• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

The NSA's Reach Might Be Even Bigger Than We Thought

Arbo said:
How can one be ok with nonsense conspiracy stuff?
Click to expand...

Everything I listed does exist. What conspiracy are you suggesting? I forgot to mention the most recent MSM report that the FBI can turn on your WebCam without the illumination of your indicator light. How can you be in such denial of the surveillance state in which you live.
 
Montecresto said:
Everything I listed does exist. What conspiracy are you suggesting? I forgot to mention the most recent MSM report that the FBI can turn on your WebCam without the illumination of your indicator light. How can you be in such denial of the surveillance state in which you live.
Click to expand...

You think because others don't share your fear that some geek at a desk in the basement of a nondescript building is currently looking through your personal files, that I am in denial? Again you are incorrect. I know very well what is going on, I know what is claimed is going on, I know the history of governmental abuse of data. I simply don't have an irrational fear like you do. So what are you trying to hide from them?
 
CalGun said:
Are you suggesting that a private company should not be allowed to ask its customers if its all right to "spy" on them for their benefit? You mean to suggest that people shouldn't be free to accept the snooping of a private company they do business with? I agree a company should not impose it, but if a company offers it as a service then I should be free to accept the service or do business with a company that does (if I want such a thing).

For example I bank with a local or so called "regional" bank. I like it that they shut my ATM down and call me when they think "SHTF" has happened and that purchases are being made with my card. They've saved me twice from hackers that obtained my ATM at the gas station. I'm all for freedom - including the freedom to choose snooping if I want the company I do business with to monitor things for my gain.
Click to expand...

Not sure whom that was addressed to if anyone, but I have no problem with what you described. It's quite different however than the National Spy Agency, FBI or any other alphabet agency doing the same to Americans who aren't guilty of crime. Sooner or latter Americans are going to deal with the infringement of their civil liberties. Or loose them for good.
 
Arbo said:
You think because others don't share your fear that some geek at a desk in the basement of a nondescript building is currently looking through your personal files, that I am in denial? Again you are incorrect. I know very well what is going on, I know what is claimed is going on, I know the history of governmental abuse of data. I simply don't have an irrational fear like you do. So what are you trying to hide from them?
Click to expand...

It's not about fear. It's about indignation over the violation of the people's bill of rights. Again if your ok with the FBI turning on your WebCam without your knowledge and watching you/the activities of your room, that's your prerogative. Privacy isn't about something illegal one is trying to hide. Why then would the founding generation have given us the fourth amendment. I assume you lock the door when you use the necessary room.
 
It's complicated. There was an instance when they (FBI) wanted access to my wife's business computers because 1 person involved in a terrorist plot to blow up a subway has communicated with her company and visited one of the websites. If they find one suspect, they try to track anyone else who might be involved via internet emails, internet searches and phone records. In this instance, they had a list of names and wanted to know if any of them also has communicated with her company via email or had made any purchases.

She refused access, but agreed to do the search herself. After some huffing and puffing, they agreed. 1 name did match a sale of a certain chemical of concern her company sold. It was one compound for the device they were attempting to make. Ultimately, 4 people were convicted of a plot to blow up a subway.

It appears the government USUALLY does not advertise such plots to not cause copycats nor divulge their methods.

Given the massive flow of information, using computers to, in a sense, watch and read everything is a double edged sword. It is a huge violation of privacy, but it also seems to be working. So where is the middle ground between citizen's rights and the government protecting our country? That is not a simple question. We are a very vulnerable society.
 
Joko, she refused! Was she hiding something? Of course she was, but not everything people wish to hide equates to illegal. And that's the problem. Also, it's quite different for the FBI to ask you for access, and just accessing your computer without warrant and without your knowledge, as was recently disclosed with the WebCam control and overriding of the indicator light.
 
Montecresto said:
It's not about fear. It's about indignation over the violation of the people's bill of rights.
Click to expand...

I am sure you believe your own line of nonsense. You are afraid, pure and simple.

Man, I remember the days before the 'new' building, and when 32 was a two lane road… down by the train tracks was Hinkles.. the best damn ham sandwiches ever…

nsa.jpg
 
Arbo, your a psychiatrist I take it. I see your in Colorado. Did you support the recent recall elections there?
 
Montecresto said:
Arbo, your a psychiatrist I take it.
Click to expand...

And yet again you are incorrect. This must be some sort of record.

I see your in Colorado. Did you support the recent recall elections there?
Click to expand...

Yes, I can list my location, unlike others that live in fear. :lamo

If you want to know my thoughts on the topic of guns, then look in the gun control forum rather than trying to divert the topic in this thread.
 
Arbo said:
And yet again you are incorrect. This must be some sort of record.



Yes, I can list my location, unlike others that live in fear. :lamo


If you want to know my thoughts on the topic of guns, then look in the gun control forum rather than trying to divert the topic in this thread.
Click to expand...

So everyone that fails to list their location is living in fear! Wow, are you sure I'm wrong about your profession. No diversionary tactics. I have no problem with the topic of the National Spy Agency and the violation of Americans fourth amendment, just wondered if your indifference toward it was isolated or extended to the second as well, but don't care enough about your opinion on it too go searching. It is funny that you speak as though I'm the lone American opposed to the growing threat to our civil liberties. We number in the millions. Btw, long before things were as advanced as they are now, Sandra Day O'Conner warned that amongst other things, George Bush's warrantless wiretapping was paramount to the US degenerating into dictatorship and Jimmy Carter has declared that the US is no longer a functioning democracy. But you run along now with the rest of your gullible ilk.
 
Montecresto said:
So everyone that fails to list their location is living in fear!
Click to expand...

I see no other reason to hide it. Or your gender or lean. In general I think of those who do as cowardly folks just hiding behind a keyboard.

No diversionary tactics.
Click to expand...

When you are discussion one topic, and getting your ass handed to you, and you try to change the topic, well, that diversionary. It is even more clear that it was just meant as a diversion when you are called on it and say it's not worth the effort for you to go find out for yourself.

And we come back around to no hard evidence of any injustice to even one citizen of the nation.
 
I love how intelligence agencies have become the bad guy for the ignorant. I think it's hilarious, frankly.
 
Arbo said:
I see no other reason to hide it. Or your gender or lean. In general I think of those who do as cowardly folks just hiding behind a keyboard.



When you are discussion one topic, and getting your ass handed to you, and you try to change the topic, well, that diversionary. It is even more clear that it was just meant as a diversion when you are called on it and say it's not worth the effort for you to go find out for yourself.

And we come back around to no hard evidence of any injustice to even one citizen of the nation.
Click to expand...

With millions of Americans (and around the world) expressing their displeasure with the ongoing surveillance disclosures, I believe you've handed nobodies ass to them.
 
Montecresto said:
With millions of Americans (and around the world) expressing their displeasure with the ongoing surveillance disclosures, I believe you've handed nobodies ass to them.
Click to expand...

I think you have overestimated the numbers. But that wouldn't be a first would it? Most American's don't have a f'n clue what is going on around them. But that has nothing to do with your still, as of yet, unsupported claims.
 
Nothing! We'll be happy to send them all to your house. Lock, stock, and mistakenly drawn gun barrels.
 
Arbo said:
I see no other reason to hide it. Or your gender or lean. In general I think of those who do as cowardly folks just hiding behind a keyboard.



When you are discussion one topic, and getting your ass handed to you, and you try to change the topic, well, that diversionary. It is even more clear that it was just meant as a diversion when you are called on it and say it's not worth the effort for you to go find out for yourself.

And we come back around to no hard evidence of any injustice to even one citizen of the nation.[/QUOTE]

http://consortiumnews.com/2013/12/09/new-evidence-of-contra-cocaine-scandal/

Linked is evidence of lots of harm by
Intelligence Agencies.
Click to expand...
 
Arbo said:
I see no other reason to hide it. Or your gender or lean. In general I think of those who do as cowardly folks just hiding behind a keyboard.



When you are discussion one topic, and getting your ass handed to you, and you try to change the topic, well, that diversionary. It is even more clear that it was just meant as a diversion when you are called on it and say it's not worth the effort for you to go find out for yourself.

And we come back around to no hard evidence of any injustice to even one citizen of the nation.[/QUOTE]

New Evidence of Contra-Cocaine Scandal | Consortiumnews

Linked is evidence of lots of harm by
Intelligence Agencies.
Click to expand...
 
DaveFagan said:
Linked is evidence of lots of harm by
Intelligence Agencies.
Click to expand...

Ah, more diversion… the contra affair has zero to do with the topic of this thread.
 
No, don't you see, Arbo?! If an intelligence agency did something bad, that means all intelligence agencies are bad. And if there's evidence of any of them doing anything, that means they're up to no good.

We have went through the looking glass: there's people that would honestly want to get rid of all intelligence agencies in the world. They don't even know what they're for.
 
OldWorldOrder said:
No, don't you see, Arbo?! If an intelligence agency did something bad, that means all intelligence agencies are bad. And if there's evidence of any of them doing anything, that means they're up to no good.
Click to expand...

Yes, there are many people that are inconsistent in their beliefs and outrage in that manner.

I grew up with and around people that worked there. And even with that, there was a time in my misguided teen years where I believe such nonsense. But the reality is that it's a place where normal people work, and just do a job. A buddy of mine was big time against them too and believed the worst, until his later years when as a programmer he was contracted to work there, he later admitted he was wrong about it for most of his life. Does government overstep it's bounds and abuse things? Hell yeah, from time to time, sometimes worse than others… are there people in government that abuse their positions? Hell yeah. So strict guides and oversight needs to be in place. And I know that warehousing loads of data could possibly lead to massive abuse, that's a simple reality. But the fear of some evil group of american citizens out to watch your every move is just fodder for the weak minded.
 
jamesrage said:
This is why I support a anti-spying amendment(which would also applies to companies as well) to supplement the 4th amendment. But it would probably be easier to strip funding from the NSA than to enact another amendment.
Click to expand...

The odds are better than they have been in a long time for a constitutional convention.

Granted, you still need to have a government that respects the Constitution so....
 
OldWorldOrder said:
I love how intelligence agencies have become the bad guy for the ignorant. I think it's hilarious, frankly.
Click to expand...

The aggregated Big Brother Agencies have indeed become the bad guy. Government beyond its boundaries has never been a good thing.
 
I don't believe anybody wants to eliminate all intelligence agencies in the world. That would be quite silly. But as the author of that troubling Patriot Act, of all people said, when congress should be putting on the breaks regarding the National Spy Agency, they are in fact stepping on the gas. And he likened them to the NSA's cheer leading squad, criticizing both dem's and rep's in the comment.
 
Ikari said:
The aggregated Big Brother Agencies have indeed become the bad guy. Government beyond its boundaries has never been a good thing.
Click to expand...

Lucas works for one. Of course he's a supporter and defender.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom