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Iran sends troops into Iraq to aid fight against Isis militants

MMC said:
Problem is Right for the moment.....that ISIS picked up 72 tanks and a bunch of Humvees. Their no longer just a group. Their an Army.
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And had the Iraqi Army fought, they wouldn't have had that. I agree they're equipped like an Army now. The question is, why is it our problem? We trained the Iraqi troops, we equipped them, they ran.

Why should the U.S. send more troops to help defend a people that don't want to defend anything themselves?
 
TheNextEra said:
And had the Iraqi Army fought, they wouldn't have had that. I agree they're equipped like an Army now. The question is, why is it our problem? We trained the Iraqi troops, we equipped them, they ran.

Why should the U.S. send more troops to help defend a people that don't want to defend anything themselves?
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considering the fact that Maliki was supported by the iranian government, why should we do anything to help the iranians extract themselves from the mess they made?
 
TheNextEra said:
And had the Iraqi Army fought, they wouldn't have had that. I agree they're equipped like an Army now. The question is, why is it our problem? We trained the Iraqi troops, we equipped them, they ran.

Why should the U.S. send more troops to help defend a people that don't want to defend anything themselves?
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Oh, I thought you seen where I said this wasn't just our problem. This is everyones problem. They are not that far from being held off from a couple of International Airports. Plus now they can shoot planes out of the sky. Civilian planes.

Other Countries are dickin around too. People should have been moving as 3 days ago to make sure they don't take those Airports.
 
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MMC said:
Oh, I thought you seen where I said this wasn't just our problem. This is everyones problem. They are not that far from being held off from a couple of International Airports. Plus now they can shoot planes out of the sky. Civilian planes.

Other Countries are dickin around too. People should have been moving as 3 days ago to make sure they don't take those Airports.
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And when we get an agreement with not only the Iraqi government, but supporting governments than I would consider it. But you know darn well we are always the burdened country to support troops. That has to stop.

And if the Iraqi government wants Iranian help or at the very least doesn't oppose it, it isn't a problem we should just arbitrarily intervene in.
 
Unitedwestand13 said:
considering the fact that Maliki was supported by the iranian government, why should we do anything to help the iranians extract themselves from the mess they made?
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We shouldn't unless the Iraqi government asks for our help AND we get other countries involved. We are not the world police nor should we act like it. We can no longer afford it with money and lives.
 
TheNextEra said:
We shouldn't unless the Iraqi government asks for our help AND we get other countries involved. We are not the world police nor should we act like it. We can no longer afford it with money and lives.
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Again, what do we owe Maliki, who was a Iranian puppet and essentially owes his position of power to the Iranian government?
 
TheNextEra said:
And when we get an agreement with not only the Iraqi government, but supporting governments than I would consider it. But you know darn well we are always the burdened country to support troops. That has to stop.

And if the Iraqi government wants Iranian help or at the very least doesn't oppose it, it isn't a problem we should just arbitrarily intervene in.
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Well, I don't have any trouble with the Iranians going in and taking out terrorists. Lets see if they can do what they say.

As for us working with them.....it shouldn't even take place. Nor should Iran be allowed to leverage us with such a situation.

Their remarks were more of an insult as to if would have took care of the terrorists when they were in Syria. This wouldn't be taking place. Moreover it was questioning the US about taking care of terrorists where we want to and not so much where we should.
 
Unitedwestand13 said:
Again, what do we owe Maliki, who was a Iranian puppet and essentially owes his position of power to the Iranian government?
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We don't "owe" him anything. I never said we did.
 
MMC said:
Their remarks were more of an insult as to if would have took care of the terrorists when they were in Syria. This wouldn't be taking place. Moreover it was questioning the US about taking care of terrorists where we want to and not so much where we should.
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And technically they are correct. How many terrorist cells do we have operating in Africa that we do nothing about. Look at the terrorism that is done to the people of NK, China, etc.

Our Mantra is to take care of things where WE want and not were we should. We only take out terrorists if it is in OUR interest. They are absolutely correct about that.
 
MMC said:
Mornin' 88 :2wave: Well they were wrong to go in.....but the bigger mess comes with not finishing the job.

Look both sides people overseas have been outwitted and outplayed. But bottomline is BO knew this was going on in Iraq All last year. He knew even when he released the Taliban leaders. he also knew all that was going on in Syria.....didn't he? He knew what aid he gave was going to ISIS and al Nusra. He knew 88.....people have to get off the prior mistakes.

2 wrongs isn't going to make it Right.

But now all the lives damaged and paid for, everything brought to that point. Would be a slap in the face of ALL who went to get rid of a Madman.

Which says nothing about the political vacuum being left Open for Russia to refill what they had lost.
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Two wrongs don't make a right, and personally I wonder if Obama knows anything about what's going on. Dude's making Bush look like Einstein (THAT takes some doing).

Russia will only be involved through their influence in Iran. Basically though, we created a vacuum and filled with a system that was bound to be tilted towards Iran. There's nothing we can really do about that unless we go back in time. Interestingly, if you want a government that's NOT tilted to Iran, you want these Sunni militants to take over. I think either way is a losing situation.
 
MMC said:
The Sunni are the minority not the Shia. But they are amassing around Samaara. Plus the Kurds have taken Kirkuk and Holding there. Despite the Iraqis hitting them with an Airstrike today.
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hmm, the Kurds aren't a threat to Baghdad and the the lesser threat between them and ISIS. Seems to me those airstrikes could have been more useful against ISIS. Someone isn't using their head in Baghdad. Of course if someone in Baghdad had used his head over the last three years or so, this may not be happening.
 
Perotista said:
hmm, the Kurds aren't a threat to Baghdad and the the lesser threat between them and ISIS. Seems to me those airstrikes could have been more useful against ISIS. Someone isn't using their head in Baghdad. Of course if someone in Baghdad had used his head over the last three years or so, this may not be happening.
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I have ongoing events here Pero. But yeah the Iraqis bombed the Kurds. Said a bunch of them were acting funny. This was after the Kurds transported a couple Generals back to Baghdad.

Already Bombs are going off in Baghdad.....we are evacuating most personnel from the Largest Embassy in the World too.

http://www.debatepolitics.com/middl...q-2014-and-going-events-7.html#post1063410277
 
rocket88 said:
Two wrongs don't make a right, and personally I wonder if Obama knows anything about what's going on. Dude's making Bush look like Einstein (THAT takes some doing).

Russia will only be involved through their influence in Iran. Basically though, we created a vacuum and filled with a system that was bound to be tilted towards Iran. There's nothing we can really do about that unless we go back in time. Interestingly, if you want a government that's NOT tilted to Iran, you want these Sunni militants to take over. I think either way is a losing situation.
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I don't think any countries should be handed to the Sunni.....they want to go and take something. Let them Earn it.....and lets see if they can actually man up.

Just you wait and hear the Sunni.....once they start getting gangstered. The whining and wailing will never stop.
 
MMC said:
The whining and wailing will never stop.
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The whining and wailing in Iraq will never stop anyway. It's just who does it. We needed to force a power sharing structure between Sunni and Shia on them 10 years ago. Right now, either or will be in power and the other side will whine and wail because they're out of the loop.

Sunnis aren't necessarily bad. Saudis are Sunni, I think also Kuwait, Jordan...most of our allies over there. Sunnis are the majority in Islam.
 
rocket88 said:
The whining and wailing in Iraq will never stop anyway. It's just who does it. We needed to force a power sharing structure between Sunni and Shia on them 10 years ago. Right now, either or will be in power and the other side will whine and wail because they're out of the loop.

Sunnis aren't necessarily bad. Saudis are Sunni, I think also Kuwait, Jordan...most of our allies over there. Sunnis are the majority in Islam.
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Yeah I know they are.....their also the ones. That all thought were Moderate and into Democracy to. A Lesson all have learned to be false. Check out the other link I showed.

Like I was telling Pero.....it didn't stop the Iraqis bombing the Kurds even though they were helping them.

Plus don't forget the Turks have had their people taken too.
 
MMC said:
Heya DF. :2wave: What do you mean Iran denies this. They Admit they are in Iraq. They have warned others to not militarily intervene.
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I had this from Saturday. Must be Maliki requested the troops. Wouldn't it be nice if Iran got itself embroiled in one of those $3 Trillion quagmires?

Iran's Rouhani Offers Help To Iraq In Dealing With Sunni Insurgents

"Iranian President Hassan Rouhani Saturday offered to help the Iraqi government deal with Sunni insurgents seizing territory in a drive toward Baghdad.

Insurgents linked to the Islamic State of Iraq and Syria overtook Mosul, Iraq's second largest city earlier this week but Iraqi forces regained some territory north of Baghdad, Gen. Qassim Atta told a news conference Saturday.

In Tehran, Rouhani told a news conference if the Iraqi government "asks for our help, we will review [the request]," the Tehran Times reported.

"We, as the Islamic Republic of Iran, are both friends and neighbors of Iraq, and our ties with the Iraqi government are close and cordial," Rouhani said.

Earlier in the week, Rouhani told state television Iran would not tolerate terrorism.

"We fight against terrorism, violence and radicalism," Voice of America quoted him as saying.

Rouhani's offer came as the United States sent the aircraft carrier USS George H.W. Bush to the Persian Gulf to provide possible air support.
 
MMC said:
Yeah I know they are.....their also the ones. That all thought were Moderate and into Democracy to. A Lesson all have learned to be false. Check out the other link I showed.

Like I was telling Pero.....it didn't stop the Iraqis bombing the Kurds even though they were helping them.

Plus don't forget the Turks have had their people taken too.
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ISIS is just bad news. They're too extreme for al Qaeda. That's saying something.

As much as we don't want it, neither does Iran. I don't trust the Iranian government any more than anybody does, but they are a player in that region. To some extent we have to get over our aversion to them and realize that they aren't going anywhere.
 
DaveFagan said:
I had this from Saturday. Must be Maliki requested the troops. Wouldn't it be nice if Iran got itself embroiled in one of those $3 Trillion quagmires?

Iran's Rouhani Offers Help To Iraq In Dealing With Sunni Insurgents

"Iranian President Hassan Rouhani Saturday offered to help the Iraqi government deal with Sunni insurgents seizing territory in a drive toward Baghdad.

Insurgents linked to the Islamic State of Iraq and Syria overtook Mosul, Iraq's second largest city earlier this week but Iraqi forces regained some territory north of Baghdad, Gen. Qassim Atta told a news conference Saturday.

In Tehran, Rouhani told a news conference if the Iraqi government "asks for our help, we will review [the request]," the Tehran Times reported.

"We, as the Islamic Republic of Iran, are both friends and neighbors of Iraq, and our ties with the Iraqi government are close and cordial," Rouhani said.

Earlier in the week, Rouhani told state television Iran would not tolerate terrorism.

"We fight against terrorism, violence and radicalism," Voice of America quoted him as saying.

Rouhani's offer came as the United States sent the aircraft carrier USS George H.W. Bush to the Persian Gulf to provide possible air support.
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Here was the problem with Iraq after 2011 and what BO failed to address.


Because the State Department was unable to secure any agreement to use bases inside Iraq after the end of 2011, most U.S. aerial surveillance of Iraq is flown out of bases in Turkey and Qatar.

The U.S. intelligence community’s ability to gather information on Islamic militant fighter networks narrowed further when the U.S. shut down its embassy in Damascus, which housed an interagency group of CIA, Pentagon and other officers devoted to tracking militants, according to two former U.S. officials.

Determining the enemy’s identity is key to figuring out what legal authority the White House could use to target Iraq’s enemies—something administration lawyers are grappling with as military planners try to come up with a target list, according to the senior administration official, who was briefed on the issue. If the administration determines that former Baathists from the fallen regime of Saddam Hussein make up much of the force marching south, the administration theoretically could use the Authorization for the Use of Military Force passed by Congress in 2002 that was the legal basis for the 2003 invasion of Iraq. That would be legally tricky, as it was originally predicated largely on the suspected presence of unauthorized weapons of mass destruction, and actions of a regime that is now out of power.....snip~

http://news.yahoo.com/us-spies-dont-know-hit-iraq-094500103--politics.html
 
rocket88 said:
ISIS is just bad news. They're too extreme for al Qaeda. That's saying something.

As much as we don't want it, neither does Iran. I don't trust the Iranian government any more than anybody does, but they are a player in that region. To some extent we have to get over our aversion to them and realize that they aren't going anywhere.
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Nah BO has responded. That's why I was telling you to check out the other thread.
 
I am amazed that Iran's major influence on Iraq is finally making it into the whatever consciousness it is that allows certain posters to realize it.
Iirc, I brought up this undue influence years ago.
Iraq's opposition groups were housed and funded in exile by Iran. Of course Iran has huge influence in post-Saddam Iraq. That's part of why Iran was pushing for us to topple Hussein.

Welcome to the party.
 
MMC said:
... this Problem all came about and from BO's inaction and being indecisive.
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To be fair, the Bush admin should get some of credit for believing an Iranian agent over their own intelligence community in the run up to war in Iraq.
And of course, many of America's general electorate also share the blame.
 
Simon W. Moon said:
To be fair, the Bush admin should get some of credit for believing an Iranian agent over their own intelligence community in the run up to war in Iraq.
And of course, many of America's general electorate also share the blame.
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Well the Neo Cons were wrong to go All in with Iraq in the first place......Which I mentioned several times, but this changes nothing about what falls on BO after 2010.
 
MMC said:
Well the Neo Cons were wrong to go All in with Iraq in the first place......Which I mentioned several times, but this changes nothing about what falls on BO after 2010.
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They also took a lot of advice from Iran and abetted Iranian machinations inside Iraq.

My personal feeling based on speculation piled on top of speculation is that Iran and Israel worked up the invasion of Iraq.
 
Simon W. Moon said:
They also took a lot of advice from Iran and abetted Iranian machinations inside Iraq.

My personal feeling based on speculation piled on top of speculation is that Iran and Israel worked up the invasion of Iraq.
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We have a lot of the correlation up here with our Threads on Syria and the Concerning Syria Thread.....Players and who was dealing with who. I would recommend some go thru those to see what we knew and at what time. Especially with al Nusra and ISIS, as well as Any Ansar Sharia brands that had spread from Yemen.
 
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