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Trump's travel decree: What it means and how it works

chuckiechan

chuckiechan

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Trump's travel decree: What it means and how it works | Fox News

What does President Trump’s executive order do?

The purpose of the executive order is detecting “individuals with terrorist ties and stopping them from entering the United States” for 90 days if they come from any of seven countries -- Iran, Iraq, Libya, Somalia, Sudan, Syria and Yemen. The order suspends those granted refugee status for 120 days while the Trump administration reviews and reworks immigration screening procedures.

The order also states that refugees who are already in the process of being vetted may be admitted to the United States, but only after undergoing the revised screening processes.
Click to expand...

You should read the very concise article now that many of you have had a chance to rage at the "George Soros" version. It's just not all that scary. Unless you are of the "one world, no borders" persuasion that is, and getting rid of all that tired old "national sovereignty" clap-trap!
 
chuckiechan said:
Trump's travel decree: What it means and how it works | Fox News



You should read the very concise article now that many of you have had a chance to rage at the "George Soros" version. It's just not all that scary. Unless you are of the "one world, no borders" persuasion that is, and getting rid of all that tired old "national sovereignty" clap-trap!
Click to expand...

Perhaps you weren't made familiar with the current prevailing narrative.

Trump is literally Hitler and we will be Nazi Germany in 4 years.

Please don't reply with any facts or logic. I am only interested in feels and emotional anecdote.
 
When people are being detained at airports to go through a screening process that the President acknowledges hasn't been created yet, then the cart may not just be in front of the horse, but lapping it.
 
Koke said:
Perhaps you weren't made familiar with the current prevailing narrative.

Trump is literally Hitler and we will be Nazi Germany in 4 years.

Please don't reply with any facts or logic. I am only interested in feels and emotional anecdote.
Click to expand...

Godwin had a point. It seems he was right, When out of ammo revert to the (insert name here) is Hitler or a Nazi.
 
chuckiechan said:
Trump's travel decree: What it means and how it works | Fox News

You should read the very concise article now that many of you have had a chance to rage at the "George Soros" version. It's just not all that scary.
Click to expand...
Or: Those of us who know what's going on understand that it's very scary -- not only because of what it is and what it does, but because it was pushed out in the most childish and inept manner possible.

As noted, Trump hasn't put a new system for evaluating refugees or tourists into place. He's just slammed the door shut for 90 days on a handful of nations -- which just happen to be Muslim nations where Trump doesn't have any businesses.

They did in fact bar green card holders / permanent residents, until there was massive pushback from the public, Congress and lawyers.

Since no refugees from those nations have actually committed terrorist attacks, and since the current system is fairly extensive and takes about 2 years to complete, the ban is unnecessary. More important, it's offended Muslims around the world

We should note that Trump's weaseling out of "it's not a Muslim ban!" is slightly ridiculous, given that a) he proclaimed during the campaign that he wanted to ban Muslims from entering the US; b) he is actually following through on his campaign pledges; c) Giuliani admitted that it was a legal means to ban Muslims; d) his administration doesn't seem interested in expediting the process for Muslims who are in the minority in those nations, just Christians (a move which violates the 1st Amendment).

Hilariously, the article pointed out that international reaction was deeply negative.... except for the President of Czechoslovakia.

It shows Trump's authoritarian tendencies, including his willingness to trivialize public opposition. It's also not clear if the structure of the ban is legal, since this type of measure was very possibly outlawed in 1965.

It also shows how Trump and many of his top advisers are either total rank amateurs, or deliberately sowing chaos, or a combination of the two. In particular, Trump's inability to recognize the scope of the disorder stemming from his own actions is deeply worrisome.


Unless you are of the "one world, no borders" persuasion that is, and getting rid of all that tired old "national sovereignty" clap-trap!
Click to expand...
You don't need to advocate open borders to realize that this is a huge mistake.
 
Koke said:
Perhaps you weren't made familiar with the current prevailing narrative.

Trump is literally Hitler and we will be Nazi Germany in 4 years.

Please don't reply with any facts or logic. I am only interested in feels and emotional anecdote.
Click to expand...

NonoBadDog said:
Godwin had a point. It seems he was right, When out of ammo revert to the (insert name here) is Hitler or a Nazi.
Click to expand...

Your posts are very foolish.

"Godwin's law itself can be abused as a distraction, diversion or even as censorship, fallaciously miscasting an opponent's argument as hyperbole when the comparisons made by the argument are actually appropriate."

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law

Hands Off Hitler! - Reason.com
 
Absentglare said:
Your posts are very foolish.

"Godwin's law itself can be abused as a distraction, diversion or even as censorship, fallaciously miscasting an opponent's argument as hyperbole when the comparisons made by the argument are actually appropriate."

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law

Hands Off Hitler! - Reason.com
Click to expand...

You think that you are arguing with me while actually just restating what I said. I am glad you agree with me, even if you aren't aware enough to realize it.
 
Absentglare said:
Your posts are very foolish.

"Godwin's law itself can be abused as a distraction, diversion or even as censorship, fallaciously miscasting an opponent's argument as hyperbole when the comparisons made by the argument are actually appropriate."

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law

Hands Off Hitler! - Reason.com
Click to expand...

It seems you are distracted. What was the point of this thread again? Ah, that's right: defining the appropriateness of modern day usage of Godwin's law.
 
NonoBadDog said:
You think that you are arguing with me while actually just restating what I said. I am glad you agree with me, even if you aren't aware enough to realize it.
Click to expand...

I didn't restate your position. You claimed that people bring up Hitler when they run out of ammo. Which is funny, because you and the other poster brought up Hitler out of nowhere.

I was explaining that the victimhood narrative you articulated is a diversion technique. If, in fact, President Trump did something like Hitler, such a comparison would be valid.

CycloneWanderer said:
It seems you are distracted. What was the point of this thread again? Ah, that's right: defining the appropriateness of modern day usage of Godwin's law.
Click to expand...

No, it was actually about the immigration executive order, but people started playing the victim card.
 
Absentglare said:
I didn't restate your position. You claimed that people bring up Hitler when they run out of ammo. Which is funny, because you and the other poster brought up Hitler out of nowhere.

I was explaining that the victimhood narrative you articulated is a diversion technique. If, in fact, President Trump did something like Hitler, such a comparison would be valid.



No, it was actually about the immigration executive order, but people started playing the victim card.
Click to expand...

If he did anything like Hitler I would agree but I don't agree that he has done anything like Hitler. I have noticed that when some people don't have a rational argument against an action they Godwin themselves. That happens a lot and it is usual liberals lately.
 
chuckiechan said:
Trump's travel decree: What it means and how it works | Fox News



You should read the very concise article now that many of you have had a chance to rage at the "George Soros" version. It's just not all that scary. Unless you are of the "one world, no borders" persuasion that is, and getting rid of all that tired old "national sovereignty" clap-trap!
Click to expand...

LOL Fox news? Now read what business people are saying about the ban and the "unintended consequences that will result from it. Yes Herr Trump is already showing his "business savy" :lol: Buckle your seatbelts the economy is about to go off a cliff. Don't say I didn't warn you.

1. Loss of top talent -- America wins in business because it has been able to attract a lot of the top talent from around the world. Companies like Apple (AAPL, Tech30), eBay (EBAY) and Oracle (ORCL, Tech30) were founded by immigrants or the children of immigrants from countries that are part of the Trump immigration ban.
Friday's ban is already preventing PhD students, doctors, researchers and business leaders from returning to the U.S. or traveling abroad. Google (GOOG), for example, says at least 100 of its employees are impacted. Beyond the immediate impact, the ban might cause talented young people who were to go elsewhere. Canada has been quick to put out the welcome mat.
Get ready for "unintended consequences" wrote Mahamed El-Erian, chief economic adviser at Allianz, on LinkedIn, "that ultimately could prove counterproductive and harmful to national security, the economy, and America's moral authority, values and standing in the world."
2. Big American brands and tourism could take a hit -- Goldman Sachs has already sent a note about the "growing risks to global trade." The bank recommends that clients invest in companies that are smaller and doing most of their sales in the U.S. Translation: America's big global brands could suffer.
3. A trade war -- No foreign country will send a thank you note to Trump if he enacts tariffs on foreign goods coming into the U.S. They will retaliate. Mexico is already talking tough about a rapid response, and China's army went as far as to warn the risk of war as "more real" over the weekend.
This is exactly what Republican business executives like Mitt Romney and Meg Whitman warned about almost a year ago. They said Trump could send the U.S. into a recession if he cut America off from the rest of the world with walls, tariffs and severe immigration restrictions.
It hasn't happened yet, but the possibility is growing that it will.
This could have a swift impact on American jobs. For example, 6 million U.S. jobs depend on trade with Mexico alone, according to the U.S. Chamber of Commerce.
Click to expand...

The risks to the economy of Trump's isolationism - Jan. 30, 2017


Trump's travel ban: Companies and executives speak out - Jan. 30, 2017
 
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NonoBadDog said:
If he did anything like Hitler I would agree but I don't agree that he has done anything like Hitler. I have noticed that when some people don't have a rational argument against an action they Godwin themselves. That happens a lot and it is usual liberals lately.
Click to expand...

Then we are in agreement. You are correct that some people resort to blanket demonization because they have no rational argument to offer.

There are a number of similarities between President Trump and Hitler. Most of them are not meaningful, for example, they were both born on Earth. So a likeness to Hitler is not automatically wrong, though it may certainly be ridiculous like my example.
 
chuckiechan said:
Trump's travel decree: What it means and how it works | Fox News



You should read the very concise article now that many of you have had a chance to rage at the "George Soros" version. It's just not all that scary. Unless you are of the "one world, no borders" persuasion that is, and getting rid of all that tired old "national sovereignty" clap-trap!
Click to expand...

What about when they've never even been to any of the banned countries?
Victorian schoolboy believed to be first Australian hit with US visa ban | SBS News
 
Koke said:
Perhaps you weren't made familiar with the current prevailing narrative.

Trump is literally Hitler and we will be Nazi Germany in 4 years.

Please don't reply with any facts or logic. I am only interested in feels and emotional anecdote.
Click to expand...

He is moving too fast for four years I give him three months and he will never be Hitler rather a statue of power guided by the hand of God
 
Visbek said:
Or: Those of us who know what's going on understand that it's very scary -- not only because of what it is and what it does, but because it was pushed out in the most childish and inept manner possible.

As noted, Trump hasn't put a new system for evaluating refugees or tourists into place. He's just slammed the door shut for 90 days on a handful of nations -- which just happen to be Muslim nations where Trump doesn't have any businesses.

They did in fact bar green card holders / permanent residents, until there was massive pushback from the public, Congress and lawyers.

Since no refugees from those nations have actually committed terrorist attacks, and since the current system is fairly extensive and takes about 2 years to complete, the ban is unnecessary. More important, it's offended Muslims around the world

We should note that Trump's weaseling out of "it's not a Muslim ban!" is slightly ridiculous, given that a) he proclaimed during the campaign that he wanted to ban Muslims from entering the US; b) he is actually following through on his campaign pledges; c) Giuliani admitted that it was a legal means to ban Muslims; d) his administration doesn't seem interested in expediting the process for Muslims who are in the minority in those nations, just Christians (a move which violates the 1st Amendment).

Hilariously, the article pointed out that international reaction was deeply negative.... except for the President of Czechoslovakia.

It shows Trump's authoritarian tendencies, including his willingness to trivialize public opposition. It's also not clear if the structure of the ban is legal, since this type of measure was very possibly outlawed in 1965.

It also shows how Trump and many of his top advisers are either total rank amateurs, or deliberately sowing chaos, or a combination of the two. In particular, Trump's inability to recognize the scope of the disorder stemming from his own actions is deeply worrisome.



You don't need to advocate open borders to realize that this is a huge mistake.
Click to expand...

If it was a 'muslim ban' then why are the 33 other majority muslim countries not on the list?
was it a muslim ban when Obama did the same thing with Iran?
 
rhinefire said:
He is moving too fast for four years I give him three months and he will never be Hitler rather a statue of power guided by the hand of God
Click to expand...

Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat?!?
 
SocialD said:
If it was a 'muslim ban' then why are the 33 other majority muslim countries not on the list?
Click to expand...

Because Trump and many of his cronies have business interests there, such as in Saudi Arabia, the home of 15 of the 19 911 terrorists.


SocialD said:
was it a muslim ban when Obama did the same thing with Iran?
Click to expand...

Answer: Because unlike Trump, Obama based what he did on an actual event. He paused approvals of refugee applications from Iraq for a period of six months after two Iraqi al-Qaeda terrorists were discovered living as refugees in Kentucky.

What he didn't do:

1. Base it on religion.

Obama's order - which was done with very little fanfare - selected Iraqi nationals based on geography and a specific event, not religion.

2. Do it out of the blue.

Again, it was done in response to a specific event, and to allow FBI agents enough to gather fingerprints from captured roadside bombs, which they used to toughen their refugee screening process

See the difference?
 
SocialD said:
If it was a 'muslim ban' then why are the 33 other majority muslim countries not on the list?
was it a muslim ban when Obama did the same thing with Iran?
Click to expand...

It is a "ban" only on Muslim countries that don't do business with TrumpCo. Think of it as an incentive....
 
Here is something interesting
Trump’s executive order is so modest that the foundation of it is essentially existing law. That law was passed unanimously by both bodies of Congress in 2002. In fact, it garnered the support of 16 Democrat senators and 57 Democrat House members who are still serving in their respective bodies!

Following 9/11, Congress passed the Enhanced Border Security and Visa Entry Reform Act, which addressed many of the insecurities in our visa tracking system. The bill passed the House and Senate unanimously. The bill was originally sponsored by a group of bipartisan senators, including Ted Kennedy and Sen. Dianne Feinstein, D-Calif. (F, 0%). Among other provisions, it restricted non-immigrant visas from countries designated as state sponsors of terror:
Click to expand...
- See more at: https://www.conservativereview.com/...eeDems&utm_campaign=crfb#sthash.JOwr9FJa.dpuf

What do you know?
 
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