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Jeff Sessions could be kicked out of the Methodist church over border separations of migrant familie

Felis Leo said:
I do not care if they do not like it. I'm atheist enough to know that they are not God and should not pretend that their beliefs are God's beliefs.
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And yet you support an administration that quotes this fictional man in the clouds to justify their government force.
 
jimbo said:
318 reverends meddle in politics they best take a look at their non profit status certificate.
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Funny, I said the same thing about the church I was attending some years ago when they had a petition going around to keep gay marriage illegal. That was the last time I attended that church.
 
Skeptic Bob said:
While I realize churches are certainly free to do such things I have to admit that such tactics make me uncomfortable. Politicians should be held accountable to the voters, not the churches.
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Sessions also puts the Methodists in a difficult position as he was quoting the Bible to justify the Trump Administration's immigration policy. Remember, they did not take this action until he started (ab)using the Bible.
 
Skeptic Bob said:
My issue is when the church itself takes punitive action against a member who is a politician for not carrying out policies the church doesn’t like. I’m not talking about members voting one way at election time but rather actions like kicking them out of the church/excommunicating them.
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They issued a complaint. Excommunication is highly unlikely.
 
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jimbo said:
Which is still meddling in politics
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Also saw a pastor last week going full Alex Jones in his sermon complaining about the Bushes and Clintons getting together with the UN to form a one-world government. But yeah, apparently it is only a problem when left-wing churches do it...
 
Phys251 said:
Hmmm.

I agree that sectarianism, taken to an extreme, is dangerous. We see it in Syria. In Iraq. We saw it in Ireland. And there are many, many more examples.

However, the threat of sectarianism is not an excuse to tolerate evil within an organization or religion. If somebody is found to be in gross violation of common-sense rules, then there will be penalties that could include expulsion. Their powers to do this are far less restricted than the powers of governments are. So the Methodist Church is well within their rights, and frankly, I see no problem with what they are considering doing to an absolutely deplorable member of theirs.
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Not quite sure how this is any different than someone being excommunicated for a wrongdoing in a Catholic church.

Good for them. Nice to see that some religious leaders are standing up to this. It's about time.
 
If Sessions hadn't recused himself I'd wear a MAGU cap...make attorney general unemployed.
 
Felis Leo said:
Religious persecution, sanctimonious grandstanding and bigoted castigation is always wrong. Until it isn't.
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Does the speaker or target not matter, bearing in mind the capacity in which the speaker speaks and the nature of his employer?

Why should church leaders be condemned for saying that Trump violates their church's teachings?

Were all the politician-boosting ties between GOP candidates and various churches suspect? Is positive OK but negative is "persecution, sanctimonious grandstanding and bigoted castigation"? Does it depend on the letters next to the names?







Felis Leo said:
I do not care if they do not like it. I'm atheist enough to know that they are not God and should not pretend that their beliefs are God's beliefs. Last I checked the Methodist Church was neither the Democratic Methodist Church nor the Republican Methodist Church. There is no excuse to take one's partisan secular political positions or legal actions as a governmental officer as grounds for other members of that congregation to try and excommunicate that member. That is disgusting, revolting and wrong.

Perhaps members of your own church who hated you for your political beliefs got you kicked out of your own congregation, and you feel that what is sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander. But people who try to pose their political beliefs as God's Holy Writ and then cudgel fellow members of their church with it ("Submit yourself to my...I mean God's political agenda or we kick you out!" make me sick. It is evil, cruel, and self-destructive.
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Well, we haven't had many exchanges. If you're that vehement about religious figures telling people what is right and wrong, no matter what the context, then nevermind.
 
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Geoist said:
Sessions also puts the Methodists in a difficult position as he was quoting the Bible to justify the Trump Administration's immigration policy. Remember, they did not take this action until he started (ab)using the Bible.
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Fair point.
 
GeoiNst said:
Also saw a pastor last week going full Alex Jones in his sermon complaining about the Bushes and Clintons getting together with the UN to form a one-world government. But yeah, apparently it is only a problem when left-wing churches do it...
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Not for me it isn't. Churches need to stay out of politics. Politics need to stay out of churches
 
Oborosen said:
Yeah, lets use suffering children as a bargaining chip.

Why am I not surprises this is getting praise from liberals...
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Now that's impressive.

You are actually going with the public's rebuke of trump's implementation of a policy to leverage votes from the democrats for his wall that resulted in him abandoning that policy was the LIBERALS using the kids as a bargaining chip?

This is what you actually think?

Or is this the pathetic crisis response you heard on conservative media somewhere?
 
What if...? said:
Now that's impressive.

You are actually going with the public's rebuke of trump's implementation of a policy to leverage votes from the democrats for his wall that resulted in him abandoning that policy was the LIBERALS using the kids as a bargaining chip?

This is what you actually think?

Or is this the pathetic crisis response you heard on conservative media somewhere?
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Actually no, this was simply in the vein of a church doing as such and it getting said praise. Nothing more, nothing less.

But if you want to treat it like that, then yes. It is hypocritical to say as such, even though both sides are still doing this in spades. We have one side who will do nothing but plaster these kids faces up on the wall and scream stop. Even though they really don't give a **** about these children in the first place and we have another side that is using this policy to try in forcing the others hand. On an option that has been on the table for long enough now and one that actually could help stem this same problem.

So yea, I'll stand on the side of the hypocrites who at least have something substantial to offer. Not the ones that just point their finger, shout shame and still have no merit, or clout to back it up.
 
Oborosen said:
Actually no, this was simply in the vein of a church doing as such and it getting said praise. Nothing more, nothing less.

But if you want to treat it like that, then yes. It is hypocritical to say as such, even though both sides are still doing this in spades. We have one side who will do nothing but plaster these kids faces up on the wall and scream stop. Even though they really don't give a **** about these children in the first place and we have another side that is using this policy to try in forcing the others hand. On an option that has been on the table for long enough now and one that actually could help stem this same problem.

So yea, I'll stand on the side of the hypocrites who at least have something substantial to offer. Not the ones that just point their finger, shout shame and still have no merit, or clout to back it up.
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Ever think that maybe when a congregation or a group of people speak up about something that goes against their personal moral values and that they find reprehensible that they’re just speaking up about something that goes against their personal moral values and that they find reprehensible?
 
Oborosen said:
Actually no, this was simply in the vein of a church doing as such and it getting said praise. Nothing more, nothing less.

But if you want to treat it like that, then yes. It is hypocritical to say as such, even though both sides are still doing this in spades. We have one side who will do nothing but plaster these kids faces up on the wall and scream stop. Even though they really don't give a **** about these children in the first place and we have another side that is using this policy to try in forcing the others hand. On an option that has been on the table for long enough now and one that actually could help stem this same problem.

So yea, I'll stand on the side of the hypocrites who at least have something substantial to offer. Not the ones that just point their finger, shout shame and still have no merit, or clout to back it up.
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You do know they raked Obama over the coals for the kids in cages, right?

So it's not just because its trump.

I wouldn't burn sown a house to kill a rat.

And I wouldn't build a wall when a far cheaper option isn't even being implemented.

If they had gone after employers years ago we wouldn't have this problem anymore. We'd have a guest worker program instead.

And you really need to ask yourself why your side encourages you to hate and fear those on one side of the equation while ignoring the other. One side demonized and blamed for a host of ills. The other? Silence.

Hell, employers would be complicit in all that alleged voter fraud, right? Silence on that angle too.

I posit that its because they are used by the donor class, the donor class enjoys the wage suppression, and they are useful scapegoats. For the donor class. And republican toadying to said class.
 
Oborosen said:
Yeah, lets use suffering children as a bargaining chip.

Why am I not surprises this is getting praise from liberals...
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No, that's what Donnie Twump has been doing. The Methodist Church is simply addressing actions by one of its members that are not in accordance with their standards.

Why am I not surprised a conservative would be compelled to be dishonest about something like this?
 
cuban smokes said:
kick him out, kick him out, kick him out ...........


and if SMU could bulldoze the G W Bush Library then that would be pretty cool too
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so, rewards for disgusting & evil deeds is hate?

so, your God is full of hate .............. got it ...........
 
Yes, that is entirely possible. Unless we are talking about the political left.

Who historically hasn't really given a **** about the lives of the homeless, the downtrodden and especially immigrants in general both legal/illegal. Except when has served some purpose of theirs in nearly every measure.

This constant stream of stupidity is getting tiresome.
 
What if...? said:
You do know they raked Obama over the coals for the kids in cages, right?

So it's not just because its trump.

I wouldn't burn sown a house to kill a rat.

And I wouldn't build a wall when a far cheaper option isn't even being implemented.

If they had gone after employers years ago we wouldn't have this problem anymore. We'd have a guest worker program instead.

And you really need to ask yourself why your side encourages you to hate and fear those on one side of the equation while ignoring the other. One side demonized and blamed for a host of ills. The other? Silence.

Hell, employers would be complicit in all that alleged voter fraud, right? Silence on that angle too.

I posit that its because they are used by the donor class, the donor class enjoys the wage suppression, and they are useful scapegoats. For the donor class. And republican toadying to said class.
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Because at least my side is still being marginally rational. We don't have people lying about what is going on in these shelters. We don't have people actively calling for violence against those who support this policy, or their children. We don't have people who claim to care about the ones being detain, or their children. Yet somehow have been silent about these same practices as they transpired in the past. Not to mention the same treatment that has separated thousands of children from their parents every year due to drug control.

The continued acting from the left, though impassioned it may be. Is pathetic to say the very least.

These people commit a criminal act when they enter the country illegally, plain and simple.
Blaming the people who enforce the law. Is like berating the police officer who stops your mugger mid stab, saying that the mugger should get to finish their job.
 
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