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10 Ways Donald Trump Can Cut Waste - Our Advice From OpenTheBooks.com

Why am I not surprised that data have no effect on your opinions?

Let's suppose that one day you could all convince me and the other dubious "Deniers" that the sky is actually falling. What do you want from all of this Global Warming alarm? Just to make us aware that it's a problem? One day the oceans will flood the coastlines and the crops will dry up? Ok, duly noted. Should I file this alongside the world ending when the sun explodes or when a massive meteor hits us?

What is it that you want from Global Warming? I'm guessing there's some taxes against the "rich" involved somewhere. There's an agenda, and that agenda is most certainly anti-capitalist.
 
Let's suppose that one day you could all convince me and the other dubious "Deniers" that the sky is actually falling. What do you want from all of this Global Warming alarm? Just to make us aware that it's a problem? One day the oceans will flood the coastlines and the crops will dry up? Ok, duly noted. Should I file this alongside the world ending when the sun explodes or when a massive meteor hits us?

Now you're moving the goal posts from "the evidence shows X" to "what does it matter?"

What is it that you want from Global Warming? I'm guessing there's some taxes against the "rich" involved somewhere. There's an agenda, and that agenda is most certainly anti-capitalist.

For this purpose let's take as a given that the warming WILL flood the coastlines, costing $trillions to mitigate over time. The agenda is to put a cost on burning carbon which contributes to that predictable impact - such as a carbon tax. The point is for those of us who are using fossil fuels to pay the full cost of burning those fuels instead of offloading those costs onto the next generations. That is no more "anti-capitalist" than are clean air or water provisions that force polluters to pay the cost of cleaning up their waste instead of dumping their toxic waste onto your front yard or in your water supply, or killing you and your kin with dirty air, like is happening in China - 500k per year or more.

But more generally, the options to deal with AGW are incredibly complex to analyze. We might as society say, "Fk the next generation - we are selfish, and we want cheap energy today, we don't KNOW the costs will be significant, there's a small chance for the U.S. there will be benefits - growing oranges in New York! - and costs and the net is unknown, so to hell with the kids and grandkids - if they have to pay for our energy choices, so sad, too bad. OK, but we can't have an informed debate if we pretend the warming isn't happening or that our fuel choices are not a significant cause. Once we accept that our activities ARE warming the planet, THEN we can have the necessary and very difficult public debate about what to do about that.
 
Now you're moving the goal posts from "the evidence shows X" to "what does it matter?"



For this purpose let's take as a given that the warming WILL flood the coastlines, costing $trillions to mitigate over time. The agenda is to put a cost on burning carbon which contributes to that predictable impact - such as a carbon tax. The point is for those of us who are using fossil fuels to pay the full cost of burning those fuels instead of offloading those costs onto the next generations. That is no more "anti-capitalist" than are clean air or water provisions that force polluters to pay the cost of cleaning up their waste instead of dumping their toxic waste onto your front yard or in your water supply, or killing you and your kin with dirty air, like is happening in China - 500k per year or more.

But more generally, the options to deal with AGW are incredibly complex to analyze. We might as society say, "Fk the next generation - we are selfish, and we want cheap energy today, we don't KNOW the costs will be significant, there's a small chance for the U.S. there will be benefits - growing oranges in New York! - and costs and the net is unknown, so to hell with the kids and grandkids - if they have to pay for our energy choices, so sad, too bad. OK, but we can't have an informed debate if we pretend the warming isn't happening or that our fuel choices are not a significant cause. Once we accept that our activities ARE warming the planet, THEN we can have the necessary and very difficult public debate about what to do about that.

Yet support for more and more government involvement, producing generations of welfare and an exploding federal deficit, "offloading those costs onto the next generations", are fine.
 
How can he cut waste? With a knife. His bull sh_t is easy to cut through.
 
I suppose I might be more inclined to believe any of this hoax had the falsifiers not been caught by hackers cooking the books with the data. If you have to falsify data to make your point, then you don't have a very good case or any credibility as a scientist.

Exactly

Data is worthless when it is presented by people with no credibility

The left expects their politicized research to command respect and are baffled when it doesnt
 
The left expects their politicized research to command respect and are baffled when it doesnt
It's a bit ridiculous that the liberals' way of debating a topic is to say, "I win! I win! No one can claim that global warming is a hoax because all liberals are in agreement that we need to tax the rich and shut down capitalism! We win the argument because we say so!"
 
Yet support for more and more government involvement, producing generations of welfare and an exploding federal deficit, "offloading those costs onto the next generations", are fine.

Well, that's several logical fallacies in just one sentence, among them you are responding to me, but I've never said those things "are fine." On the other hand,

"You know, Paul, Reagan proved deficits don't matter. We won...[more tax cuts are] our due."

So I'm pretty sick of 'conservatives' whining about the deficits. Republicans in office really don't care about them, unless a democrat is in the WH. I'm sure we're about to see massive new, and unpaid for, tax cuts come out of the GOP Congress and Trump, and all good right wingers will find a way to no longer give a damn about the deficits they cause.
 
It's a bit ridiculous that the liberals' way of debating a topic is to say, "I win! I win! No one can claim that global warming is a hoax because all liberals are in agreement that we need to tax the rich and shut down capitalism! We win the argument because we say so!"

LOL, your way of debating the topic was to make two statements that I proved false, and when presented with the data, you kept moving the goal posts. So it's hilarious you're whining about liberals here.

You've been debating me and I didn't say "tax the rich" and I sure as hell never suggested we "shut down capitalism" and presented data to back up my argument, while you produced nothing but your opinions, aka "because you say so." It's hilarious, really. :lamo
 
Exactly

Data is worthless when it is presented by people with no credibility

The left expects their politicized research to command respect and are baffled when it doesnt

Well, present your source of data prepared by people with credibility that I should trust instead of what is produced by scientists in peer reviewed publications? Where can I find non-politicized scientific research on the climate? WUWT?
 
LOL, your way of debating the topic was to make two statements that I proved false, and when presented with the data, you kept moving the goal posts. So it's hilarious you're whining about liberals here.

You've been debating me and I didn't say "tax the rich" and I sure as hell never suggested we "shut down capitalism" and presented data to back up my argument, while you produced nothing but your opinions, aka "because you say so." It's hilarious, really. :lamo
You don't want carbon taxes on the rich and the capitalists? Perhaps I could go back a page or two and find your quotes? Or maybe you could just start being honest instead of lying. But that would be asking a lot from a commie.
 
Well, present your source of data prepared by people with credibility that I should trust instead of what is produced by scientists in peer reviewed publications? Where can I find non-politicized scientific research on the climate? WUWT?

"Peer reviewed" means is not helpful when all the peers play for the same team

In the climate science racket you have to be a team player or you dont get hired and you dont get funded
 
You don't want carbon taxes on the rich and the capitalists? Perhaps I could go back a page or two and find your quotes? Or maybe you could just start being honest instead of lying. But that would be asking a lot from a commie.

LOL, first of all you've not identified any lie. What I did do was present data that contradicted your talking points, and you're unable to produce data to support them. That's not my problem.

Second, because I trust the scientific community, I'm necessarily a "commie"? This is one of many reasons I abandoned the "conservative" movement and the GOP in particular and haven't really had to second guess that choice over the past decade or so.

BTW, carbon taxes would apply to energy produced by burning fossil fuels, and so would be levied on everyone who consumes energy, the vast majority of them not-rich. And as I pointed out, and you didn't address, this is no more anti-capitalist than the fact that coal burning plants pass along the costs of scrubbers that remove pollutants at the source versus what you can see in China right now.
 
"Peer reviewed" means is not helpful when all the peers play for the same team

In the climate science racket you have to be a team player or you dont get hired and you dont get funded

First of all, those are baseless assertions. Second, OK, you don't trust the actual scientific experts, so where do I turn for trustworthy research on the climate? Bloggers?
 
Forbes Welcome

Most of these are "no brainers", like too many federal officers with arrest and firearm authority - 200,000 vs 180,000 US Marines.

I'd also include Department of Education, and give their $77 billion budget a haircut.

How about we dump the Dept of Education, or turn them into a FYI organization for research purposes?
 
First of all, those are baseless assertions. Second, OK, you don't trust the actual scientific experts, so where do I turn for trustworthy research on the climate? Bloggers?

The russians admit to stealing emails from the climate change hoaxsters and published them a few years back showing how scientists were pressured to agree with the man made global warming claims

And man-made is the real issue, along with the doomsday predictions we are being assaulted woth every day.

It does not ttake an MIT grad to know that the earth has continually gone through sever warming and cooling cycles naturally

The arctic used to be tropical and the Sahara desert was once covered with vegetation

New york city once sat beneith a glacier

So if the earth has tilted on its axis or more heat from the sun alters temps a couple of degrees its not the end of the world that hystericam climate scientists and power hungry left wing politicials claim
 
Might as well list them all and respond:

1. Disarm Federal Regulatory Agencies. Agreed. We have the FBI and Federal Marshals for general police functions. Aside from the Secret Service and the Border Patrol there is no need for any "armed" regulatory agency. That includes the DEA and ATF, which IMO should be sub-departments of the FBI or Federal Marshal.

2. Fire EPA Lawyers. Agreed. The Justice Dept. should handle all legal issues for the Federal government.

3. Blockade Federal Funds for Sanctuary Cities. Agreed. Any municipality that refuses to obey Federal Immigration Law does not deserve allocations of Federal funding.

4. Cut Funding for Agency Self-Promotion. Agreed. No Federal agency should be engaging in any spending except for the work they were created to do.

5. Direct Small Business Funds to Small Businesses. Agreed. Federal funds should be allocated for the reasons they were designed to accomplish.

6. Eliminate the Export-Import Bank. Unsure. I don't know enough about this to make an informed decision.

7. Reduce Federal Funding for the Ivy League. Agreed. They have adequate resources from wealthy Alumni and the high student tuition and fees they charge.

8. Finish the Task of VA Reform. Agreed. Something that should be at the forefront of domestic policy.

9. Open the Books on Federal Employee Pensions. Agreed. If the pension is performing as it should then there is nothing to hide.
10. Cut Federal Funding to Municipalities Paying Lavish Salaries to Public Employees. Agreed. Salaries, benefits, and standard services should be funded entirely by the resources of the tax base being served. Federal funds should only be used for reasons specifically authorized by Congress.

Not sure what this one is about. Are we talking an audit, or are we talking pensions of elected officials or what? There are various plans for government employees including CSRS, FERS and that for elected officials. So what are you after here?
 
The russians admit to stealing emails from the climate change hoaxsters and published them a few years back showing how scientists were pressured to agree with the man made global warming claims

And man-made is the real issue, along with the doomsday predictions we are being assaulted woth every day.

It does not ttake an MIT grad to know that the earth has continually gone through sever warming and cooling cycles naturally

The arctic used to be tropical and the Sahara desert was once covered with vegetation

New york city once sat beneith a glacier

So if the earth has tilted on its axis or more heat from the sun alters temps a couple of degrees its not the end of the world that hystericam climate scientists and power hungry left wing politicials claim

OK, so you don't trust the scientists and don't really have a reliable source of better information.

FWIW, we know the earth hasn't tilted on an access, and we also know the warming isn't being cause by the sun. Scientists have a good handle on those and can eliminate them as sources. There is also no one claiming 'the end of the world' but rather that changing the climate effectively overnight on an evolutionary scale will be at best a massive experiment with unknown and potentially irreversible and potentially drastic consequences. Obviously warming will be beneficial in areas, very harmful if not catastrophic in others. But the point, from where I sit, is we have no alternative than to trust the people who engage in this research for a living, and who know more than anyone else about the subject. Believing the scientists are all frauds is delusional. They simply are not, as a group, the "let's fake this research when we know it's false' type. They COULD be wrong, but that's different than they are pushing research out they know to be false - that's just not happening for the scientific community as a group.
 
BTW, carbon taxes would apply to energy produced by burning fossil fuels, and so would be levied on everyone who consumes energy, the vast majority of them not-rich.
And those taxes would pay for what all the other taxes do. They'd pay for some people to sit around on their duffs in project housing that I pay for and for free food and for SUV's with leather seats and huge shiny rims and free cell phones and free X-Box. That's not reducing global warming. That's just more taxes from the working people to fund indigents to sit around and mooch. Yes, communism.
 
That may be the least of our problems

A growing number of them appear to worship the earth and hate humans

I live on the Earth, it is my ancestral home. Where are you located?
 
OK, so you don't trust the scientists and don't really have a reliable source of better information.

FWIW, we know the earth hasn't tilted on an access, and we also know the warming isn't being cause by the sun. Scientists have a good handle on those and can eliminate them as sources. There is also no one claiming 'the end of the world' but rather that changing the climate effectively overnight on an evolutionary scale will be at best a massive experiment with unknown and potentially irreversible and potentially drastic consequences. Obviously warming will be beneficial in areas, very harmful if not catastrophic in others. But the point, from where I sit, is we have no alternative than to trust the people who engage in this research for a living, and who know more than anyone else about the subject. Believing the scientists are all frauds is delusional. They simply are not, as a group, the "let's fake this research when we know it's false' type. They COULD be wrong, but that's different than they are pushing research out they know to be false - that's just not happening for the scientific community as a group.

Climate Scientists have to eat

If they are not team players they dont get hired to work in their field and they dont get funded

My distrust of the climate scientists may be unfair but it cant be expelled by chanting kumbaya's

And I see no reason to trusct them in such a politizied context that they come from
 
And those taxes would pay for what all the other taxes do. They'd pay for some people to sit around on their duffs in project housing that I pay for and for free food and for SUV's with leather seats and huge shiny rims and free cell phones and free X-Box. That's not reducing global warming. That's just more taxes from the working people to fund indigents to sit around and mooch. Yes, communism.

OK, so more goal post moving, so you're not interested in debating the topic like a rational person. I should have guessed as much, which is why I avoid the "climate" forum and should avoid any discussion of it on DP.
 
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Climate Scientists have to eat

If they are not team players they dont get hired to work in their field and they dont get funded

My distrust of the climate scientists may be unfair but it cant be expelled by chanting kumbaya's

And I see no reason to trusct them in such a politizied context that they come from

The problem is if you don't trust scientists, then you trust no one and prefer ignorance to information and evidence. I don't see how a person can make informed choices that way. What it means in the end is you can read people who aren't experts - bloggers, lobbyists, political hacks - who say what you want to hear, to support the position that you favor and are least inconvenient for you. That's comfortable, I guess, but it's not actually rational.
 
The problem is if you don't trust scientists, then you trust no one and prefer ignorance to information and evidence. I don't see how a person can make informed choices that way. What it means in the end is you can read people who aren't experts - bloggers, lobbyists, political hacks - who say what you want to hear, to support the position that you favor and are least inconvenient for you. That's comfortable, I guess, but it's not actually rational.

You make it sound like I have to do SOMETHING even if its wrong.

My choice is to ignore the dire predictions of the man-made-global-warming crowd and continue to live my life as normally as the leftwing politicians in Washington and Brussels will allow me to
 
How about we dump the Dept of Education, or turn them into a FYI organization for research purposes?

Since DeVos seems destined to head it, I'd be happy if her first act was to terminate her department and thus her position.
 
You make it sound like I have to do SOMETHING even if its wrong.

My choice is to ignore the dire predictions of the man-made-global-warming crowd and continue to live my life as normally as the leftwing politicians in Washington and Brussels will allow me to

OK, and you're confirming my point.

I guess I shouldn't have said essentially burying your head in the sand and ignoring the problem is not rational - it is rational. We all deal with problems we can't individually solve that way. But if that's your choice, it's not rational or fair to then assert that others who elect to try to deal with that problem are somehow illegitimate or engaged in a fraud, just so you can feel comfortable with your choice to not care what happens or what our energy choices today might mean for the future.
 
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