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Trump says he could ‘run’ Mueller probe

FreedomFromAll said:
My only horse in my criticisms of the President, is the fidelity of the Constitution. It is no different than my criticisms of Obama over what amounted to a living tax. I do not care if you are in love with trump, what he is doing to this fine nation is gross and should be the center of attention. Trump decreed that he can run an investigation personally. And not just any investigation, but an investigation involving him, his family and subordinates. His claim is entirely unethical and an action usually taken by authoritarian dictators alone. It just is not the American way for the President to make such claims. Every citizen should be offended and pissed at the President for acting unethical and not being what he promised in his oath and contract with every American. IMO Trump should be impeached for making the claim that he can run an investigation like this. Now if we add on top of that, all else that he has done...well where are the Republicans, why are they supporting this unethical abomination? It really makes them no better than the Democrats. And we would be better off if both parties dissolved.
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Yet you continue to grind your teeth in fear of something that is never going to pass.

Do you not get what kind of a problem sign that is for you?

Even going by what he himself has said, there is nothing to worry about at all.

Why are you worrying about this so much and what do you mean by "what he is doing to this fine nation is gross"?
 
Oborosen said:
Yet you continue to grind your teeth in fear of something that is never going to pass.

Do you not get what kind of a problem sign that is for you?

Even going by what he himself has said, there is nothing to worry about at all.

Why are you worrying about this so much and what do you mean by "what he is doing to this fine nation is gross"?
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And again my assertion is that the President decreed that he had a certain authoritarian power, I find that to be an assault on the the US Constitution.

In other words your spin sucks balls and is nothing but an attempt to ignore that fact. The Constitution does not give the President the power to personally run an investigation, much less an investigation into the President.

Now your self serving argument that by the grace of the president that he will not abuse his power, is a really....really ignorant argument. I reject the notion that the President has any right to decide if he has authoritarian powers. It is completely ridiculous that anyone would defend the president on this. But day by day Trump supporters shift further and further into supporting Trumps extremist positions. I mean listen to you making excuses for Trump, for declaring that he has powers that no President should claim to have.
 
FreedomFromAll said:
And again my assertion is that the President decreed that he had a certain authoritarian power, I find that to be an assault on the the US Constitution.

In other words your spin sucks balls and is nothing but an attempt to ignore that fact. The Constitution does not give the President the power to personally run an investigation, much less an investigation into the President.

Now your self serving argument that by the grace of the president that he will not abuse his power, is a really....really ignorant argument. I reject the notion that the President has any right to decide if he has authoritarian powers. It is completely ridiculous that anyone would defend the president on this. But day by day Trump supporters shift further and further into supporting Trumps extremist positions. I mean listen to you making excuses for Trump, for declaring that he has powers that no President should claim to have.
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What the hell are you even talking about?
He has the power to run the investigation, however the hoops he would need to run are astounding to say the least.

Are you really this desperate for a boogeyman in your life, that you're going to hang on this like it proves something?

Not even his words show that he is authoritarian, why are you grasping for these straws so damn hard?
 
Oborosen said:
I would suggest you stop projecting yourself and get back to the debate.
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Why do you think Trump seems to be so hell bent on intervening/ceasing in Mueller's investigation,which is run by his fellow Republican? A fellow Republican who is well respected by both sides of the aisle?
 
Logician Man said:
Why do you think Trump seems to be so hell bent on intervening/ceasing in Mueller's investigation,which is run by his fellow Republican? A fellow Republican who is well respected by both sides of the aisle?
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I haven't seen him try to do anything like that with the investigation. So you'll have to get back to me when and if that event actually does happen.
 
Oborosen said:
I haven't seen him try to do anything like that with the investigation. So you'll have to get back to me when and if that event actually does happen.
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So you haven't seen the many,many tweets where he intervened/interjected his 'opinion' that Mueller's investigation is a 'Witch Hunt?'...Should I also accept your defeat on this issue,or would you like to take a mulligan and try again?
 
Logician Man said:
So you haven't seen the many,many tweets where he intervened/interjected his 'opinion' that Mueller's investigation is a 'Witch Hunt?'...Should I also accept your defeat on this issue,or would you like to take a mulligan and try again?
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So you're saying his "opinion" is him actively trying to interfere with the investigation. Which it obviously isn't.

You're grasping for some very thin straws there, because none of that proves that he is actively trying to interfere with it in general.

I would also suggest you try to make a coherent point, before attempting to claim victory.

Playing by your own rules, one could look through any tweet in which someone has advocated for his death and you would agree with persecuting them for attempted murder, or do you not understand how flagrant such a claim can be?
 
Oborosen said:
So you're saying his "opinion" is him actively trying to interfere with the investigation. Which it obviously isn't.

You're grasping for some very thin straws there, because none of that proves that he is actively trying to interfere with it in general.

I would also suggest you try to make a coherent point, before attempting to claim victory.

Playing by your own rules, one could look through any tweet in which someone has advocated for his death and you would agree with persecuting them for attempted murder, or do you not understand how flagrant such a claim can be?
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What I am saying,is what many others on both sides of the aisle have said,that being Trump is trying his damnedest to cease Mueller's investigation.Is it your contention that Trump is fully satisfied to let Mueller's investigation run it's course unimpeded and let the chips fall where they may? A simple yes or no will suffice.
 
FreedomFromAll said:
And again my assertion is that the President decreed that he had a certain authoritarian power, I find that to be an assault on the the US Constitution.

In other words your spin sucks balls and is nothing but an attempt to ignore that fact. The Constitution does not give the President the power to personally run an investigation, much less an investigation into the President.

Now your self serving argument that by the grace of the president that he will not abuse his power, is a really....really ignorant argument. I reject the notion that the President has any right to decide if he has authoritarian powers. It is completely ridiculous that anyone would defend the president on this. But day by day Trump supporters shift further and further into supporting Trumps extremist positions. I mean listen to you making excuses for Trump, for declaring that he has powers that no President should claim to have.
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No doubt. But it doesn't just come back to assaulting the constitution it comes back to respect, morality, ethics and serving the American people in a manner that is ethically and morally just.
 
FreedomFromAll said:
And again my assertion is that the President decreed that he had a certain authoritarian power, I find that to be an assault on the the US Constitution.

In other words your spin sucks balls and is nothing but an attempt to ignore that fact. The Constitution does not give the President the power to personally run an investigation, much less an investigation into the President.

Now your self serving argument that by the grace of the president that he will not abuse his power, is a really....really ignorant argument. I reject the notion that the President has any right to decide if he has authoritarian powers. It is completely ridiculous that anyone would defend the president on this. But day by day Trump supporters shift further and further into supporting Trumps extremist positions. I mean listen to you making excuses for Trump, for declaring that he has powers that no President should claim to have.
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The President is chief executive of the executive branch, which includes the Justice Department and FBI. Since the Mueller investigation comes from the in-Justice Department and the FBI, it is subordinate to the authority of the president. The Senate and Congressional investigations are not under the Executive Branch. This is the checks and balances in the Constitution.

The Obama Administration committed crimes using the FBI; Comey, and Justice Departments; Rosenstein, because Obama could order them to do his bidding. He did so through intermediary buffers. Wiring tapping Trump Tower using a fake dossier to get a FISA warrant was an executive privilege, that Obama imposed om his subordinates in the executive branch; Justice and FBI.

Pardoning Hillary for her crimes before an investigation is also what president Obama could do and did do. This was not spun the proper way by fake news allowing Obama to avoid the political heat. The left wing fake news media, has spun its misinformation in advance, to circumvent Trump from using his executive authority, to get to the heart of the swamp corruption, under Obama's executive actions.
 
Logician Man said:
What I am saying,is what many others on both sides of the aisle have said,that being Trump is trying his damnedest to cease Mueller's investigation.Is it your contention that Trump is fully satisfied to let Mueller's investigation run it's course unimpeded and let the chips fall where they may? A simple yes or no will suffice.
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It's easy to see that Trump doesn't really mind for the investigation, though he doesn't like it either.

Yet there has been no action on his part to actively impede the investigation itself. He can say all he likes on twitter and he can whine all he wants to the press. Not a single one of these actions is going to overtly affect the actual workings of the investigation on a whole. At this point the only thing he can do without taking direct action is affect opinion on Mueller and his team, that's all.
 
Oborosen said:
It's easy to see that Trump doesn't really mind for the investigation, though he doesn't like it either.

Yet there has been no action on his part to actively impede the investigation itself. He can say all he likes on twitter and he can whine all he wants to the press. Not a single one of these actions is going to overtly affect the actual workings of the investigation on a whole. At this point the only thing he can do without taking direct action is affect opinion on Mueller and his team, that's all.
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Of course he minds the investigation.Otherwise he wouldn't try so hard and so often to discredit it.You're struggling even more than usual. Tough week?
 
Oborosen said:
What the hell are you even talking about?
He has the power to run the investigation, however the hoops he would need to run are astounding to say the least.

Are you really this desperate for a boogeyman in your life, that you're going to hang on this like it proves something?

Not even his words show that he is authoritarian, why are you grasping for these straws so damn hard?
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Do you have a source form the Constitution that says that Trump has the Authoritarian "to run the investigation"?

The President cannot run the investigation. There is nothing in the Constitution that gives him the power to do so. Dont give me this BS story that he can without any citation from the US Constitution that specifically grants the President such powers. Try as you might you will not find such a thing in the US Constitution since it doesn't even exist in the first place.

Again the problem is that a sitting president is asserting powers that the Constitution does not give him. You have only so far given your opinions on the matter and attacked those that disagree. But everyone can see that and writes your argument off as trash talk.
 
goldkam said:
No doubt. But it doesn't just come back to assaulting the constitution it comes back to respect, morality, ethics and serving the American people in a manner that is ethically and morally just.
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I agree but also Trump took an oath to protect the US Constitution and her he is going against it. Historically it will be what he is remembered for more than anything else.
 
Oborosen said:
I would suggest you stop projecting yourself and get back to the debate.
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What was your guys excuse for Trumps lying? Oh yea it doesn't matter that the President lies, only his actions matter. The problem with that BS excuse is that the Presidents job is to not to lie. SO yes actions speak larger than words.
 
FreedomFromAll said:
Do you have a source form the Constitution that says that Trump has the Authoritarian "to run the investigation"?

The President cannot run the investigation. There is nothing in the Constitution that gives him the power to do so. Dont give me this BS story that he can without any citation from the US Constitution that specifically grants the President such powers. Try as you might you will not find such a thing in the US Constitution since it doesn't even exist in the first place.

Again the problem is that a sitting president is asserting powers that the Constitution does not give him. You have only so far given your opinions on the matter and attacked those that disagree. But everyone can see that and writes your argument off as trash talk.
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I never said the constitution gave him this power. Since when has a president exorcise powers that are just solely allowed to him by the constitution alone?

You are one fearing something that isn't even an issue, has been pointed out to not be an issue, and has even been addressed by the man himself as something that will never even come to pass...

Do you not see how pointless your fear mongering is?
 
FreedomFromAll said:
What was your guys excuse for Trumps lying? Oh yea it doesn't matter that the President lies, only his actions matter. The problem with that BS excuse is that the Presidents job is to not to lie. SO yes actions speak larger than words.
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Please cite where I said that it doesn't matter that Trump lies.
 
Oborosen said:
I never said the constitution gave him this power. Since when has a president exorcise powers that are just solely allowed to him by the constitution alone?

You are one fearing something that isn't even an issue, has been pointed out to not be an issue, and has even been addressed by the man himself as something that will never even come to pass...

Do you not see how pointless your fear mongering is?
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Ok so you agree that the US Constitution does not give the President the power to run the Mueller investigation. Beyond that you attempted to make an excuse that doesn't hold water.

We have a Constitution, and it serves specific purposes. Any President that goes outside of the powers that the Constitution gives the Presidency is a threat to the Republic and should be impeached. Yes that includes any and all Presidents.



The only person fearmongering is the President through his threat to assume unconstitutional power. You obviously support trump asserting that he has unconstitutional powers since you are here making excuses for his words. Saying (like the President) that the president chose not to use his assumed power in by no means an excuse for the assertions that he made. Bottom line is that the President is a threat to the Republic. No I am sure that you given your bias, do not see it that way. But that will not change my mind no matter what you say about me. In fact, the more that you deny and whine about my position the more that it convinces me that I am correct.

The president said what he said and no amount of you apologizing for it will take that away. Trump asserted that he has unconstitutional power, whether he tries to use such power or not does not matter. What matters is that he said it.
 
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