• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Tactical Response CEO Threatens To 'Start Killing People' Over Possible Obama Gun Mea

Re: Tactical Response CEO Threatens To 'Start Killing People' Over Possible Obama Gun

You don't see the left pushing its socialist agenda so far that some will begin to plot against this government? If they
go too far in their efforts to "ban guns" I can see a lot of people going off the deep end. I don't think the government
will go that far - but I suspect some states will come very close. Illinois for one.

I don't care what the left is doing. Responding with violence, or even tacit threats of violence, isn't the answer.

This talk of how there's going to be civil war and violent outbursts if Obama tries gun confiscation, how is that helpful? It's not. It's just crazy. Why don't those of us on the pro-gun side try to keep level-headed. We have the rational argument, so let's stop it with the rhetoric that makes the lefties look rational by comparison, huh?
 
Last edited:
Re: Tactical Response CEO Threatens To 'Start Killing People' Over Possible Obama Gun

Look Goshin, I generally agree with you on gun control, and in fact I am quite a bit to the right of you when it comes to gun control issues. Compared to me you are a left-winger on gun regulation.

BUT you are simply spouting nonsense. Threats of violence in the face of stricter gun control are not the answer. It is despicable to indulge in this sort of thing.

OMG a gun supporter with a brain? Oh man, you are going to be the first to die and i will mourn your death for it will be the death of a voice of reason within the gun community. I just wish more gun owners were aware that shooting up the streets, or threatening to do so, is not a way to show gun owners can be non-violent.
 
Re: Tactical Response CEO Threatens To 'Start Killing People' Over Possible Obama Gun

You don't see the left pushing its socialist agenda so far that some will begin to plot against this government? If they
go too far in their efforts to "ban guns" I can see a lot of people going off the deep end. I don't think the government
will go that far - but I suspect some states will come very close. Illinois for one.


What "socialist agenda" do you see the government pushing? I see a federal government that is just like most others over the history of the nation and particularly so since the Gilded Age of the late 19th Century - basically controlled by the "powers that be"
 
Re: Tactical Response CEO Threatens To 'Start Killing People' Over Possible Obama Gun

I completely agree with you, but unfortunately not all on the extreme pro rights / libertarian side do.


I don't care what the left is doing. Responding with violence, or even tacit threats of violence, isn't the answer.

This talk of how there's going to be civil war and violent outbursts if Obama tires gun confiscation, how is the helpful? It's not. It's just crazy. Why don't those of us on the pro-gun side try to keep level-headed. We have the rational argument, so let's stop it with the rhetoric that makes the lefties look rational by comparison, huh?
 
Re: Tactical Response CEO Threatens To 'Start Killing People' Over Possible Obama Gun

The argument then comes down to whether or not a majority of Americans do or don't think a specific action undertaken by the President is "an attempt to obviate the 2nd amendment"

What happens then? What if 23% of Americans believe as you do but the rest of the citizenry thinks your faction is a bunch of "delusional whackjobs"? What do you do then?

We are still a Republic and the natural rights which our Constitution forbids the government from infringing upon still exist and will always exist. If 99.99% of the population wants to ban guns then tough **** because it's still a natural right and the Constitution still prohibits government from taking that kind of action. Once you get rid of the 2nd amendment you may as well get rid of the rest of the Constitution because it won't be worth the paper it's written on.
 
Re: Tactical Response CEO Threatens To 'Start Killing People' Over Possible Obama Gun

OMG a gun supporter with a brain? Oh man, you are going to be the first to die and i will mourn your death for it will be the death of a voice of reason within the gun community. I just wish more gun owners were aware that shooting up the streets, or threatening to do so, is not a way to show gun owners can be non-violent.

Way to utterly fail to understand the point, and the seriousness of this issue.

Should the government become tyrannical, defending the constitution from domestic enemies is NOT about showing that. What revolutionary want to be perceived as NOT a threat?

The FACT that most gun owners ARE non-violent doesn't need to be shown, its already self evident to anyone who can read statistics. Having a line in the sand that if crossed will make one defend their rights is only crazy to someone who would never fight for their rights, even at the point of slavery.
 
Re: Tactical Response CEO Threatens To 'Start Killing People' Over Possible Obama Gun

We are still a Republic and the natural rights which our Constitution forbids the government from infringing upon still exist and will always exist. If 99.99% of the population wants to ban guns then tough **** because it's still a natural right and the Constitution still prohibits government from taking that kind of action. Once you get rid of the 2nd amendment you may as well get rid of the rest of the Constitution because it won't be worth the paper it's written on.


or in other words: "I can't actually answer your questions so I will post some other words"

Then there is the question that comes to mind: When did owning a lethal firearm become a "natural right"? At this time, you can label it what ever you wish but the real world says that it is the government in all of its many forms that presently allows you to own firearms.
 
Last edited:
Re: Tactical Response CEO Threatens To 'Start Killing People' Over Possible Obama Gun

Context is everything and although he used the phrase "start killing people" it was prefaced by "if this goes one inch further".
Really? I'll tell you what, you go tell Mr. Gibbons, who was most likely, and I am speculating here, responsible for signing that permit, to relax and not worry about that one-inch-further-thing. I'm sure he will tell you about his responsibilities as well as his rights as well. ;)

Yeager was obviously - and rightly - pissed off about the likelihood of Obama doing by EO what he knows won't pass congress and that's a problem. Personally, I'd go so far as to suggest that if Obama overreaches on this gun control stuff it would be incumbent on the American people to get him out of that office by whatever means become necessary.
Oh, yeah, that Executive Order thing. If he does do anything concerning that, I'm willing to believe that it will be elements that will address the following things that the courts will uphold:

  • He should end the "gun show loophole" to force people who buy guns at a gun show or through private sales and online shopping to have a background check: 92% of Americans favor this position per Gallup, while PPP puts support at 76%.
  • Obama should seek to ban high-capacity ammunition clips that contain more than 10 bullets: CNN/ORC, Gallup, Pew, PPP, and YouGov all show at least 53% of Americans in favor of this policy.
  • Obama should seek to ban high-capacity ammunition clips that contain more than 10 bullets: CNN/ORC, Gallup, Pew, PPP, and YouGov all show at least 53% of Americans in favor of this policy.
  • He should seek ways to ensure that people with poor mental health records do not get a gun: CNN/ORC found that 92% Americans did not want Americans with mental health problems to be in possession of a gun; PPP took it one step farther and discovered that 63% of Americans want people to be required to take a health exam before buying a gun. Obama should obviously prevent felons convicted of a violent crime from owning a gun: 94% and 92% approve of that measure, per PPP and CNN/ORC respectively.
  • Obama should look to ban outright bullets that explode or are designed to break through a bullet-proof vest: Pew found that 56% favor this position.
  • He should try to make sure that guns, even if not recently purchased, would be registered with a government or law enforcement agency: CNN/ORC finds 78% agree with that policy.
  • Obama should try to make it more difficult to buy ammunition and/or guns over the internet: 69% of Americans wanted to ban these practices, according to PPP.

I do agree with the Guardian on the assault weapon ban using the EO; if he does do it, it should be done legislatively. But Obama needs to do this while having a narrow window to complete this.

My personal opinion, is that the GOP controlled house is going to go along with the vast majority of those elements I showed you; they are already not standing well with that "fiscal cliff" thing and did not fare well in the Senate in last November's election, so they are sitting in those seats in the House--and sitting nervously.
 
Re: Tactical Response CEO Threatens To 'Start Killing People' Over Possible Obama Gun

or in other words: "I can't actually answer your questions so I will post some other words"

Then there is the question that comes to mind: When did owning a lethal firearm become a "natural right"? At this time, you can label it what ever you wish but the real world says that it is the government in all of its many forms that presently allows you to own firearms.

The Bill of Rights doesn't grant a thing, it prevents governments from infringing on that which is already there. If you're ignorant to the subject of a natural right, google is your friend.

I am free man, I do not require anyone's permission for this.
 
Re: Tactical Response CEO Threatens To 'Start Killing People' Over Possible Obama Gun

Gun owners please feel free to protest like crazy. you have all this energy so go do a protest or a bunch of them. leave your guns at home because they have no place in a peaceful protest, and if they are at home in a safe place they cannot be confiscated and you keep them. I know how the cops work. keep your guns, keep it on a low key. protest in a loud voice that this is wrong. Don't make threats of violence. All that does is just show them who to disarm first. All that shows society is that you are a angry nasty bully. No one likes that. What they do like is the calm respectable guy who is not going to flip out and is reliable. Most people do not have a problem with the calm level headed guy who doesn't spout off and make threats having a gun. They do have a problem with the guy who threatens violence and uses their gun as some sort of intimidation factor by making innuendo that they are willing to use it. You are letting too many of those latter people talk for you.

I know that some of you under control people are soft spoken and respectful and still own a gun. Now is the time to respectfully tell your brothers and sisters in arms to sit down and STFU.
 
Re: Tactical Response CEO Threatens To 'Start Killing People' Over Possible Obama Gun

What's that "one more inch"?

Assigning a $100 fee for every NICS check.
Limiting the number of NICS checks an FFL can make in a given period of time.
Outlawing the transfer of firearms between private owners.
Outlawing common firearms accessories such as 30 round magazines for AR's while allowing them for state use.
Outlawing semi-automatic firearms.
National registration of firearms.

In short, anything which serves to infringe upon the rights of lawful private citizens to properly maintain the ability to defend themselves from known and common threats.

Thanks for answering only half of what I asked. Thanks again for throwing some fairly odd 'reasons' :roll:

I think there is a damn good possibility for reduced mag cap, so you think blood will be flowing, or does ALL the restrictions have to be made law?

Now answer the question I asked on YOUR STATEMENT- WTF do you mean by all means necessary to remove the Elected Leader of our Republic?

Did you over reach? ;)
 
Re: Tactical Response CEO Threatens To 'Start Killing People' Over Possible Obama Gun

He's a hothead, but I'm hearing a lot of similar talk from a lot of other gun owners also... people need to realize that if they push too far on this issue there really will be violence... possibly a lot of it.


I hope it doesn't come to that, but Pelosi's bill has some really outrageous, insane stuff in it and the notion of Constitutional infringement by one-man fiat (Executive Order) has many people already beyond enraged.

If you don't want violence than you should support background checks on ALL gun sales. 74% of NRA members do.
 
Re: Tactical Response CEO Threatens To 'Start Killing People' Over Possible Obama Gun

Way to utterly fail to understand the point, and the seriousness of this issue.

Should the government become tyrannical, defending the constitution from domestic enemies is NOT about showing that. What revolutionary want to be perceived as NOT a threat?

The FACT that most gun owners ARE non-violent doesn't need to be shown, its already self evident to anyone who can read statistics. Having a line in the sand that if crossed will make one defend their rights is only crazy to someone who would never fight for their rights, even at the point of slavery.

You are the loudmouthed reactionary guy who people don't want owning a gun because you make threats and oppress with it. You are also the ones who are going to contribute the most to getting guns banned. I also have a bet tyhat you are not going to be the one who stands up to face the authorities when they come to take your guns from you. There is a reason people like you have guns, and that is because you are afraid. A gun makes you less afraid because you are more powerful than other people in your mind. The problem is when the authorities come for your weapon they are going to have bigger and better guns and you are going to panic. That is what people like you do because you are not in control. You let your environment control you, and that is why you don't need to have a gun.
 
Re: Tactical Response CEO Threatens To 'Start Killing People' Over Possible Obama Gun

I don't care what the left is doing. Responding with violence, or even tacit threats of violence, isn't the answer.

This talk of how there's going to be civil war and violent outbursts if Obama tries gun confiscation, how is that helpful? It's not. It's just crazy. Why don't those of us on the pro-gun side try to keep level-headed. We have the rational argument, so let's stop it with the rhetoric that makes the lefties look rational by comparison, huh?

So what is your plan, Guy?

If, on Tuesday, the recommendation comes down that Obama can act entirely on his own and require all FFL's to turn over their 4473's for the purpose of creating a national registry and assessing a $250 fee on every NICS check and Obama does that then what are you going to do? Are you just going to sit there and say, "Well, it could have been worse."

Tell me, what would happen if those 2 things were implemented? How well would it work and how would those things make us any safer while preserving the right of the private citizen to keep and bear arms?
 
Re: Tactical Response CEO Threatens To 'Start Killing People' Over Possible Obama Gun

You are the loudmouthed reactionary guy who people don't want owning a gun because you make threats and oppress with it. You are also the ones who are going to contribute the most to getting guns banned. I also have a bet tyhat you are not going to be the one who stands up to face the authorities when they come to take your guns from you. There is a reason people like you have guns, and that is because you are afraid. A gun makes you less afraid because you are more powerful than other people in your mind. The problem is when the authorities come for your weapon they are going to have bigger and better guns and you are going to panic. That is what people like you do because you are not in control. You let your environment control you, and that is why you don't need to have a gun.

Stopped reading after "loudmouthed"

Goshin was right about you, :beatdeadhorse
 
Re: Tactical Response CEO Threatens To 'Start Killing People' Over Possible Obama Gun

So what is your plan, Guy?

If, on Tuesday, the recommendation comes down that Obama can act entirely on his own and require all FFL's to turn over their 4473's for the purpose of creating a national registry and assessing a $250 fee on every NICS check and Obama does that then what are you going to do? Are you just going to sit there and say, "Well, it could have been worse."

Tell me, what would happen if those 2 things were implemented? How well would it work and how would those things make us any safer while preserving the right of the private citizen to keep and bear arms?

If it really comes down to it, you should respond to violations of civil rights by government they way you're supposed to, with nonviolent passive-resistance. This is, at root, a civil rights issue. Follow the example of that great crusader for civil rights, Martin Luther King, Jr.

If you're opposed to gun control laws, don't kill a cop over it. That's crazy and downright morally repugnant. If you want to show true courage, resist peacefully, and go to jail over it.
 
Re: Tactical Response CEO Threatens To 'Start Killing People' Over Possible Obama Gun

Thanks for answering only half of what I asked. Thanks again for throwing some fairly odd 'reasons' :roll:

I think there is a damn good possibility for reduced mag cap, so you think blood will be flowing, or does ALL the restrictions have to be made law?

Now answer the question I asked on YOUR STATEMENT- WTF do you mean by all means necessary to remove the Elected Leader of our Republic?

Did you over reach? ;)

Please refer to post #70....which you already replied to.
 
Re: Tactical Response CEO Threatens To 'Start Killing People' Over Possible Obama Gun

Really? I'll tell you what, you go tell Mr. Gibbons, who was most likely, and I am speculating here, responsible for signing that permit, to relax and not worry about that one-inch-further-thing. I'm sure he will tell you about his responsibilities as well as his rights as well. ;)


Oh, yeah, that Executive Order thing. If he does do anything concerning that, I'm willing to believe that it will be elements that will address the following things that the courts will uphold:

  • He should end the "gun show loophole" to force people who buy guns at a gun show or through private sales and online shopping to have a background check: 92% of Americans favor this position per Gallup, while PPP puts support at 76%.
  • Obama should seek to ban high-capacity ammunition clips that contain more than 10 bullets: CNN/ORC, Gallup, Pew, PPP, and YouGov all show at least 53% of Americans in favor of this policy.
  • Obama should seek to ban high-capacity ammunition clips that contain more than 10 bullets: CNN/ORC, Gallup, Pew, PPP, and YouGov all show at least 53% of Americans in favor of this policy.
  • He should seek ways to ensure that people with poor mental health records do not get a gun: CNN/ORC found that 92% Americans did not want Americans with mental health problems to be in possession of a gun; PPP took it one step farther and discovered that 63% of Americans want people to be required to take a health exam before buying a gun. Obama should obviously prevent felons convicted of a violent crime from owning a gun: 94% and 92% approve of that measure, per PPP and CNN/ORC respectively.
  • Obama should look to ban outright bullets that explode or are designed to break through a bullet-proof vest: Pew found that 56% favor this position.
  • He should try to make sure that guns, even if not recently purchased, would be registered with a government or law enforcement agency: CNN/ORC finds 78% agree with that policy.
  • Obama should try to make it more difficult to buy ammunition and/or guns over the internet: 69% of Americans wanted to ban these practices, according to PPP.

I do agree with the Guardian on the assault weapon ban using the EO; if he does do it, it should be done legislatively. But Obama needs to do this while having a narrow window to complete this.

My personal opinion, is that the GOP controlled house is going to go along with the vast majority of those elements I showed you; they are already not standing well with that "fiscal cliff" thing and did not fare well in the Senate in last November's election, so they are sitting in those seats in the House--and sitting nervously.

i think that is a very reasonable plan that allows people to still own guns and does it's best to keep guns out of the hands of unstable people. The magazine thing could stay or go with me because a practiced person really can swap out magazines very quickly.
 
Re: Tactical Response CEO Threatens To 'Start Killing People' Over Possible Obama Gun

If it really comes down to it, you should respond to violations of civil rights by government they way you're supposed to, with nonviolent passive-resistance. This is, at root, a civil rights issue. Follow the example of that great crusader for civil rights, Martin Luther King, Jr.

The ownership of firearms by lawful citizens isn't a "civil right".

Civil rights are granted by the state. The right to self defense by possession and even use (as necessary) of arms is a natural right. It's something which the state can not grant but one which it may well try to take away.
 
Re: Tactical Response CEO Threatens To 'Start Killing People' Over Possible Obama Gun

The ownership of firearms by lawful citizens isn't a "civil right".

Civil rights are granted by the state. The right to self defense by possession and even use (as necessary) of arms is a natural right. It's something which the state can not grant but one which it may well try to take away.

Now you're just drawing an artificial distinction. All rights are civil rights, because they are rights of an individual as against the state. The state doesn't grant any civil rights, it merely recognizes them. Equal protection under the law is a civil right the same as the right to gun ownership is a civil right.

You're just trying to justify the use of violence where it simply cannot be done. You should be ashamed of yourself. Moreover, you are being foolish. Violent resistance doesn't work. Passive resistance is how to win these sorts of battles, as MLK and Gandhi have shown in the past.

To repeat, if you have true courage, you will not resist violently, you will resist peacefully, and go to jail if necessary to support your rights.
 
Re: Tactical Response CEO Threatens To 'Start Killing People' Over Possible Obama Gun

Really? How many licensed gun stores you know of that will sell you a machine gun or bazooka? The sell of firearms or armaments has been regulated now for quite a long while.
Dont care anymore.
 
Re: Tactical Response CEO Threatens To 'Start Killing People' Over Possible Obama Gun

If it really comes down to it, you should respond to violations of civil rights by government they way you're supposed to, with nonviolent passive-resistance. This is, at root, a civil rights issue. Follow the example of that great crusader for civil rights, Martin Luther King, Jr.

If you're opposed to gun control laws, don't kill a cop over it. That's crazy and downright morally repugnant. If you want to show true courage, resist peacefully, and go to jail over it.

You feel asleep in civics didn't you? These are your civil rights:
Civil rights include the ensuring of peoples' physical and mental integrity, life and safety; protection from discrimination on grounds such as physical or mental disability, gender, religion, race, national origin, age, status as a member of the uniformed services, sexual orientation, or gender identity;[1][2][3] and individual rights such as privacy, the freedoms of thought and conscience, speech and expression, religion, the press, and movement.

They include some of the individual rights, but not all of them, for example firearms. Our individual rights are natural, the Bill of Rights doesn't grant them but limit the government on treading on them.

That being said, you're right about using the political process before or instead of violence. However I've heard interviews from a great many LEO and Sheriff that state they will refuse to engage in confiscations if Federally mandated. The police aren't foolish either, they don't want to be jack-booted thugs either.
 
Last edited:
Re: Tactical Response CEO Threatens To 'Start Killing People' Over Possible Obama Gun

You feel asleep in civics didn't you? These are your civil rights:


They include some of the individual rights, but not all of them, for example firearms.

Your emotionalism and insults are unwelcome. You retaliation with insult is symptomatic of the whole problem. Your initial response to attack rather than use reason.

And you're also wrong. We're talking about civil rights. You are the one who needs a civics lesson. But I have neither time nor inclination to give it to you.
 
Re: Tactical Response CEO Threatens To 'Start Killing People' Over Possible Obama Gun

Good thing you are not all overemotional about the issue.

The thing that is scarey about all these people threatening violence is they tend to be the same ones who see fascists and commies everywhere.

Here is one on the left (me) who agrees that it is too late too defend the 2nd once it has already been taken away. I don't see commies or fascists anywhere. The sole reason I would defend the 2nd through violence is because it is a necessary component of the long term preservation of liberty. This is true whether or not there are currently any fascists or commies.

The very act of infringing the 2nd is a tyrannical act, all by itself.
 
Re: Tactical Response CEO Threatens To 'Start Killing People' Over Possible Obama Gun

Really? How many licensed gun stores you know of that will sell you a machine gun or bazooka? The sell of firearms or armaments has been regulated now for quite a long while.

There is a Class III gun store 2 blocks from me. I happen to know of each one in my state.
 
Back
Top Bottom