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Fast & Furious Redux, Sharyl Attkisson

Thoreau72

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Attkisson interviewed ATF Agent John Dodson yesterday regarding any progress on Fast 'n Furious.

Also Jason Chaffetz, retiring from Congress.

https://sharylattkisson.com/

It seems the US Department of Justice is not the least bit interested in justice. Magnificent cover-up ongoing at that department. Given this, how does the agency have any credibility at all? Holder and Lynch seem as rotten as they come.

Thoughts?
 
Attkisson interviewed ATF Agent John Dodson yesterday regarding any progress on Fast 'n Furious.

Also Jason Chaffetz, retiring from Congress.

https://sharylattkisson.com/

It seems the US Department of Justice is not the least bit interested in justice. Magnificent cover-up ongoing at that department. Given this, how does the agency have any credibility at all? Holder and Lynch seem as rotten as they come.

Thoughts?

Just so we're all clear : Fast & Furious, in this context, is not referring to those dead-beaten, milked, cashed-out, overused, crappy & pointless movies with bald dudes & cars ?
 
Just so we're all clear : Fast & Furious, in this context, is not referring to those dead-beaten, milked, cashed-out, overused, crappy & pointless movies with bald dudes & cars ?

Correct. We are talking about the operation run by ATF, and approved by Eric Holder and others at the Justice Department. The operation that Congress began to investigate, but about which Obama invoked Executive Privilege to keep secret from Congress. The operation that "walked" many semi-automatic weapons across the border and elsewhere, weapons which were used in the deaths of at least one or two US agents.
 
Just so we're all clear : Fast & Furious, in this context, is not referring to those dead-beaten, milked, cashed-out, overused, crappy & pointless movies with bald dudes & cars ?

Correct, its the scandal where left elitists in the US government, while pushing for gun control of its citizens, allowed guns to become possessions of Mexican drug cartel members. The alleged purpose was to track the firearms after they were used to commit crimes including murder.

What idiocy...
 
Μολὼν λαβέ;1067352578 said:
Correct, its the scandal where left elitists in the US government, while pushing for gun control of its citizens, allowed guns to become possessions of Mexican drug cartel members. The alleged purpose was to track the firearms after they were used to commit crimes including murder.

What idiocy...

Greetings, Mo. :2wave:

:agree: They really needed to track those firearms, since everyone knows firearms have a mind of their own! How could anyone ever question that reasoning? :doh
 
Μολὼν λαβέ;1067352578 said:
Correct, its the scandal where left elitists in the US government, while pushing for gun control of its citizens, allowed guns to become possessions of Mexican drug cartel members. The alleged purpose was to track the firearms after they were used to commit crimes including murder.

What idiocy...
Wasn't the program started in 2006 before the Obama administration? Or are you saying that the Bush administration was trying to take everyone's guns away? Or are you just angry and not making a coherent point?
 
Greetings, Mo. :2wave:

:agree: They really needed to track those firearms, since everyone knows firearms have a mind of their own! How could anyone ever question that reasoning? :doh

Greetings, Miss P! :2wave:

:thumbs:
 
Wasn't the program started in 2006 before the Obama administration?

Fast & Furious began under the Obama administration in 2009.

Or are you saying that the Bush administration was trying to take everyone's guns away?

How could a rational or logical person infer that from what I stated? (The answer is they can't.)

Or are you just angry and not making a coherent point?

The anger these days is coming from libtards. Everyone knows that.

My statements are logical and easy to understand to coherent and rational people.
 
Μολὼν λαβέ;1067352954 said:
Fast & Furious began under the Obama administration in 2009.

Same tactic, different name. It was called operation wide receiver under Bush, but it was the exact same program run out of the exact same location. If you want to hang your hat on "but it's a different name!" then go right ahead. But this tactic, although it was ended under Obama, it was not started under Obama.
 
Same tactic, different name. It was called operation wide receiver under Bush, but it was the exact same program run out of the exact same location. If you want to hang your hat on "but it's a different name!" then go right ahead. But this tactic, although it was ended under Obama, it was not started under Obama.

Though I started the thread, I make no claim to expert status on F&F, but I think you're right--it originally started under Bush, and then was continued under Obama. Similar to the operation against Koresh at Waco, begun under Bush 41 and continued under Clinton.

And that is an excellent point, for as Dodson the ATF whistleblower noted, the cover-up is within the Justice Department, and so happens to include the White House. That is the real moral of the story IMO. The perps are within the US Justice Department, and so far it appears Donald does not want to drain that particular part of the swamp. That was the point Chaffetz made.
 
Though I started the thread, I make no claim to expert status on F&F, but I think you're right--it originally started under Bush, and then was continued under Obama. Similar to the operation against Koresh at Waco, begun under Bush 41 and continued under Clinton.

And that is an excellent point, for as Dodson the ATF whistleblower noted, the cover-up is within the Justice Department, and so happens to include the White House. That is the real moral of the story IMO. The perps are within the US Justice Department, and so far it appears Donald does not want to drain that particular part of the swamp. That was the point Chaffetz made.

Technically no it wasn't continued. Wide Reciever started in 06 and ended 07. Fast and Furious started in 09 and ended 2010. It was a restarted bad program.

Those that don't learn from history repeat history.
 
Technically no it wasn't continued. Wide Reciever started in 06 and ended 07. Fast and Furious started in 09 and ended 2010. It was a restarted bad program.

Those that don't learn from history repeat history.

Restarted (or unended) bad programs are rather the hallmark of the federal government, aren't they? Like the way Jeff Sessions wants to restart the War On Drugs?

Again, what I find interesting is that nobody within the Justice Department or the Executive Branch wants to get to the bottom of the F&F scandal. They prefer the cover-up. Typical of government.
 
The outrage over Fast and Furious always seems far out of proportion to the operation itself.

We are talking about ~2000 weapons that were legally purchased in the U.S. and then illegally smuggled to Mexico by a small handful of cartel agents in Phoenix, AZ. There is no reason to believe they represent even a tiny fraction of the groups doing this every day. About a third were recovered, so that's 1300ish extra weapons knocking around in Mexico. Not significant.

The cartels have ready access to military stockpiles throughout Central and South America and more money than the Catholic Church, so it is laughable to imagine that if F&F hadn't allowed those guns to cross the border that they would have had trouble arming their goons.

I don't disagree it was bad, ineffective way to try to track guns into cartels, but it didn't get anyone killed or grant cartels access to anything they didn't already have.
 
Μολὼν λαβέ;1067352578 said:
Correct, its the scandal where left elitists in the US government, while pushing for gun control of its citizens, allowed guns to become possessions of Mexican drug cartel members. The alleged purpose was to track the firearms after they were used to commit crimes including murder.

What idiocy...


Which was a continuation of Operation Wide Receiver, the right elitists in the US government allowed guns to become possessions of Mexican Drug cartels
 
The outrage over Fast and Furious always seems far out of proportion to the operation itself.

We are talking about ~2000 weapons that were legally purchased in the U.S. and then illegally smuggled to Mexico by a small handful of cartel agents in Phoenix, AZ. There is no reason to believe they represent even a tiny fraction of the groups doing this every day. About a third were recovered, so that's 1300ish extra weapons knocking around in Mexico. Not significant.

The cartels have ready access to military stockpiles throughout Central and South America and more money than the Catholic Church, so it is laughable to imagine that if F&F hadn't allowed those guns to cross the border that they would have had trouble arming their goons.

I don't disagree it was bad, ineffective way to try to track guns into cartels, but it didn't get anyone killed or grant cartels access to anything they didn't already have.

A border agent, Brian Terry was killed with one of those weapons...
https://www.google.com/amp/www.chic...killing-arrest-mexico-20170413-story,amp.html
 
Which was a continuation of Operation Wide Receiver, the right elitists in the US government allowed guns to become possessions of Mexican Drug cartels

So did the left elites under Obama. :roll:
 
I remember reading a long investigative piece in one of the financial magazines, Forbes or Fortune. It struck me odd that it was in that type of publication. Anyway it was started under GW and the focus was originally not to track arms across the border but to bust up the people responsible for all the straw purchases that was putting those arms on the street in the first place. The name change to Fast and Furious came from the hot rod imports a lot of the buyers drove. Prosecutions were difficult because the laws have so many loopholes in them. Really annoying when they highlighted cases of young Americans legally buying dozens of firearms in less than a year from various dealers, but it was hard to prove intent or something like that to prosecute.
I need to find that information because what I read was definitely not what I was hearing on TV and web. I'd also like to know what the prosecution rate ended up being for those actually charged. Regardless, I don't think many outside the ATF really know all the details and likely not that many in the ATF. I also don't think the guy in that interview came off all that well in the article. If I find it, I'll be back.
 
A border agent, Brian Terry was killed with one of those weapons...
https://www.google.com/amp/www.chic...killing-arrest-mexico-20170413-story,amp.html

If not for Fast and Furious, the cartel thug that shot him would have just been pointing a finger at him and going "pew pew," right?

The guns involved in F&F were a very small drop in a very large bucket.

While a clear tragedy, the officer's death has more to do with our persistence in the War on Drugs, than with trying to track illegal weapon sales in a misguided effort to prosecute cartel members.
 
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Attkisson interviewed ATF Agent John Dodson yesterday regarding any progress on Fast 'n Furious.

Also Jason Chaffetz, retiring from Congress.

https://sharylattkisson.com/

It seems the US Department of Justice is not the least bit interested in justice. Magnificent cover-up ongoing at that department. Given this, how does the agency have any credibility at all? Holder and Lynch seem as rotten as they come.

Thoughts?

I love how the liberals try to defend this fiasco.
 
Wasn't the program started in 2006 before the Obama administration? Or are you saying that the Bush administration was trying to take everyone's guns away? Or are you just angry and not making a coherent point?

There was a different program that was started previous to the Obama administration called Operation Wide Receiver. it was 2006 and 2007. In that one they arrested the people with the guns before they crossed into Mexico instead of allowing them to cross as Operation Fast and Furious did. It was cancelled though as the convictions they got were too few for the millions of dollars spent on the program.
 
There was a different program that was started previous to the Obama administration called Operation Wide Receiver. it was 2006 and 2007. In that one they arrested the people with the guns before they crossed into Mexico instead of allowing them to cross as Operation Fast and Furious did. It was cancelled though as the convictions they got were too few for the millions of dollars spent on the program.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ATF_gunwalking_scandal#Operation_Wide_Receiver
Operation Wide Receiver

The suspicious sale of AR-15s led to Operation Wide Receiver.[31]
The first known ATF "gunwalking" operation to Mexican drug cartels, named Operation Wide Receiver, began in early 2006 and ran into late 2007. Licensed dealer Mike Detty of Mad Dawg Global informed the ATF of a suspicious gun purchase that took place in February 2006 in Tucson, Arizona. In March he was hired as a confidential informant working with the ATF's Tucson office, part of their Phoenix, Arizona field division.[31]

With the use of surveillance equipment, ATF agents monitored additional sales by Detty to straw purchasers. With assurance from ATF "that Mexican officials would be conducting surveillance or interdictions when guns got to the other side of the border",[12] Detty would sell a total of about 450 guns during the operation.[30] These included AR-15s, semi-automatic AK-pattern rifles, and Colt .38s. The majority of the guns were eventually lost as they moved into Mexico.[6][31][32][33]
You must have heard that incorrectly, because they most definitely lost many of the guns.
 
I didn't say they didn't lose any guns. The point is this program was intended not to have any guns get to Mexico. fast and furious intentionally was letting them into mexico.
Still wrong. It clearly says the Mexican authorities were supposed to arrest them AFTER they crossed the border. Not before. Exact same thing.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk
 
I love how the liberals try to defend this fiasco.

I understand your point, but the evidence presented by Dodson and Attkisson and Chaffetz show the cover-up to be very much bipartisan. Dodson and Chaffetz both pointed out that Trump, a conservative I'm told, will also not touch it. He is honoring the cover-up, and refusing to drain that part of the swamp.
 
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