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Mueller draft report says trump 'helped putin destabilize the united states', watergate journalist s

Hawkeye10 said:
It is not about me, it is about Carl Bernstein and his crap quality journalism and about how emotionally involved in the story he clearly is.

Your "Power is lying to me" alarms should be ringing.
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Indeed. Quoted for truth.
 
Pedestrian said:
Just more partisan bull****. Go after the politics, morals, sexlife and everything...about the messenger.

Can't go after his ethnicity, damn, he's white. Oh well, the right always thinks of something upon which to

denigrate and demonize their opposition. Hell surely, hath no fury like a republican scorned.
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I will let the Right speak for themselves and kindly dont quote me unless you intend to respond to what I have said....I dont need the clutter.
 
Acadia said:
You have to wonder why the Dems are acting more insane than usual.
I wonder if Huber will have any indictments for Comey.
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Acadia the news broke just yesterday that James Baker was under federal criminal investigation. I learned about this after your post a couple days ago. That now makes two former FBI agents if you count McCabe under federal investigation and both answered directly to James Comey. Those are the only two we know of but how many more are there? Baker's investigation is being done out of the Connecticut FBI office. Durham is a seasoned prosecutor who has been tapped by Republicans and Democrats to handle high-profile, national controversies in the past according to the link below and is now in charge in the investigation into Baker which could implicate others like James Comey because he like McCabe answered to Comey. And there has to be some there there for Durham for be ahead of the investigation.

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/fo...f-federal-media-leak-probe-transcript-reveals

So when you see why the left is acting more insane as of late, my guess is they already know what is coming.
 
Pedestrian said:
However, this repub senate wouldn't vote out Dillinger or Capone, so.....?
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What do you have against Al Capone? All he ever did was commit the process crime of tax evasion. He was framed for a clerical error because he fought the Deep State establishment.
 
vesper said:
Acadia the news broke just yesterday that James Baker was under federal criminal investigation. I learned about this after your post a couple days ago. That now makes two former FBI agents if you count McCabe under federal investigation and both answered directly to James Comey. Those are the only two we know of but how many more are there? Baker's investigation is being done out of the Connecticut FBI office. Durham is a seasoned prosecutor who has been tapped by Republicans and Democrats to handle high-profile, national controversies in the past according to the link below and is now in charge in the investigation into Baker which could implicate others like James Comey because he like McCabe answered to Comey. And there has to be some there there for Durham for be ahead of the investigation.

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/fo...f-federal-media-leak-probe-transcript-reveals

So when you see why the left is acting more insane as of late, my guess is they already know what is coming.
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So being under investigations means he is guilty?

What does that mean for the 18 investigations into Individual-1?
 
vesper said:
And we are to believe it is Mueller's team leaking this crap out?

Just like the so called bombshell NYT printed a couple of days ago and had to retract. I'd say the creds for journalists at Newsweek are even lower.


What a smart person would be asking is why all these fabricated drive by shooting stories now? Its looking like some are really desperate.
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God, this nothing compared to when the right (GOP) went after B. Clinton.

It was 6 years of very deliberate leaks from K. Starr and his staff and with a deliberate attempt to sway the public (and congress) against Clinton.
 
vesper said:
Acadia the news broke just yesterday that James Baker was under federal criminal investigation. I learned about this after your post a couple days ago. That now makes two former FBI agents if you count McCabe under federal investigation and both answered directly to James Comey. Those are the only two we know of but how many more are there? Baker's investigation is being done out of the Connecticut FBI office. Durham is a seasoned prosecutor who has been tapped by Republicans and Democrats to handle high-profile, national controversies in the past according to the link below and is now in charge in the investigation into Baker which could implicate others like James Comey because he like McCabe answered to Comey. And there has to be some there there for Durham for be ahead of the investigation.

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/fo...f-federal-media-leak-probe-transcript-reveals

So when you see why the left is acting more insane as of late, my guess is they already know what is coming.
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Thanks for the link. To me, it just doesn't comport that Comey could be such an intelligent, capable FBI Director, yet this went on right under him. How could that be? The pernicious Trump hatred and allegiance to Hillary Clinton, during the email investigation and Presidential election. The McCabe cabal. Now Baker's leaks to the media.
Either Comey was incompetent, or he knew and was at least tacitly complicit.
 
bubbabgone said:
People are removed from a team of investigators, get reassigned, and get demoted... that's my fact
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But it is not a fact in support of your premise.

For example, if I said the sun was going to burn out and leave the Earth cold and lifeless by the end of next week and cited as a fact that it gets dark at night, that doesn't support my original premise.

You have provided ZERO evidence of wrongdoing (aside from McCabe, which we both agree upon and which I will no longer keep mentioning since it is already agreed upon). We know for a fact that both Strozk and Page were not found to have shown any bias in their investigation, Comey was fired for partisan reasons which is now part of an obstruction investigation and you have not provided a single piece of evidence to suggest wrongdoing on the part of Ohr or Baker (aside from partisan attacks about Ohr).

Like I said, not really.

I'm curious, why would it matter if Comey leaked after Trump fired him?
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Because A) he would no longer be part of the Trump/Campaign/Russia investigation, which is the crux of our discussion and B) it would not be evidence of wrongdoing by the FBI since he was not with the FBI, which is what our discussion is about.

Is that in the Law?
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If your concern is the law, then no one you have mentioned has even been indicted, which kills your argument.

You can carry out classified material when you get fired and you're free to do what you want with it?
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Already addressed that with the WaPo article, please review for my response.

And are you suggesting Rosenstein's letter to fire Comey for cause doesn't count because it focused on his misdeeds regarding the Clinton investigation?
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I'm saying there is no evidence of wrongdoing and, at this point, we both know Rosenstein didn't fire Comey, Trump did. And we know that because Trump admitted he fired him and said the reason was because of the Russia investigation, which we also know means Comey wouldn't end the Russia investigation when Trump wanted him to (hello obstruction of justice).

So, no, there really isn't evidence of systemic wrongdoing in the Justice Department, but we have PLENTY of evidence of wrongdoing in the Trump Campaign and Administration. I recommend you focus your energies on the criminal wrongdoings of Trump's team, since there is plenty there.
 
Slyfox696 said:
But it is not a fact in support of your premise.

For example, if I said the sun was going to burn out and leave the Earth cold and lifeless by the end of next week and cited as a fact that it gets dark at night, that doesn't support my original premise.

You have provided ZERO evidence of wrongdoing (aside from McCabe, which we both agree upon and which I will no longer keep mentioning since it is already agreed upon). We know for a fact that both Strozk and Page were not found to have shown any bias in their investigation, Comey was fired for partisan reasons which is now part of an obstruction investigation and you have not provided a single piece of evidence to suggest wrongdoing on the part of Ohr or Baker (aside from partisan attacks about Ohr).

Like I said, not really.

Because A) he would no longer be part of the Trump/Campaign/Russia investigation, which is the crux of our discussion and B) it would not be evidence of wrongdoing by the FBI since he was not with the FBI, which is what our discussion is about.

If your concern is the law, then no one you have mentioned has even been indicted, which kills your argument.

Already addressed that with the WaPo article, please review for my response.

I'm saying there is no evidence of wrongdoing and, at this point, we both know Rosenstein didn't fire Comey, Trump did. And we know that because Trump admitted he fired him and said the reason was because of the Russia investigation, which we also know means Comey wouldn't end the Russia investigation when Trump wanted him to (hello obstruction of justice).

So, no, there really isn't evidence of systemic wrongdoing in the Justice Department, but we have PLENTY of evidence of wrongdoing in the Trump Campaign and Administration. I recommend you focus your energies on the criminal wrongdoings of Trump's team, since there is plenty there.
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The premise is corruption in the top echelon of the FBI. The demotions, firings, and dismissals indicate that as do the details in Rosenstein's letter about Comey.
 
bubbabgone said:
The premise is corruption in the top echelon of the FBI.
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Of which you've provided no evidence.

The demotions, firings, and dismissals indicate that as do the details in Rosenstein's letter about Comey.
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They really don't, for reasons I've already mentioned.
 
Acadia said:
Thanks for the link. To me, it just doesn't comport that Comey could be such an intelligent, capable FBI Director, yet this went on right under him. How could that be? The pernicious Trump hatred and allegiance to Hillary Clinton, during the email investigation and Presidential election. The McCabe cabal. Now Baker's leaks to the media.
Either Comey was incompetent, or he knew and was at least tacitly complicit.
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Anyone intellectually honest knows Comey knew what McCabe and Baker were doing and it had his blessing until they were found out.
 
vesper said:
Anyone intellectually honest knows Comey knew what McCabe and Baker were doing and it had his blessing until they were found out.
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Comey sure does have the "Aw, gee shucks, M'am, toe-kickin',hand-wringin' routine down though, don't he tho?
 
Slyfox696 said:
Of which you've provided no evidence.

They really don't, for reasons I've already mentioned.
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For reasons you won't acknowledge ... your partisan reasons.
 
bubbabgone said:
For reasons you won't acknowledge
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That doesn't make sense. If I've already mentioned the reasons, then I have acknowledged them.
your partisan reasons.
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Reality is not partisan. Reality is you have no evidence and, more importantly to the origin of this discussion, reality has shown that empty comments like vesper's, which start this debate between us, has repeatedly turned out to be false.

Just like this one will be.
 
Slyfox696 said:
That doesn't make sense. If I've already mentioned the reasons, then I have acknowledged them.
Reality is not partisan. Reality is you have no evidence and, more importantly to the origin of this discussion, reality has shown that empty comments like vesper's, which start this debate between us, has repeatedly turned out to be false.

Just like this one will be.
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Your partisanship won't let you recognize the reasons for the actions taken against those and others was for cause.
The reason for your partisanship is probably a narrow choice of reading material chosen to affirm what you decide to believe.
That can't be changed from without. You have to resolve to change that yourself.
 
bubbabgone said:
Your partisanship won't let you recognize the reasons for the actions taken against those and others was for cause.
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You have not provided a single piece of evidence to support this. Your entire argument is circular. "We know they did wrong because they were moved and because they were moved, we know they did wrong."

Your entire argument is a big fallacy predicated on zero evidence.

YOU are the one engaging in partisanship, not me. I've provided facts and logic, you're presenting circular arguments.

The reason for your partisanship is probably a narrow choice of reading material chosen to affirm what you decide to believe.
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I've repeatedly challenged you to support your position and you have not done so successfully even once. All you've had is innuendo and circular arguments.

That can't be changed from without. You have to resolve to change that yourself.
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Since I am correct, I do not have to change anything. You were the one who made the claim, it is on you to support it. You haven't.
 
Slyfox696 said:
You have not provided a single piece of evidence to support this. Your entire argument is circular. "We know they did wrong because they were moved and because they were moved, we know they did wrong."

Your entire argument is a big fallacy predicated on zero evidence.

YOU are the one engaging in partisanship, not me. I've provided facts and logic, you're presenting circular arguments.

I've repeatedly challenged you to support your position and you have not done so successfully even once. All you've had is innuendo and circular arguments.

Since I am correct, I do not have to change anything. You were the one who made the claim, it is on you to support it. You haven't.
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https://www.debatepolitics.com/brea...e-dossier-connected-clinton-might-biased.html
 
Slyfox696 said:
A) I said partisanship doesn't count
B) Uhh...I'm not exactly sure how you think that helps your argument. Bruce Ohr told the FBI of the potential bias (absolving him of wrongdoing) and the FBI informed the FISA court.

So, again, how exactly do you think this opinion piece from a partisan writer helps you? If anything, it HURTS your argument.
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th


All right. I'll let you go before you hurt yourself.
 
bubbabgone said:
All right. I'll let you go before you hurt yourself.
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I take this as you admitting you were conned by a hack writer who wrote about old information in such a way to make you believe it was relevant.

It wasn't. According to your own hack writer, Ohr told the FBI and it has been well reported the FBI told the FISA court (and, none of the truly matters because the FBI had already opened investigation due to Papadapolous). You have nothing (with the exception previously noted regarding McCabe).

It's a shame people have such a hard time admitting they were wrong. You were wrong. Vesper was wrong. You should just admit it, it'll feel good, I promise.
 
Nickyjo said:
No, the plan is not to attach ourselves to Obamacare without any other insurance, but if the pre-existing condition part of it endures, we will be thankful.
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I often see here in the forum, and some other places, that no one is denied health care, or medical help if truly needed. Is that wrong? If so, why?
Regards,
CP
 
Into the Night said:
He is already paying for it. Healthcare insurance premiums skyrocketed because of Obamacare.

No one is.

Prices are set by discovery. This is how capitalism works. If a drug company is forced to sell a drug for less than it cost to produce it, the drug will not be produced. Price controls always fail. They always cause shortages.

Currently caused by Obamacare.

Did you know that many communities don't have paid police or fire departments? They are volunteer operated.

No one is keeping you from visiting a doctor.


Making bad decisions with money or lifestyle is a free choice. You are NOT free of the consequences of that choice.
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I have so much to ask and discuss, but I don't want to pollute this thread anymore than I already have. Making a poll here, to me, is as difficult as Chinese Algebra. There is so much to discuss and learn about the Health care topic, I surely wish someone here who knows how, would post a vanilla Health care poll. I believe the question is essential, but don't know how to pose it. Thank you.
Regards,
CP
 
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