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Trump orders review of national monuments to allow development

The oil and gas industry is the people and any other exploration companies. And the government last I heard works for the people. As much as Obama wanted a huge land grab, Trump is giving it back.

Well, good luck changing the Antiquities Law, and hopefully the oil and gas industry never comes for any land precious to you, like the graveyards of your grandfathers.
 
The 9th circuit is waiting for their turn.
 
Well, good luck changing the Antiquities Law, and hopefully the oil and gas industry never comes for any land precious to you, like the graveyards of your grandfathers.

Sorry the Antiquities law does not cover land grabbing 1,351,849 acres. It's going back to the state of Utah
 
Sorry the Antiquities law does not cover land grabbing 1,351,849 acres. It's going back to the state of Utah

If you'd read through this thread, you would've seen this misconception has already been dispelled. "Federal Land Grabbing" did not occur. Although that is a conservative wet dream because they love to play the victim card. Sorry, wait for another situation to exploit!
 
Sorry the Antiquities law does not cover land grabbing 1,351,849 acres. It's going back to the state of Utah

Visbek said:
That's... not what happened.

The Antiquities Act of 1906 empowers the President to designated federal lands as monuments.

Obama designated 1.65 million acres in Utah and Nevada as national monuments in December. The federal government already owned the land. What this designation does is add a layer of protection on the lands, similar to that of a national park. Meanwhile, activities like grazing and timber management will continue.

State and private lands within the national monument are excluded from the designation. The Forest Service factsheet explains it best:

The national monument designation will not impact the rights of private landowners within or adjacent to the national monument, including existing access within the national monument boundary. In addition to the approximately 1.35 million acres of Federal lands, the Bears Ears National Monument boundary encompasses approximately 109,100 acres of land owned by the State of Utah and 12,600 acres owned by private landowners. The non-Federal lands within the national monument are not be part of the national monument unless subsequently and voluntarily acquired.
https://www.fs.fed.us/sites/default/...fact-sheet.pdf

Given that Bears Ears National Monument has around 100,000 sites with archaeological significance, including cliff dwellings, it hardly sounds all that absurd.

There is nothing unconstitutional about the Antiquities Act. Congress gave the Executive the power to designate national monuments over 100 years ago. The SCOTUS has repeatedly reviewed it, and found it to be constitutional. No land or property was seized. And if Congress doesn't want the President to be able to designate federal lands as a national monument, they can revise the Antiquities Act.


A duly elected President signs an executive order and a day or two later an appointed Judge never being elected to anything quashes it and ties the issue up in the courts for god only knows how long. Where does that kind of power come from fot unelected Judges?
From the Constitution.

The role of the Judiciary is to act as a check on improper use of power by the Legislative and/or Executive branches.

The Framers deliberately chose to make federal judges an appointed position, in order to isolate them to a degree from the normal political/electoral process.

The judiciary, in these cases (both travel ban and sanctuary cities), believe they've found those EOs to be unconstitutional, are blocking them until or unless the SCOTUS does a full review.

By the way, did you also think it was "authoritarian" when Obama declared he wanted to delay deportations for selected unauthorized immigrants? That was shot down by the courts, too. Was it absurd for the SCOTUS to scrutinize the ACA for possible violations of the Constitution? Yes, no?


Does anybody aside from me find such actions absurd, authoritarian and unconstitutional?
Nope.

The fact that you don't like something, or that it was enacted by a President you dislike, doesn't make it either authoritarian or unconstitutional.

That about covers it.
 
The aim is not to give land back to the States but to give land to corporations.

So are you saying the land is literally going to be given over to corporation ownership? Or are you saying that it will be given back to the states and that they will have the choice to maintain the status quo or to open it up for resource exploration and development?
 
This measure is not about empowering states to choose any more than Conservative's bogus claims about healthcare were. This measure is solely about lining the pockets of the oil and gas industry. The oil and gas industry purchased the Republican party sometime ago, and they are looking for a return on their investment. Once again not state's rights, oil and gas rights to drill on protected land. To paraphrase the article that I'm sure you all read dilligently, "Trump is walking into dangerous territory regarding political moves and moral moves, and he could risk the Keystoneization of many national monuments as he seeks to open them up for drilling."

Wrong. And can anyone ever see me accepting this when I don't agree with the extraction of fossil fuels to begin with, whether or not a (D) or (R) is in office. I voted Green party last election and I'm a legitimate anti-fracking, anti-drilling person.

So...who is the land going to belong to? The states, right? If you have evidence that Trump plans to give the land to oil industry ownership please provide it.
 
For you maybe, but not me.

What do you dispute? You have no legal or constitutional argument. Personally you may disagree. But, for all intents and purposes bears ears stands.

Trump opening it up for review will be challenged.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
So are you saying the land is literally going to be given over to corporation ownership? Or are you saying that it will be given back to the states and that they will have the choice to maintain the status quo or to open it up for resource exploration and development?

A distinction without a difference.
 
So...who is the land going to belong to? The states, right? If you have evidence that Trump plans to give the land to oil industry ownership please provide it.

The article addresses pretty much everything.
 
A distinction without a difference.

It's a huge distinction. It's giving the option to make the decision with the rightful government, instead of federalizing states. What a ridiculous comment.
 
The article addresses pretty much everything.

So, yes, it's going to go back to the states. That's all you had to say.
 
So, yes, it's going to go back to the states. That's all you had to say.

No. you don't understand. It's kind of complicated a story, that does take a little contemplation.

There's an assload of Federal land in this country. It belongs to all of us. It's public land. Within UT there is a lot of Federal land. Like over 50% of the land in UT is Federal Land. Obama designated a spot of Federal land in SE UT a National Monument. He did not steal private land. The land was already public.

Trump isn't returning Bears Ears to the Feds who already owned it. He isn't returning Federal land to anyone. He's opening up a review for 30 or so National Monuments. His interior secretary Ryan Zinke has to review monuments to decide, to rescind their monument status. This doesn't change the ownership of the land. But, it rescinds a ban on oil and gas drilling, included in the status of a national monument.
 
No. you don't understand. It's kind of complicated a story, that does take a little contemplation.

There's an assload of Federal land in this country. It belongs to all of us. It's public land. Within UT there is a lot of Federal land. Like over 50% of the land in UT is Federal Land. Obama designated a spot of Federal land in SE UT a National Monument. He did not steal private land. The land was already public.

Trump isn't returning Bears Ears to the Feds who already owned it. He isn't returning Federal land to anyone. He's opening up a review for 30 or so National Monuments. His interior secretary Ryan Zinke has to review monuments to decide, to rescind their monument status. This doesn't change the ownership of the land. But, it rescinds a ban on oil and gas drilling, included in the status of a national monument.

You don't have an issue with the federal government owning the majority of state in the west and the east coast and such are almost untouched? The federal government needs to get out of the land-grab business and stay in it's lane.
 
Texas was annexed and weren't most of the States created by acts of Congress from the territories?

Very few were actually annexed (mostly south western states). Most all of the states in the US applied to become states. At the time they were considered territories though and not states. A designation change however doesn't discount the fact that they applied to become states. Idaho for instance applied for statehood in the mid-1880's, yet the government "owns" over 60% of the land here. And yes, naturally it took an act of congress to accept territories into statehood. But before Congress can designate a territory as a State then that territory must first apply to become a state. Except of course in instances such as annexation.
 
You don't have an issue with the federal government owning the majority of state in the west and the east coast and such are almost untouched? The federal government needs to get out of the land-grab business and stay in it's lane.

Doesn't bother me. It's not a land grab. The Feds already owned the land. The most important thing to me is protecting Native American burial grounds and sacred historic tribal murals. I am also for squashing the oil and gas industry. I will admit, whenever the oil and gas industry is involved I am biased against them. I do not like them.
 
Doesn't bother me. It's not a land grab. The Feds already owned the land. The most important thing to me is protecting Native American burial grounds and sacred historic tribal murals. I am also for squashing the oil and gas industry. I will admit, whenever the oil and gas industry is involved I am biased against them. I do not like them.

Are you? I see you posting here on teh internez. If you actually were, you wouldn't be doing that.
 
It was Federal land to begin with. So, Obama designating Bears Ears a National monument protected public land for the people, from the oil and gas industry.

What's the excuse for Idaho? It was not federal land to begin with.
 
What's the excuse for Idaho? It was not federal land to begin with.

I think if I'm to take a stand on the law being the law, in the case of Bears Ears, if the Feds designated private land a national monument, the land should be returned to ~ whoever, because that wouldn't be sanctioned under the Antiquities Act.
 
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