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Texas' Refusal To Allow Gay Couples To Divorce May Be The Next Constitutional Showdow

Re: Texas' Refusal To Allow Gay Couples To Divorce May Be The Next Constitutional Sho

molten_dragon said:
So let me get this straight.

Texas doesn't allow gay marriages to be performed in Texas.
Texas does recognize gay marriages performed in other states.
But they won't allow a gay couple whose marriage they recognize as legal to get a divorce?

That has to be the dumbest set of laws I've ever heard of.
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Does Texas recognize their marriage or does it recognize certain legal benefits that come with their marriage? There IS a difference between the two points though would not be immediately obvious. And given that Texas does not have a income tax the benifis would not be as great as they would be in states that do have an income tax. And still a lot of the benefits would actually not involve Texas government such as benefits that an employer would recognize.

All that would need to be done is for Texas to grant divorces for marriages that originated in other States without accepting the grounds for the marriage as valid for its purposes granting marriage.
 
Re: Texas' Refusal To Allow Gay Couples To Divorce May Be The Next Constitutional Sho

These two are idiots for expecting to get a divorce in a state that doesn't recognize their marriage in the first place.
 
Re: Texas' Refusal To Allow Gay Couples To Divorce May Be The Next Constitutional Sho

Simply, no divorce is possible for them in Texas as the they are not married in the eyes of Texas law. In fact, they are each free to marry women in Texas without a bigamy charge.

Wouldn't that be a fun SCOTUS case. One of them marries a woman in Texas and Mass charges him with bigamy. But in reality the cowardly court wouldn't touch that one with a ten foot pole.
 
Re: Texas' Refusal To Allow Gay Couples To Divorce May Be The Next Constitutional Sho

I'm a bit confused. Are there other differences between states on when a marriage is legal? Like the age of the parties involved? What happens in those cases if they do exist?
 
Texas' Refusal To Allow Gay Couples To Divorce May Be The Next Constitutional...

Ben K. said:
I'm a bit confused. Are there other differences between states on when a marriage is legal? Like the age of the parties involved? What happens in those cases if they do exist?
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Some states go as low as 12 with a judges permission. Presumably gays that young could marry that young if gay marriage were permitted in that state.

I think some states may require blood tests but it is not as common as it used to be.
 
Re: Texas' Refusal To Allow Gay Couples To Divorce May Be The Next Constitutional...

How about the federal benefits? After ten years of marriage the surviving spouse can file for SS benefits. And after ten years then divorce a spouse can file for half the benefit
 
Re: Texas' Refusal To Allow Gay Couples To Divorce May Be The Next Constitutional Sho

AGENT J said:
Texas' Refusal To Allow Gay Couples To Divorce May Be The Next Constitutional Showdown - Business Insider

back up links:
Texas and gay marriage: Will Texas’ refusal to grant divorces to same-sex couples be the next front in the marriage-equality wars? - Slate Magazine
Inside The Next Big Battle For Gay Rights


and BOOM!
there you have it.
Stuff like this is the beginning to the end of discrimination and denying equal rights.

Me and many others called it when DOMA fell and then again when IRS granted equal rights no matter the state couples reside.

National equal rights for gays is coming and many cases (hopefully just a few SSCs and one SCOTUS) like these are going to make it happen. These types or gross discrimination and equality violations along with state bannings are going to HELP establish equal rights for gays.

In my opinion there's nothing right about what Texas is doing to these people and legally other similar cases have ruled its wrong also.

Like i was saying, when DOMA fell me and others said thats the first step because cases like these and 1000s of others are going to establish equal rights.

If a gay married couple lives in taxes and one of them is in the hospital does the other not get spousal visitation rights or spousal say in healthcare?
Can one of them cheat and its ok?
What if one dies, does texas take the stuff in the dead spouses name?
Can one spouse be FORCED to testify against the other since texas doesnt see their marriage?
etc etc etc etc and a 100 more examples that involve state, and local policies.

There will be cases like these springing up more and more and they will have to be dealt with. Its great because its going to be poetic justice, all these discrimination and laws banning equal rights for gays are going to be the kindling for the fire to burn the whole bigoted and or discrimination wall down.

Equal rights is going to get the last laugh!

Bigotry and discrimination are already against the ropes, their wobbled, their stunned!

Soon they will catch a left jab of equal rights and a right hook of justice, knocking their teeth out and sending them to the canvas down for the count!!!!
:2usflag::cheers::2dancing:
Click to expand...

We recently had a discussion about how long until SSM will be universal and I maintained we are still quite a few years away, but I must say you have proved me wrong. This case looks just like the thing that will set that precedent.
 
Re: Texas' Refusal To Allow Gay Couples To Divorce May Be The Next Constitutional Sho

sangha said:
Texas doesn't want to recognize their divorce because to do so would be a recognition of their SSM

So instead, they're forcing a same sex couple to stay married

WAY TO GO, TEXAS!! You're doing a fine job of eliminating SSM's :lamo
Click to expand...

They are not forcing anyone to stay married. They don't recognize the marriage, so nothing to grant a divorce from.
 
Re: Texas' Refusal To Allow Gay Couples To Divorce May Be The Next Constitutional Sho

WCH said:
They didn't move here so they could get a divorce.

Why put yourselves in this predicament unless you have ulterior motives or zero forethought.
Click to expand...

Methinks you just figured out two posible reasons.
 
Re: Texas' Refusal To Allow Gay Couples To Divorce May Be The Next Constitutional Sho

jimbo said:
They are not forcing anyone to stay married. They don't recognize the marriage, so nothing to grant a divorce from.
Click to expand...

The Feds recognize the marriage. What about those issues like w SS benefits
 
Re: Texas' Refusal To Allow Gay Couples To Divorce May Be The Next Constitutional Sho

iacardsfan said:
We recently had a discussion about how long until SSM will be universal and I maintained we are still quite a few years away, but I must say you have proved me wrong. This case looks just like the thing that will set that precedent.
Click to expand...

lol well EASY


thank you but i wouldnt go that far but its always nice to have hope but its exactly cases like this and the dumb state banning that are going to pave the way.

I definitely didnt prove you wrong but now at least you see the path i was trying to explain to you and how its going to come unraveled pretty quickly.

my GUESS is this will go to the SSC and be ruled on, im not sure whats going to happen there. I think the SSC is going to rule against these guys and they are going to have to push it to SCOTUS but again its these things that are going to happen more and more and more pushing equality over discrimination.
 
Re: Texas' Refusal To Allow Gay Couples To Divorce May Be The Next Constitutional Sho

AGENT J said:
actually yes even IN texas they are still legally married. Texas does not recognize their marriage to be legal on a state level but they are legally married. Even more so now with the fall of DOMA and the IRS recognizing this also granting tax rights for all those legally married no matter where they reside.

and thats the point of my op, this is the stuff that is going to help achieve equality eventually and end discrimination on this front.
Click to expand...

If you apply that logic, then my legal, Constitutional right to carry in VA is valid in every state, locality, and public building.
 
Re: Texas' Refusal To Allow Gay Couples To Divorce May Be The Next Constitutional Sho

winston53660 said:
The Feds recognize the marriage. What about those issues like w SS benefits
Click to expand...

Then the feds should grant the divorce. That ought to make an interesting SCOTUS case.
 
Re: Texas' Refusal To Allow Gay Couples To Divorce May Be The Next Constitutional Sho

jimbo said:
If you apply that logic, then my legal, Constitutional right to carry in VA is valid in every state, locality, and public building.
Click to expand...

no thats not what it says at all, never said "VALID"

if you actually use the factual logical i applied when you are in a state that doesn't recognize your CWP, you are STILL factually a conceal weapons permit holder. NOHTING can change that fact. THat state doesn't see it but you still factually are. Thats what i actually said and thats what the facts are. DOesnt matter where these guys are they are still factually married.

also on a side note, if it was up to me thats how I would make it. Your CWP should be VALID and RECOGNIZED everywhere in the US

i wish there were cases like this to push the gun laws also but the huge difference is, these guys arent breaking the law being legally married or asking for a divorce. I go to the wrong state with my gun and i could become a felon.
 
Re: Texas' Refusal To Allow Gay Couples To Divorce May Be The Next Constitutional Sho

jimbo said:
Then the feds should grant the divorce. That ought to make an interesting SCOTUS case.
Click to expand...
Wouldn't that infringe on states rights
 
Texas' Refusal To Allow Gay Couples To Divorce May Be The Next Constitutional...

jimbo said:
If you apply that logic, then my legal, Constitutional right to carry in VA is valid in every state, locality, and public building.
Click to expand...

And I won't get my radar detector confiscated when driving in Virginia.
 
Re: Texas' Refusal To Allow Gay Couples To Divorce May Be The Next Constitutional...

AliHajiSheik said:
And I won't get my radar detector confiscated when driving in Virginia.
Click to expand...

That too, Virgnia has a few smart laws, a few dumb ones, but the radar detector law is among the dumbest.
 
Re: Texas' Refusal To Allow Gay Couples To Divorce May Be The Next Constitutional Sho

winston53660 said:
Wouldn't that infringe on states rights
Click to expand...

Yes it would. That's the point.
 
Re: Texas' Refusal To Allow Gay Couples To Divorce May Be The Next Constitutional Sho

Ben K. said:
I'm a bit confused. Are there other differences between states on when a marriage is legal? Like the age of the parties involved? What happens in those cases if they do exist?
Click to expand...


Serious answer. All state recognize as valid all legal Civil Marriages entered into under another states law even if it conflicts with their own law (except for those Civil Marriages based on gender). For example, an individual as young as 13 can be Civilly Married in New Hampshire with court approval. In Texas an individual as young as 16 can be allowed to enter into a Civil Marriage under certain conditions.

Texas Statute | Family Code | Title 1 The Marriage Relationship | Subchapter B Public Policy | Sect 1.103 provides that "PERSONS MARRIED ELSEWHERE. The law of this state applies to persons married elsewhere who are domiciled in this state." Also the Texas Penal Code (PENAL CODE | TITLE 5. OFFENSES AGAINST THE PERSON | CHAPTER 21. SEXUAL OFFENSES) defines ""Spouse" means a person to whom a person is legally married under Subtitle A, Title 1, Family Code, or a comparable law of another jurisdiction." Texas Code (Sec 21.11) provides that "It is an affirmative defense to prosecution under this section that the actor was the spouse of the child at the time of the offense."

Therefore a 13 year old who is married in New Hampshire and moves with his/her spouse to Texas, they are still considered legally married under the laws of Texas with all the rights, responsibilities, and privileges (Family Code) and the (presumably older) other spouse has an affirmative defense based on Civil Marriage to not be prosecuted for child abuse/indecency with a minor.


FAMILY CODE**CHAPTER 1. GENERAL PROVISIONS
PENAL CODE**CHAPTER 21. SEXUAL OFFENSES


>>>>
 
Re: Texas' Refusal To Allow Gay Couples To Divorce May Be The Next Constitutional Sho

I can't blame them. Can you imagine all the bitching and slapping that will come around when they fight over who gets custody of the Cher CDs?

I don't want to be part of that nightmare.
 
Re: Texas' Refusal To Allow Gay Couples To Divorce May Be The Next Constitutional Sho

AGENT J said:
Texas' Refusal To Allow Gay Couples To Divorce May Be The Next Constitutional Showdown - Business Insider

back up links:
Texas and gay marriage: Will Texas’ refusal to grant divorces to same-sex couples be the next front in the marriage-equality wars? - Slate Magazine
Inside The Next Big Battle For Gay Rights


and BOOM!
there you have it.
Stuff like this is the beginning to the end of discrimination and denying equal rights.

Me and many others called it when DOMA fell and then again when IRS granted equal rights no matter the state couples reside.

National equal rights for gays is coming and many cases (hopefully just a few SSCs and one SCOTUS) like these are going to make it happen. These types or gross discrimination and equality violations along with state bannings are going to HELP establish equal rights for gays.

In my opinion there's nothing right about what Texas is doing to these people and legally other similar cases have ruled its wrong also.

Like i was saying, when DOMA fell me and others said thats the first step because cases like these and 1000s of others are going to establish equal rights.

If a gay married couple lives in taxes and one of them is in the hospital does the other not get spousal visitation rights or spousal say in healthcare?
Can one of them cheat and its ok?
What if one dies, does texas take the stuff in the dead spouses name?
Can one spouse be FORCED to testify against the other since texas doesnt see their marriage?
etc etc etc etc and a 100 more examples that involve state, and local policies.

There will be cases like these springing up more and more and they will have to be dealt with. Its great because its going to be poetic justice, all these discrimination and laws banning equal rights for gays are going to be the kindling for the fire to burn the whole bigoted and or discrimination wall down.

Equal rights is going to get the last laugh!

Bigotry and discrimination are already against the ropes, their wobbled, their stunned!

Soon they will catch a left jab of equal rights and a right hook of justice, knocking their teeth out and sending them to the canvas down for the count!!!!
:2usflag::cheers::2dancing:
Click to expand...

The question is why did this couple move to a state that does not recognize their marriage?

This was their choice and now have to live with the consequences.

They can get divorced if they move back to the state that married them.

Problem solved.
 
Re: Texas' Refusal To Allow Gay Couples To Divorce May Be The Next Constitutional Sho

Mason66 said:
1.)The question is why did this couple move to a state that does not recognize their marriage?
2.)This was their choice and now have to live with the consequences.
3.)They can get divorced if they move back to the state that married them.
4.)Problem solved.
Click to expand...

1.) yeah weirdos why do they think they can just move around the county as they see fit
2.) yep again they choose to have their rights violated
3.) wow, you nailed it, all they have to do is uproot their lives family and work/businesses they have had the last 5 years or so in texas, move back to mass, live there for a year THEN they can start the divorce procedure
4.) yep you got this all figured out, you nailed it.
 
Re: Texas' Refusal To Allow Gay Couples To Divorce May Be The Next Constitutional Sho

jimbo said:
Yes it would. That's the point.
Click to expand...

Then the federal government needs marriages and divorces every state recognizes just like with hetero marriage. After all some benefits are federal not just state
 
Re: Texas' Refusal To Allow Gay Couples To Divorce May Be The Next Constitutional Sho

winston53660 said:
Then the federal government needs marriages and divorces every state recognizes just like with hetero marriage. After all some benefits are federal not just state
Click to expand...

yep this is exactly what needs to happen and is whats going to happen eventually.

and just for info its not just some it nearly 1200 rights and benefits granted by the fed.
 
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