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Amazon 'Questions' Its Growth In Seattle After City Passes Watered-Down Tax to Help Homeless

zimmer

zimmer

Educating the Ignorant
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Amazon wasn’t the only company left grumbling. Starbucks also responded, with public affairs chief John Kelley saying Seattle “continues to spend without reforming and fail without accountability, while ignoring the plight of hundreds of children sleeping outside.”


“If they cannot provide a warm meal and safe bed to a five year-old child, no one believes they will be able to make housing affordable or address opiate addiction,” Kelley said.

Amazon Fumes After Seattle Passes Tax to Help Homeless | Fortune
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Leftists can do anything and everything. They just can. We witnessed it with Obama, the guy who claimed he could stop oceans from rising.

I bet, if they had enough tax money, they could stop Seattle from being in a rain forest. That would help the homeless a lot.
 
They should all leave, respond to what Seattle is doing.
 
zimmer said:
Leftists can do anything and everything. They just can. We witnessed it with Obama, the guy who claimed he could stop oceans from rising.

I bet, if they had enough tax money, they could stop Seattle from being in a rain forest. That would help the homeless a lot.
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This is some pretty bizarre logic being used by city leaders. They are going to drive their golden geese away. I especially like this quote:

“This legislation will help us address our homelessness crisis without jeopardizing critical jobs. Because this ordinance represents a true shared solution, and because it lifts up those who have been left behind while also ensuring accountability and transparency, I plan to sign this legislation into law,” said Durkan.
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They are absolutely jeopardizing critical jobs -- both limiting opportunity for growth, and providing another excuse for trickling jobs to other areas. Taxing 3% of the employers isn't really 'sharing', and I don't see how this holds city leaders accountable.

I keep thinking of Detroit, which once had a lock on the auto industry, until the city and state kept making it harder to do business there. Those employers have shifted to other areas. They DO now have a housing surplus though.
 
dcsports said:
This is some pretty bizarre logic being used by city leaders. They are going to drive their golden geese away. I especially like this quote:



They are absolutely jeopardizing critical jobs -- both limiting opportunity for growth, and providing another excuse for trickling jobs to other areas. Taxing 3% of the employers isn't really 'sharing', and I don't see how this holds city leaders accountable.

I keep thinking of Detroit, which once had a lock on the auto industry, until the city and state kept making it harder to do business there. Those employers have shifted to other areas. They DO now have a housing surplus though.
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I think they misprinted the name of the guy... its should be Drunken instead of Durkan.
 
Maybe all of these "legislators" should volunteer to give up their seat to a homeless person..

djl
 
All of the goofy laws they've been passing in Seattle have been driving home prices up in a lot of the commutable suburbs. I suppose I should be happy my property values are spiking, but things like this and the sugar tax just make me shake my head.
 
I wonder if this is why they raised Amazon Prime $20 recently. Amazon isn't paying this additional tax, Prime users are. Besides, Amazon already pays Seattle $275,000,000 in taxes. That buys a lot of homeless shelters.
 
TTB said:
All of the goofy laws they've been passing in Seattle have been driving home prices up in a lot of the commutable suburbs. .
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So it's the laws that are causing prices to soar? As opposed to supply and demand? WTF are you even talking about?
 
TTB said:
All of the goofy laws they've been passing in Seattle have been driving home prices up in a lot of the commutable suburbs. I suppose I should be happy my property values are spiking, but things like this and the sugar tax just make me shake my head.
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What's driving up home prices is primarily demand, which is a function of the number of huge and extremely successful businesses that have grown up there. Microsoft, Amazon, Costco, Starbucks, Boeing, and on and on. Demand for homes exceeds supply. People with money (many of whom work for these massive companies) are willing to pay a lot. This drives up prices.

Seattle voters have elected crazy people to run the city. One in particular stands out. Her name is Kshama Sawant. She is the tail that wags the dog on the Seattle City Council and, by extension, state legislators in Olympia.

Sawant has called the city's most successful businesses economic terrorists, she's called them bullies, she's accused them of extortion, she's accused them of holding people hostage, she's directly accused them of creating the city's homelessness problem despite the knowledge that the city does not enforce laws against people who happen to be homeless the way most other cities do enforce laws, and finally she's suggested that only the largest and most successful companies that call Seattle home should be taxed in return for further subsidizing housing for the city's homeless.

In response to all this insane rhetoric, companies are considering reducing their presence in this city which has become so hostile to them. As any rational person who runs a business would. It's a big country and Seattle has turned intensely anti-business. I really cannot imagine how anyone could more successfully drive businesses away than what Kshama Sawant is doing. And the Seattle City Council is nodding along with her and being excessively tolerant of her hostility. It's hurting the city. They need to clean house.
 
Neomalthusian said:
What's driving up home prices is primarily demand, which is a function of the number of huge and extremely successful businesses that have grown up there. Microsoft, Amazon, Costco, Starbucks, Boeing, and on and on. Demand for homes exceeds supply. People with money (many of whom work for these massive companies) are willing to pay a lot. This drives up prices.

Seattle voters have elected crazy people to run the city. One in particular stands out. Her name is Kshama Sawant. She is the tail that wags the dog on the Seattle City Council and, by extension, state legislators in Olympia.

Sawant has called the city's most successful businesses economic terrorists, she's called them bullies, she's accused them of extortion, she's accused them of holding people hostage, she's directly accused them of creating the city's homelessness problem despite the knowledge that the city does not enforce laws against people who happen to be homeless the way most other cities do enforce laws, and finally she's suggested that only the largest and most successful companies that call Seattle home should be taxed in return for further subsidizing housing for the city's homeless.

In response to all this insane rhetoric, companies are considering reducing their presence in this city which has become so hostile to them. As any rational person who runs a business would. It's a big country and Seattle has turned intensely anti-business. I really cannot imagine how anyone could more successfully drive businesses away than what Kshama Sawant is doing. And the Seattle City Council is nodding along with her and being excessively tolerant of her hostility. It's hurting the city. They need to clean house.
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It goes beyond one person, although I don't doubt there are a few instigators. The 'watered down' law was passed unanimously -- which means that every person on that city council supported this ridiculous plan.

Worth repeating from the Starbuck's executive...

Amazon wasn’t the only company left grumbling. Starbucks also responded, with public affairs chief John Kelley saying Seattle “continues to spend without reforming and fail without accountability, while ignoring the plight of hundreds of children sleeping outside.” “If they cannot provide a warm meal and safe bed to a five year-old child, no one believes they will be able to make housing affordable or address opiate addiction,” Kelley said.
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The threat of an income tax in king county/Seattle and the rising miscellaneous taxes are adding to the pressure caused by high rent rates. This combined with the recent return of the commuter ferries which reduce crossing times from other communities are causing places like my home-town to have a demand increase in their housing which is leading to a price spike. That way people can just commute to Seattle for work and avoid most of the taxes and policies that have been proposed/enacted for the City.

Or, in short, there is an increasing demand for out of City housing due to varied policies and laws which is making housing prices go up faster in suburbs. It's all supply and demand still. Heck, people are driving out of the Seattle area to buy sugary beverages due to the taxes too.
 
dcsports said:
It goes beyond one person, although I don't doubt there are a few instigators. The 'watered down' law was passed unanimously -- which means that every person on that city council supported this ridiculous plan.
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Yes, but as I said, I think Sawant is the tail that wags the dog right now.
 
TTB said:
The threat of an income tax in king county/Seattle and the rising miscellaneous taxes are adding to the pressure caused by high rent rates. This combined with the recent return of the commuter ferries which reduce crossing times from other communities are causing places like my home-town to have a demand increase in their housing which is leading to a price spike. That way people can just commute to Seattle for work and avoid most of the taxes and policies that have been proposed/enacted for the City.

Or, in short, there is an increasing demand for out of City housing due to varied policies and laws which is making housing prices go up faster in suburbs. It's all supply and demand still. Heck, people are driving out of the Seattle area to buy sugary beverages due to the taxes too.
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And from an urban planning standpoint, the problem with that is that unless big employers start doing the same (spreading out), it tends to magnify traffic congestion problems, which worsens quality of life for a lot of people.
 
Neomalthusian said:
And from an urban planning standpoint, the problem with that is that unless big employers start doing the same (spreading out), it tends to magnify traffic congestion problems, which worsens quality of life for a lot of people.
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But then if big employers start to spread out (read: leave Seattle), certain people on the City Council start calling them "economic terrorists."
 
Waddy said:
I wonder if this is why they raised Amazon Prime $20 recently. Amazon isn't paying this additional tax, Prime users are. Besides, Amazon already pays Seattle $275,000,000 in taxes. That buys a lot of homeless shelters.
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Yeah. That's bull**** too. THere's a good chance I wont be renewing my Prime membership.
 
Neomalthusian said:
But then if big employers start to spread out (read: leave Seattle), certain people on the City Council start calling them "economic terrorists."
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The traffic in the Seattle metro area was horrendous before Amazon built it's new campus in downtown on Lake Union.

They were idiots to do that in the first place IMO. They lose potential employees right there.
 
Lursa said:
Yeah. That's bull**** too. THere's a good chance I wont be renewing my Prime membership.
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Always keep in mind when somebody starts talking about raising taxes on a company that the company pays zero tax, none; the customer pays the taxes when they buy the product. As in;

"Well, they're a big company, they can afford some extra tax"

More accurately;

"Well, they're a big company, their customers can afford some extra tax".
 
Waddy said:
Always keep in mind when somebody starts talking about raising taxes on a company that the company pays zero tax, none; the customer pays the taxes when they buy the product. As in;

"Well, they're a big company, they can afford some extra tax"

More accurately;

"Well, they're a big company, their customers can afford some extra tax".
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This is very disingenuous and misleading from a municipal taxation standpoint. Municipalities collect tax revenues. Where does that money come from? The local economy, one way or another. What does that mean? It means the people that live, work, study, shop, vacation, and play there, their money ends up in the municipal government's bank account. The government then turns around and reinvests that money back into its local economy in ways that are supposed to maintain and improve the economy further.

What would happen to the city's tax revenues if Amazon, Costco, Microsoft, Starbucks, and Boeing all evacuated the city and set up their business in another state? Would the city's tax revenues stay the same, or go down? They'd go down. But HOW?!? If those companies pay zero tax, then why would the city's tax revenues go down if those companies fled?

If a municipality taxed sales but not property, one could say (kind of like you're saying) "property owners pay no tax!!!! NONE!!!" But this complaint is disingenuous because property owners do pay taxes, it's just that property isn't the thing on which taxes are calculated. If a municipality taxed property but not sales, one could say (kind of like you're saying) "consumers who buy things from our local businesses pay no taxes! NONE!!!" But this is disingenuous because many of those consumers own or rent property which generates the city's taxes. So they do pay taxes.

There is no point squawking about "companies not paying taxes" when it is obvious that the existence of these massive companies in Seattle contribute heavily to the amount of taxes the City is able to bring in each year. Which if you want know more about it, you start here. https://www.seattle.gov/financedepartment/0102Adopted/City Revenue Overview.pdf

The City collects taxes. This extracts money from people who live in and/or work in and/or visit Seattle. The money extracted from the economy is reinvested back into the local economy. If these massive businesses you squawk about not paying taxes did not do business in Seattle, the city's revenues would plummet. Therefore these companies do directly contribute to the generous tax revenues Seattle is able to raise. The people who are in Seattle because those companies are located in Seattle are the same people who pay a great deal of the tax revenues to the City.

So enough with the disingenuous squawking about companies not paying taxes.
 
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Neomalthusian said:
This is very disingenuous and misleading from a municipal taxation standpoint. Municipalities collect tax revenues. Where does that money come from? The local economy, one way or another. What does that mean? It means the people that live, work, study, shop, vacation, and play there, their money ends up in the municipal government's bank account. The government then turns around and reinvests that money back into its local economy in ways that are supposed to maintain and improve the economy further.

What would happen to the city's tax revenues if Amazon, Costco, Microsoft, Starbucks, and Boeing all evacuated the city and set up their business in another state? Would the city's tax revenues stay the same, or go down? They'd go down. But HOW?!? If those companies pay zero tax, then why would the city's tax revenues go down if those companies fled?

If a municipality taxed sales but not property, one could say (kind of like you're saying) "property owners pay no tax!!!! NONE!!!" But this complaint is disingenuous because property owners do pay taxes, it's just that property isn't the thing on which taxes are calculated. If a municipality taxed property but not sales, one could say (kind of like you're saying) "consumers who buy things from our local businesses pay no taxes! NONE!!!" But this is disingenuous because many of those consumers own or rent property which generates the city's taxes. So they do pay taxes.

There is no point squawking about "companies not paying taxes" when it is obvious that the existence of these massive companies in Seattle contribute heavily to the amount of taxes the City is able to bring in each year. Which if you want know more about it, you start here. https://www.seattle.gov/financedepartment/0102Adopted/City Revenue Overview.pdf

The City collects taxes. This extracts money from people who live in and/or work in and/or visit Seattle. The money extracted from the economy is reinvested back into the local economy. If these massive businesses you squawk about not paying taxes did not do business in Seattle, the city's revenues would plummet. Therefore these companies do directly contribute to the generous tax revenues Seattle is able to raise. The people who are in Seattle because those companies are located in Seattle are the same people who pay a great deal of the tax revenues to the City.

So enough with the disingenuous squawking about companies not paying taxes.
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These businesses (that you named) have entire satellite's worth of businesses and services and contract agencies and related businesses feeding into local taxes (among other things). Those corporations support thousands of additional businesses that depend almost or completely on them. And for every service, coffee, meal, etc they sell...there's sales tax.

And our sales tax is almost 10%.
 
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