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Americans on Disability Hits New Record for 192nd Straight Month

tererun said:
So what is the solution again? oh yeah, put all those people out on the streets. Don't worry they are disabled so when they riot all we have to do is kick out their fake leg and then they flop around on the pavement like a fish. Don't worry, CP doesn't just want them to die, he wants to destroy your life also. You see, when these people have no more money to spend they will have to stop buying stuff. This will cause another downturn in our economy which will put more people out of work who CP also supports having them die in the gutter. Since those people will also not have money to spend then we will cut more demand and more jobs.

Yes people CP actually wants to destroy america with his plan of eliminating almost all demand for products and killing off every one of your jobs. At least it is not just cripples he doesn't care about. Of course, some of us who understand economics know you cannot support supply and demand off the one percent, but don't let simple things get in the way of faux outrage.
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Yeah, of COURSE the solution is to just walk away...'cause that's what everybody is saying, right?

:roll:

How about we focus on adaptive programs that would help place individuals with disabilities into working positions that don't make it near impossible for them to do their jobs? ADA is one thing, but obviously it isn't enough if we have 8 million+ people drawing disability instead of working.

I managed a gentleman who was paralyzed from waist to toe. He worked 35-45 hours a week covering the janitorial, box office, and concession positions in a movie theater. He worked his way through certification to become a real estate agent and ended up acquiring his license about 18 months in. Now he sells houses and makes about 2x a year more than me. But technically he could just sit and draw disability at 100%...he did it for three years before he decided he wanted more out of life than total dependence on others.

I've seen mentally retarded adults trained in a multitude of service positions, from mechanical repair, to stocking, to housekeeping, to back-of-house services in animal boarding facilities.

I've seen morbidly obese people perform a multitude of jobs, from truck driving to office work to carpet cleaning to management to sales.

The fact is, many of the "disabled" aren't incapable. We hide behind ADA saying we've done enough, and anybody that isn't working after ADA laws can't work, so the only option is to just pay 'em off and let 'em wallow. That's pretty ignorant and insulting, IMO. While there are certainly a number of disabled Americans who are temporarily unable to work, and a smaller number who are permanently unable to work, the majority don't fall into either category. So why do we relegate them to a position where they're little more than wards of the state? Why are we not instituting short-term, one-time-expense programs that will help them acquire a modified or new skill set that will allow them to succeed with the challenges they face from their disability?

But I can see why somebody would post a bunch of hyperbolic B.S. strawman nonsense....why discuss practical solutions when it's so much easier to insult somebody who suggests the current system is broken?
 
tessaesque said:
Yeah, of COURSE the solution is to just walk away...'cause that's what everybody is saying, right?

:roll:

How about we focus on adaptive programs that would help place individuals with disabilities into working positions that don't make it near impossible for them to do their jobs? ADA is one thing, but obviously it isn't enough if we have 8 million+ people drawing disability instead of working.

I managed a gentleman who was paralyzed from waist to toe. He worked 35-45 hours a week covering the janitorial, box office, and concession positions in a movie theater. He worked his way through certification to become a real estate agent and ended up acquiring his license about 18 months in. Now he sells houses and makes about 2x a year more than me. But technically he could just sit and draw disability at 100%...he did it for three years before he decided he wanted more out of life than total dependence on others.

I've seen mentally retarded adults trained in a multitude of service positions, from mechanical repair, to stocking, to housekeeping, to back-of-house services in animal boarding facilities.

I've seen morbidly obese people perform a multitude of jobs, from truck driving to office work to carpet cleaning to management to sales.

The fact is, many of the "disabled" aren't incapable. We hide behind ADA saying we've done enough, and anybody that isn't working after ADA laws can't work, so the only option is to just pay 'em off and let 'em wallow. That's pretty ignorant and insulting, IMO. While there are certainly a number of disabled Americans who are temporarily unable to work, and a smaller number who are permanently unable to work, the majority don't fall into either category. So why do we relegate them to a position where they're little more than wards of the state? Why are we not instituting short-term, one-time-expense programs that will help them acquire a modified or new skill set that will allow them to succeed with the challenges they face from their disability?

But I can see why somebody would post a bunch of hyperbolic B.S. strawman nonsense....why discuss practical solutions when it's so much easier to insult somebody who suggests the current system is broken?
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They have the "ticket to work" program, but if I remember the statistics correctly.
Only about 1% of people use it.
 
Harry Guerrilla said:
They have the "ticket to work" program, but if I remember the statistics correctly.
Only about 1% of people use it.
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Optional programs aren't the answer. There are optional work-training programs for welfare recipients in Texas, but they're all but completely unused. If you make an assessment and placement program mandatory as part of receipt of any income supplement (SS retirement excluded), I'm betting you'll see more people advancing themselves in the long-run than we currently see.

"We'll process your app for disability aid and determine based upon your interview, survey, and medical assessment whether you need full long-term supplementation or short-term financial aid and job training services."
 
tessaesque said:
Optional programs aren't the answer. There are optional work-training programs for welfare recipients in Texas, but they're all but completely unused. If you make an assessment and placement program mandatory as part of receipt of any income supplement (SS retirement excluded), I'm betting you'll see more people advancing themselves in the long-run than we currently see.

"We'll process your app for disability aid and determine based upon your interview, survey, and medical assessment whether you need full long-term supplementation or short-term financial aid and job training services."
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I'm pretty familiar with these programs.
At least for people who are on SSI.

If they make too much and work too long, they lose the medical benefits.
Of the two people I know, both were born with life long birth defects.
Their medical situations will never be cheap.

Letting them keep their medical benefits, but dropping the checks, I nearly guarantee both would go to work.
 
Harry Guerrilla said:
If I remember right, the fraud "detectors" only look for it, during the process of applying.
After approval, it's over.

A lot of people have gotten wise to that.
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Every 3 years, someone on disability is supposed to be re-evaluated for it. Whether that happens or not, I don't know. I recently helped my wife get on disability due to her MS, and she has 8 years of medical history documenting it as well as having to go to a psycologist and 2 other independent doctors for approval. It's not as easy as people think to just "go on disability".
 
TheNextEra said:
Every 3 years, someone on disability is supposed to be re-evaluated for it. Whether that happens or not, I don't know. I recently helped my wife get on disability due to her MS, and she has 8 years of medical history documenting it as well as having to go to a psycologist and 2 other independent doctors for approval. It's not as easy as people think to just "go on disability".
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If the re evaluations are anything like SSI, it's a gigantic joke.
It's not always easy, but for some it is.
 
Harry Guerrilla said:
If the re evaluations are anything like SSI, it's a gigantic joke.
It's not always easy, but for some it is.
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My mother got on disability with little effort at all. She didn't need years of medical records and only spent about 15 minutes face-to-face with a case worker.
 
tessaesque said:
My mother got on disability with little effort at all. She didn't need years of medical records and only spent about 15 minutes face-to-face with a case worker.
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Yes, but I if I remember correctly, your mother's diability was kinda like a "no-brainer" thing for them to decide on right? It wasn't like she just said to herself "I can't find a job, so I'm going on disability". That's what I'm getting at.

For most, I won't say all, it is difficult for a person that can work to just "fake" a disability.
 
tessaesque said:
My mother got on disability with little effort at all. She didn't need years of medical records and only spent about 15 minutes face-to-face with a case worker.
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Some people walk into it, with nothing, others have hell.
They're weird about it.
It may be the specific case worker, not sure really.

I've had the "luck" of being able to visit the SS office and sit in on evaluations.
Now these were for SSI, not SSDI but they just collected income/asset/bill information.
That was it.
 
Harry Guerrilla said:
If the re evaluations are anything like SSI, it's a gigantic joke.
It's not always easy, but for some it is.
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Yes, but the point is for most, it is not just a "Well I can't find a job so I'm going on disability" decision. I'm sure there are some people that are frauding the system, but I doubt most on especially now.
 
cpwill said:
And those 13 are also supporting the people on Welfare, Social Security, Medicaid, Unemployment.... yeesh. No wonder we have trillion dollar deficits.
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There is no way that many people are ACTUALLY disabled in any realistic way...
 
TheNextEra said:
Yes, but the point is for most, it is not just a "Well I can't find a job so I'm going on disability" decision. I'm sure there are some people that are frauding the system, but I doubt most on especially now.
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I'd say, I don't know.
I mean, I'm sure most have legitimate medical problems.

Are they bad enough, that they can't work anywhere, doing anything?
That's were I'd question it.

Of the two people I knew who got on SSDI.
They both had to hide their motorcycles during the initial eval.
I was a teenager at that time though.
 
Harry Guerrilla said:
Are they bad enough, that they can't work anywhere, doing anything?
That's were I'd question it.

Of the two people I knew who got on SSDI.
They both had to hide their motorcycles during the initial eval.
I was a teenager at that time though.
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Again, I can only go by my experience and talking with the evaluators for my wife and from other people I've met that have gone through the same thing. The evalutor said they look for things like "Can they be re-trained?" , "Do they have the ability to be re-trained?", "Can they function without assistance?", etc. In the case of MS, it affects all parts of the body and it's never the same thing with different people. My wife has many lesions on her brain that affect her memory and speech, as well as two lesions on her spine that affect her walking and sitting ability. They looked into all of this and even had her audited as well in the end. She couldn't do the job she was at and with MS, she doesn't have the ability to work steady. Add that to how an employer would have to deal with my wife having to leave due to migraines, not able to sit or walk without being in pain, the medication she has to take, and it's just not feasible.

It really was a big evaluation and there were pages upon pages I had to help fill out for my wife. Also, when she was evaluated I wasn't allowed to be in there with her at the time.

I won't say there aren't cases of abuse, but given how the evalutions go I just don't see a majority of people able to "fake it" just because "they can't find work".
 
TheNextEra said:
Again, I can only go by my experience and talking with the evaluators for my wife and from other people I've met that have gone through the same thing. The evalutor said they look for things like "Can they be re-trained?" , "Do they have the ability to be re-trained?", "Can they function without assistance?", etc. In the case of MS, it affects all parts of the body and it's never the same thing with different people. My wife has many lesions on her brain that affect her memory and speech, as well as two lesions on her spine that affect her walking and sitting ability. They looked into all of this and even had her audited as well in the end.

It really was a big evaluation and there were pages upon pages I had to help fill out for my wife. Also, when she was evaluated I wasn't allowed to be in there with her at the time.

I won't say there aren't cases of abuse, but given how the evalutions go I just don't see a majority of people able to "fake it" just because "they can't find work".
Click to expand...

I'm not denying your experience, at all.
I'm definitely not implying, at all, that your wife is undeserving of SSDI.
Just to be very clear.

I'm just relating my experience.
I'm pretty sure, different people, at different locations will be evaluated differently.
Some get the fine toothed comb, while others can be waved in.
 
tererun said:
So what is the solution again? oh yeah, put all those people out on the streets. Don't worry they are disabled so when they riot all we have to do is kick out their fake leg and then they flop around on the pavement like a fish. Don't worry, CP doesn't just want them to die, he wants to destroy your life also. You see, when these people have no more money to spend they will have to stop buying stuff. This will cause another downturn in our economy which will put more people out of work who CP also supports having them die in the gutter. Since those people will also not have money to spend then we will cut more demand and more jobs.

Yes people CP actually wants to destroy america with his plan of eliminating almost all demand for products and killing off every one of your jobs. At least it is not just cripples he doesn't care about. Of course, some of us who understand economics know you cannot support supply and demand off the one percent, but don't let simple things get in the way of faux outrage.
Click to expand...

Your posts are the most predictable on this forum. Always angry. Always hyperbolic. Always wrong.
 
Harry Guerrilla said:
I'm not denying your experience, at all.
I'm definitely not implying, at all, that your wife is undeserving of SSDI.
Just to be very clear.
Click to expand...

I didn't take it that way at all, but thank you for clarifying. I mentioned it only because of the evaluation she had to go through and what they looked at. It was very detailed and even audited at the end.

Harry Guerrilla said:
I'm just relating my experience.
I'm pretty sure, different people, at different locations will be evaluated differently.
Some get the fine toothed comb, while others can be waved in.
Click to expand...


Well, and that may be the problem right there. If people aren't doing their job, those that are found to be frauding the system should be punished along with possibly the evalutors if it's found they didn't do their job correctly.

But to accomplish this, would you agree the government would have to hire more auditors?
 
TheNextEra said:
Again, I can only go by my experience and talking with the evaluators for my wife and from other people I've met that have gone through the same thing. The evalutor said they look for things like "Can they be re-trained?" , "Do they have the ability to be re-trained?", "Can they function without assistance?", etc. In the case of MS, it affects all parts of the body and it's never the same thing with different people. My wife has many lesions on her brain that affect her memory and speech, as well as two lesions on her spine that affect her walking and sitting ability. They looked into all of this and even had her audited as well in the end. She couldn't do the job she was at and with MS, she doesn't have the ability to work steady. Add that to how an employer would have to deal with my wife having to leave due to migraines, not able to sit or walk without being in pain, the medication she has to take, and it's just not feasible.

It really was a big evaluation and there were pages upon pages I had to help fill out for my wife. Also, when she was evaluated I wasn't allowed to be in there with her at the time.

I won't say there aren't cases of abuse, but given how the evalutions go I just don't see a majority of people able to "fake it" just because "they can't find work".
Click to expand...

Your wife absolutely deserves disability. And, if it were up to me, she'd get more than she's getting, frankly. In the Chicago area, not a day goes by without three or more commercials from law firms offering to help people get on disability.

One only has to look at the exponential increase in those on disability to know it is rampant with fraud.
 
TheNextEra said:
I didn't take it that way at all, but thank you for clarifying. I mentioned it only because of the evaluation she had to go through and what they looked at. It was very detailed and even audited at the end.
Click to expand...

Just wanted to make sure you didn't think I was trying to insult your wife.
I don't go there, but sometimes the written word can give the guise of implying such a thing.

TheNextEra said:
Well, and that may be the problem right there. If people aren't doing their job, those that are found to be frauding the system should be punished along with possibly the evalutors if it's found they didn't do their job correctly.
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I think so.
A lot of the SS office people seem to be meh about their job.
At least at the office I visited.

TheNextEra said:
But to accomplish this, would you agree the government would have to hire more auditors?
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That would be fine with me.
All I know right now, is that someone I know, is getting SSDI for bipolar disorder, however they have the ability to ride a motorcycle all day and do work like activities.
Doesn't make much sense to me.

On the flip side, I know 2 people, that could work, even though they were born disabled but can't because of their medical costs.
We should fix that first, imo.
People with disabilities should be able to retain Medicaid/Medicare benefits, if they want to work and their disability has not been cured.
 
joko104 said:
Yes, rage away as if you give a damn - when you don't at all.

People who commit disability fraud steal from those who truly are disabled by watering down the available funds for those who truly need it. Do you care? Do you care that disability fraud is actually stealing those who truly are disabled? No, you don't give a damn, do you? Not a word commenting that there is no enforcement nor investigation to prevent such fraud and theft.

Rather, you go into the ad nauseau mindless sheeple partisan raging on behalf of welfare fraudsters.

There is a simple difference between my message and yours. Mine does care about theft and fraud of the public treasury and from those who truly need assistance. And in your message you don't give a damn about the truly disabled nor those that steal by fraud from the SS system. You just created your own strawman of putting the truly disabled out on the street - which he didn't post - and the go off on some MSNBC rant against the "one percent" - as if that has any relevancy to this topic whatsoever.

Bottomline? You don't care about the disabled one iota. You just look for excuses to do pointless partisan ranting - and, yes, faux ranting.
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tererun is a performance artist, according to his profile...
probably unemployed..
 
TheNextEra said:
Every 3 years, someone on disability is supposed to be re-evaluated for it. Whether that happens or not, I don't know. I recently helped my wife get on disability due to her MS, and she has 8 years of medical history documenting it as well as having to go to a psycologist and 2 other independent doctors for approval. It's not as easy as people think to just "go on disability".
Click to expand...

I have tried, yet cannot find ant statistics on this review process from SSA.

Generally, there is no need to worry about a medical continuing review if you have not experienced an improvement in your medical condition or have not returned to work at a level that Social Security considers to be substantial gainful activity.
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HOW DOES THE SOCIAL SECURITY DISABILITY REVIEW WORK?
 
MaggieD said:
Your wife absolutely deserves disability. And, if it were up to me, she'd get more than she's getting, frankly. In the Chicago area, not a day goes by without three or more commercials from law firms offering to help people get on disability.

One only has to look at the exponential increase in those on disability to know it is rampant with fraud.
Click to expand...

Well like I mentioned before, if that truly is the case that there is rampant fraud then there seems to be probable cause for the government to hire more auditors and have bi-partisan support for it.
 
ttwtt78640 said:
I have tried, yet cannot find ant statistics on this review process from SSA.

HOW DOES THE SOCIAL SECURITY DISABILITY REVIEW WORK?
Click to expand...

We were told we would be contacted every three years and were even shown the paperwork we would have to fill out. All I can go by is what the evaluators and the auditors have told us which is every 3 years. I'll dig through her paperwork tonight and see if I can find somewhere it says that.
 
Harry Guerrilla said:
Just wanted to make sure you didn't think I was trying to insult your wife.
I don't go there, but sometimes the written word can give the guise of implying such a thing.
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Again, thank you for the clarification.

Harry Guerrilla said:
I think so.
A lot of the SS office people seem to be meh about their job.
At least at the office I visited.
Click to expand...

The reno office here in Nevada is pretty good. They were friendly and thorough (thank goodness) because it was a difficult time for her.

Harry Guerrilla said:
That would be fine with me.
All I know right now, is that someone I know, is getting SSDI for bipolar disorder, however they have the ability to ride a motorcycle all day and do work like activities.
Doesn't make much sense to me.

On the flip side, I know 2 people, that could work, even though they were born disabled but can't because of their medical costs.
We should fix that first, imo.
People with disabilities should be able to retain Medicaid/Medicare benefits, if they want to work and their disability has not been cured.
Click to expand...

Well, I think as far as whistleblower is concerned, I do believe you can call the SS office and report that person.

If the truth is that fraud is rampant, then there definitely needs to be more auditors and support for hiring them.
 
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