have to comply with the Affordable Care Act’s mandated coverage of pre-existing medical conditions.

The vote — 230 to 183 — was a jab at President Trump, who has pressed for ways around the coverage mandates of President Barack Obama’s signature domestic achievement while claiming he is committed to protecting Americans with chronic illnesses.

But it served a larger political purpose, kicking off a push by House Democrats on health care, an issue they see as central to winning back the White House and holding their gains in the House in 2020. Over the next two weeks, Democrats expect to pass a raft of legislation to drum home the point that, even as they clash with the White House over the findings of the Mueller report, they will continue to focus on proposals that help real people.​


There is no expectation that any of these bills will pass, or that they even make sense. They are just smoke a mirrors to be used during the campaign next year.


You think they actually expect the President to sign anything, after fighting to remove and/or imprison him for the last two years?


That's delusional to think that.
 
The NDP hasn't made taken these votes for any other reason but to create political talking points. Don't try to suggest otherwise.

Again, that's partly true because we all know the GOP Senate won't pass anything. But I think you're wrong that they're akin to the 87 votes (I lost count) to repeal the ACA and replace it with nothing, which weren't intended to pass, and we know that because the GOP took power and didn't pass them.

They'll form the backbone of the actual legislation that Democrats will pass when they get the majority, because they're solid proposals. You're dismissing them with a handwave, even as you cite articles proposing in some cases exactly what Democrats have proposed or already passed. It's just projection.
 
Re: Trump’s Obamacare Replacement Push Has Been Totally Abandoned

There is no expectation that any of these bills will pass, or that they even make sense.

Narrator: They do make sense.
 
When the Dems propose and vote on legislation, it's because they want it to pass. Don't confuse them with the nihilists in the GOP who need to keep the rubes in their base frothing at the mouth by churning out nonsensical bills the smarter ones in the GOP leadership understand should never become law.

The Dems are actually proposing good health policy. If the GOP ever stopped blocking it, premiums would fall, coverage would expand, competition would be enhanced. The GOP might even be able to stave off a transition to Medicare-for-all, which their nihilistic quest to destroy health care markets makes virtually inevitable.

That's what I don't get about GOP strategy here. They have to know their position on healthcare is a political loser and is playing right into the hands of the AOC/Sanders crowd. The public sees an ACA that is objectively failing many people, and so why not Medicare for all? If the GOP are going to oppose any efforts to make the existing system work, then why not burn it down, and replace it with the far left alternative?
 
The Dems own Obamacare with all it's serious faults. What have they done about it other than to play games?

Yes, we know that, the GOP have been telling us this for a decade, and we also now know the GOP alternative to the horrible ACA with all its faults is nothing. Or if you prefer, a far worse version of the ACA that what the Democrats passed.
 
Again, that's partly true because we all know the GOP Senate won't pass anything. But I think you're wrong that they're akin to the 87 votes (I lost count) to repeal the ACA and replace it with nothing, which weren't intended to pass, and we know that because the GOP took power and didn't pass them.

They'll form the backbone of the actual legislation that Democrats will pass when they get the majority, because they're solid proposals. You're dismissing them with a handwave, even as you cite articles proposing in some cases exactly what Democrats have proposed or already passed. It's just projection.

So, do you know the bill number of the Insurance Bill the Dems in the House passed that sought to nullify the Dept of Treasury actions and the Department of HHS in regards to waivers states can take?


Do you know anything about it? I should let you know I know it, and have it teed up and I'm ready to comment on anything you'd like.
 
Yes, we know that, the GOP have been telling us this for a decade, and we also now know the GOP alternative to the horrible ACA with all its faults is nothing. Or if you prefer, a far worse version of the ACA that what the Democrats passed.

I believe the point on the table is what have the Dems done in 10 years to correct the flaws in their health plan?
 
That's what I don't get about GOP strategy here. They have to know their position on healthcare is a political loser and is playing right into the hands of the AOC/Sanders crowd. The public sees an ACA that is objectively failing many people, and so why not Medicare for all? If the GOP are going to oppose any efforts to make the existing system work, then why not burn it down, and replace it with the far left alternative?

You'd think they have to know. But I saw Paul Ryan, long hailed as the intellectual titan of the modern GOP, remarking incredulously on the basic tenets of insurance as if he had just found out how health insurance works that day. We have to consider the possibility that these people are virtually all idiots.

Most of them seem to believe that a market-based system that protects people with pre-existing conditions (the overwhelming consensus position among the American public) could somehow look different than what Mass pioneered a decade plus ago and the ACA took national five years ago. And so they constantly shocked when they find out they can't come up with an alternative to make it work. Not sure how many decades it will take them to clue in. But it's not looking great.
 
That's what I don't get about GOP strategy here. They have to know their position on healthcare is a political loser and is playing right into the hands of the AOC/Sanders crowd. The public sees an ACA that is objectively failing many people, and so why not Medicare for all? If the GOP are going to oppose any efforts to make the existing system work, then why not burn it down, and replace it with the far left alternative?

This speaks to wider problems than merely healthcare - or even choosing the right issues.

Firstly they've painted themselves into a corner: in order to keep getting reelected - even in safe sets - they need to keep sucking at the corporate teat. Without the donor money they run the risk of getting primaried by someone more extreme (safe seats) or losing to a Dem (vulnerable ones). Sometimes both. So to keep that money coming in they need to have policies that favor the donors, in this case large insurers or corporations seeking tax cuts. These both negatively impact ACA. Yet to keep the sick voters, of whom there are a lot, they must pretend to care about affordable healthcare. So they must sell themselves as having a plan, looking for an alternative or against any cuts to medicare/medicaid, while actually doing the opposite. They will get caught sooner or later. Many of the base hate libs enough to let it slide and lose their healthcare, some will embrace cognitive dissonance and accept the given excuses by their GOP reps, but not all will be fooled. So they must continue the policy of selling one platform to the base, but actually delivering another for the donors.

Because the party has been hijacked by both special interests and grass-roots right wing partisans the average conservative GOP congressman is stuck squarely in the middle.

Now because they can't fool everyone all the time, common sense would dictate that they find more appealing policies and run on those. But the donors will strip them of backing and a more right-wing challenger can dismiss them as socialist, so that's really risky. Most feel they have very little wiggle room. if they run on a more moderate policy, they might lose to Dems who do better on healthcare votes; they might get primaried by a rabid Trumpist who then goes and loses the seat anyway for dialing up the crazy.

What of changing demographics? Well that's where we come back to the other side of plan A. there was never a plan B (to deliver the services people need), but there was a safety net built into plan A: voter suppression, gerrymandering, propaganda. If your policies simply don't attract a wide variety of voters, but you're unable to change those policies, then stop such a wide variety from voting. Voter suppression in all its forms is now the go-to weapon of the GOP. That can't work forever either unless it becomes even more prevalent and far-reaching, but for the next cycle and the one after that - as far as the embattled GOP Rep or Senator can see over the smoke of the Trump presidency's dumpster fire - it is their only option. Keep running policies that people won't vote for and stop more people from voting.

So as I said this is way bigger than ACA. If that was the only problem they could just make a better plan. But the problem is serving two masters while holding on to power. They fear that right wing voters and donors will punish them if they become more moderate, and that it's easier to suppress any voters on the left than to win them over.
 
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