• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Welfare Recipients Take out Cash at Strip Clubs, Liquor Stores and X-rated Shops.....

MMC

Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
Feb 26, 2012
Messages
56,981
Reaction score
27,029
Location
Chicago Illinois
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Private
Welfare recipients took out cash at bars, liquor stores, X-rated video shops, hookah parlors and even strip clubs — where they presumably spent their taxpayer money on lap dances rather than diapers, a Post investigation found.

post_cover120648--300x450.jpg


A database of 200 million Electronic Benefit Transfer records from January 2011 to July 2012, obtained by The Post through a Freedom of Information request, showed welfare recipients using their EBT cards to make dozens of cash withdrawals at ATMs inside Hank’s Saloon in Brooklyn; the Blue Door Video porn shop in the East Village; The Anchor, a sleek SoHo lounge; the Patriot Saloon in TriBeCa; and Drinks Galore, a liquor distributor in The Bronx.

The state Office of Temporary and Disability Assistance (OTDA), which oversees the “cash assistance program,” even lists some of these welfare-ready ATMs on its Web site.

Welfare recipients receive food stamps and cash assistance under the federal Temporary Assistance for Needy Families program. Both benefits are accessed through an EBT card, but only cash assistance — meant for housing, utilities and household necessities — can be accessed at ATMs.

A single-person household could receive a maximum $200 in monthly food stamps plus $158 in cash assistance. A family of four could get as much as $668 in food stamps and $433 in cash.

The food-stamp program prohibits the purchase of booze, tobacco and lottery tickets with an EBT card. But with the cash-assistance program, users can blow money on strippers or a six-pack and to tap welfare dollars from liquor stores, casinos and adult-oriented establishments.

The Middle Class Tax Relief and Job Creation Act, signed by President Obama last February, requires states to prohibit sinful welfare spending by 2014. If they don’t, they’ll forfeit federal cash.

A spokesman with the US Department of Health and Human Services said states make their own rules on EBT cards.

Some states already limit where EBT cards can withdraw money.....snip~

EXCLUSIVE: Welfare recipients using EBT cards to get cash at strip clubs, X-rated video stores and bars - NYPOST.com

Guess this goes with them Using Food Stamps and those that sell them for cash at twice the Amount in Food Stamps. Some of them stand Right outside Stores that are designed for the EBT and food stamps. Thoughts?
 
Re: Welfare Recipients Take out Cash at Strip Clubs, Liquor Stores and X-rated Shops.

If they are getting enough welfare money to spend it like this, then they are getting way too much.
 
Re: Welfare Recipients Take out Cash at Strip Clubs, Liquor Stores and X-rated Shops.

Welfare recipients took out cash at bars, liquor stores, X-rated video shops, hookah parlors and even strip clubs — where they presumably spent their taxpayer money on lap dances rather than diapers, a Post investigation found.

post_cover120648--300x450.jpg


A database of 200 million Electronic Benefit Transfer records from January 2011 to July 2012, obtained by The Post through a Freedom of Information request, showed welfare recipients using their EBT cards to make dozens of cash withdrawals at ATMs inside Hank’s Saloon in Brooklyn; the Blue Door Video porn shop in the East Village; The Anchor, a sleek SoHo lounge; the Patriot Saloon in TriBeCa; and Drinks Galore, a liquor distributor in The Bronx.

The state Office of Temporary and Disability Assistance (OTDA), which oversees the “cash assistance program,” even lists some of these welfare-ready ATMs on its Web site.

Welfare recipients receive food stamps and cash assistance under the federal Temporary Assistance for Needy Families program. Both benefits are accessed through an EBT card, but only cash assistance — meant for housing, utilities and household necessities — can be accessed at ATMs.

A single-person household could receive a maximum $200 in monthly food stamps plus $158 in cash assistance. A family of four could get as much as $668 in food stamps and $433 in cash.

The food-stamp program prohibits the purchase of booze, tobacco and lottery tickets with an EBT card. But with the cash-assistance program, users can blow money on strippers or a six-pack and to tap welfare dollars from liquor stores, casinos and adult-oriented establishments.

The Middle Class Tax Relief and Job Creation Act, signed by President Obama last February, requires states to prohibit sinful welfare spending by 2014. If they don’t, they’ll forfeit federal cash.

A spokesman with the US Department of Health and Human Services said states make their own rules on EBT cards.

Some states already limit where EBT cards can withdraw money.....snip~

EXCLUSIVE: Welfare recipients using EBT cards to get cash at strip clubs, X-rated video stores and bars - NYPOST.com

Guess this goes with them Using Food Stamps and those that sell them for cash at twice the Amount in Food Stamps. Some of them stand Right outside Stores that are designed for the EBT and food stamps. Thoughts?

With electronic/digital records, people who use their cards at inappropriate places should lose their benefits for two months or so. But that isn't the real problem, as in where they're used. They're obviously being given to people who don't need them. We're so screwed up.
 
Re: Welfare Recipients Take out Cash at Strip Clubs, Liquor Stores and X-rated Shops.

If they are getting enough welfare money to spend it like this, then they are getting way too much.

They had a sting up by us not to long ago. Caught some of these Black Ministers going into stores and buying hundreds of dollars in meats alone. Driving brand new Cars, wearing Gold Watches and jewelry. Wives all decked out and whatnot. All on the Welfare Program. Plus they have a so called Church with like 10 followers. So they don't pay taxes. But sure do live high on the Hog and others misery.
 
Re: Welfare Recipients Take out Cash at Strip Clubs, Liquor Stores and X-rated Shops.

The way I read that is that dozens of recipients, out of 200,000+, used ATMs located at strip clubs to get their cash benefits. Looks bad, I admit, but it does not guarantee that the same cash was spent at those establishments. Some probably was and that is wrong, but I think we are making a mountain out of a molehill. Show me how much Corporate Welfare was spent in these same circumstances and I will be more sympathetic. You know, tax deductible entertainment expenses.
 
Re: Welfare Recipients Take out Cash at Strip Clubs, Liquor Stores and X-rated Shops.

If they are getting enough welfare money to spend it like this, then they are getting way too much.

I echo that!
 
Re: Welfare Recipients Take out Cash at Strip Clubs, Liquor Stores and X-rated Shops.

The way I read that is that dozens of recipients, out of 200,000+, used ATMs located at strip clubs to get their cash benefits. Looks bad, I admit, but it does not guarantee that the same cash was spent at those establishments. Some probably was and that is wrong, but I think we are making a mountain out of a molehill. Show me how much Corporate Welfare was spent in these same circumstances and I will be more sympathetic. You know, tax deductible entertainment expenses.

Another attempt to get off topic.

"Corporate welfare" hasn't been discussed here enough?
 
Re: Welfare Recipients Take out Cash at Strip Clubs, Liquor Stores and X-rated Shops.

If the government is going to spend money to help the poor it has two options. It can either regulate and micromanage the lives of recipients so that they only spend money what they "need," which is incredibly subjective and paternalistic or they could get a check. If a recipient chooses to spend the money of strippers or booze that's cool. They just shouldn't expect a dime when it comes to housing or food. Ultimately, this isn't a huge amount of money, and I think that people are making a bigger deal out of this than it is. Whatever rules you put up, people will get around them.
 
Re: Welfare Recipients Take out Cash at Strip Clubs, Liquor Stores and X-rated Shops.

Another attempt to get off topic.

"Corporate welfare" hasn't been discussed here enough?


I actually addressed the topic thoughtfully. Do you have lumps in your underwear?
 
Re: Welfare Recipients Take out Cash at Strip Clubs, Liquor Stores and X-rated Shops.

The way I read that is that dozens of recipients, out of 200,000+, used ATMs located at strip clubs to get their cash benefits. Looks bad, I admit, but it does not guarantee that the same cash was spent at those establishments. Some probably was and that is wrong, but I think we are making a mountain out of a molehill. Show me how much Corporate Welfare was spent in these same circumstances and I will be more sympathetic. You know, tax deductible entertainment expenses.

The state Office of Temporary and Disability Assistance (OTDA), which oversees the “cash assistance program,” even lists some of these welfare-ready ATMs on its Web site....snip~
I don't know anything about Corporate Welfare.....But they do list some of those NY Establishments with ATMS.....huh?
 
Re: Welfare Recipients Take out Cash at Strip Clubs, Liquor Stores and X-rated Shops.

While it appears that states can restrict EBT cash withdrawal locations, it doesn't do anything to stop someone from using a bank ATM, get 20 bucks, and pick up a dildo for later.

And I don't think they have a say in what a person does with that money anyway. If the state is dumb enough to give cash, then they don't get to attach strings.
 
Re: Welfare Recipients Take out Cash at Strip Clubs, Liquor Stores and X-rated Shops.

Could also be that's where those people work part time. There should already be restrictions in place as to what they can spend the funds on. However, giving cash when they already have a card is foolish.
 
Re: Welfare Recipients Take out Cash at Strip Clubs, Liquor Stores and X-rated Shops.

There are a lot of reforms which can be done to the welfare system; though I think it would be foolhardy to scrape it all together. One thing is that if you're not working and you're on welfare, I think we should get some Community Service out of you. It could be hard given various real life limitations; but there's no such thing as a free lunch and that needs to be impressed. Perhaps we've been dealing with this as such a free lunch program that the problems that have evolved were bound to evolve. At the same accord, I find it hard to argue for scraping the system all together.

And besides, we pay more to corporations and bailing out banks. And those bastards don't have any limitations.
 
Re: Welfare Recipients Take out Cash at Strip Clubs, Liquor Stores and X-rated Shops.

I'm not happy with the system and I'm offended by the abuse. However, dozens (12, 24, 36, 48. 60?) isn't even hundreds (or the article would say that to make their point) out of 200 million is an insignificant percentage. If anything, it seems to show that most of the withdrawals are legitimate.

Misuse of welfare funds should carry severe penalties because it harms others indirectly. But this article seems to imply the system is working rather well. I would like to see a hotline where fraud could be reported but I'm only dreaming.
 
Re: Welfare Recipients Take out Cash at Strip Clubs, Liquor Stores and X-rated Shops.

This is totally ridiculous. I've never understood why it is that Food Stamps exist in the first place. These people should get a pre-sorted selection of FOOD every month based on the number of adults and children in the family. I'll even be nice enough to allow for the selections to be oriented towards specific ethnic groups (Latino, Asian, etc...) within the limits that the food is healthy and nutritious, not the crap I see people buying with their EBT cards all the time.

When it comes to Welfare itself.... It becomes difficult to provide products rather than a monetary value. However, one can limit the types of products which can be bought with that money. In fact, most of the states I'm aware of do exactly that. Unfortunately, there are ways to get around it. One of them is cashing out a value into paper money which cannot be tracked. Another is "trading" purchases, which I hear is quite popular. You buy someone $50 worth of food/product on your EBT card and they give you the $50 in cash or product valued at that amount which you wouldn't be able to buy with the card.... alcohol, tobacco, jewelry, etc....
 
Re: Welfare Recipients Take out Cash at Strip Clubs, Liquor Stores and X-rated Shops.

There are a lot of reforms which can be done to the welfare system; though I think it would be foolhardy to scrape it all together. One thing is that if you're not working and you're on welfare, I think we should get some Community Service out of you. It could be hard given various real life limitations; but there's no such thing as a free lunch and that needs to be impressed. Perhaps we've been dealing with this as such a free lunch program that the problems that have evolved were bound to evolve. At the same accord, I find it hard to argue for scraping the system all together.

And besides, we pay more to corporations and bailing out banks. And those bastards don't have any limitations.

I always liked this idea because I thought that it could also help curb the immigration problem we have in America. There are people crossing the border from Mexico to come here and do jobs that Americans simply refuse to do - pick fruit/vegetables, for example. These types of jobs could be the ones assigned to people on assistance, thereby pushing jobs away from illegals/immigrants and giving them back to Americans.
 
Re: Welfare Recipients Take out Cash at Strip Clubs, Liquor Stores and X-rated Shops.

This is totally ridiculous. I've never understood why it is that Food Stamps exist in the first place. These people should get a pre-sorted selection of FOOD every month based on the number of adults and children in the family. I'll even be nice enough to allow for the selections to be oriented towards specific ethnic groups (Latino, Asian, etc...) within the limits that the food is healthy and nutritious, not the crap I see people buying with their EBT cards all the time.

When it comes to Welfare itself.... It becomes difficult to provide products rather than a monetary value. However, one can limit the types of products which can be bought with that money. In fact, most of the states I'm aware of do exactly that. Unfortunately, there are ways to get around it. One of them is cashing out a value into paper money which cannot be tracked. Another is "trading" purchases, which I hear is quite popular. You buy someone $50 worth of food/product on your EBT card and they give you the $50 in cash or product valued at that amount which you wouldn't be able to buy with the card.... alcohol, tobacco, jewelry, etc....

Although around us they usually Charged Double for the stamps or value for that cash or products.
 
Re: Welfare Recipients Take out Cash at Strip Clubs, Liquor Stores and X-rated Shops.

Although around us they usually Charged Double for the stamps or value for that cash or products.

I couldn't tell you what the conversion rate around here is, though I'm quite certain two of my future sisters-in-law know EXACTLY what it is.
 
Re: Welfare Recipients Take out Cash at Strip Clubs, Liquor Stores and X-rated Shops.

Wow you people really have no idea what you're talking about do you? To be on TANF you have to look for work 35 hours a week and if a job isn't obtained within a month you're assigned to a community service assignment 35+ hours a week to make well below minimum wage. There is a hotline to report welfare fraud and there is always the option of going to your loxal office and reporting it You cannot just sit on your ass and receive TANF like the old AFDC. BNot to mention that there is at least one interviee with your caseworker every week. The problem is that TANF is designed to push people into low wage jobs. You cannot go to college while on TANF and if you get a part time job working 30 hours a week you are dtstill required to job search the other 5 hours. TANF disreguards your income in incriments once a job is found. %100 for the first 3 months, 80% for the next 3 months and so on until its down to %40. So if someone starts making $3000 a month while on TANF they will still receive the cash for another year.
 
Re: Welfare Recipients Take out Cash at Strip Clubs, Liquor Stores and X-rated Shops.

Wow you people really have no idea what you're talking about do you? To be on TANF you have to look for work 3 hours a week and if a job isn't obtained within a month you're assigned to a community service assignment 35+ hours a week to make well below minimum wage. There is a hotline to report welfare fraud and there is always the option of going to your loxal office and reporting it You cannot just sit on your ass and receive TANF like the old AFDC. BNot to mention that there is at least one interviee with your caseworker every week. The problem is that TANF is designed to push people into low wage jobs. You cannot go to college while on TANF and if you get a part time job working 30 hours a week you are dtstill required to job search the other 5 hours. TANF disreguards your income in incriments once a job is found. %100 for the first 3 months, 80% for the next 3 months and so on until its down to %40. So if someone starts making $3000 a month while on TANF they will still receive the cash for another year.

Depends on State which is what the OP stated. The States can make their own Laws.
rolleyes.png
 
Re: Welfare Recipients Take out Cash at Strip Clubs, Liquor Stores and X-rated Shops.

If the government is going to spend money to help the poor it has two options. It can either regulate and micromanage the lives of recipients so that they only spend money what they "need," which is incredibly subjective and paternalistic or they could get a check. If a recipient chooses to spend the money of strippers or booze that's cool. They just shouldn't expect a dime when it comes to housing or food. Ultimately, this isn't a huge amount of money, and I think that people are making a bigger deal out of this than it is. Whatever rules you put up, people will get around them.

When these people are using tax money, the taxpayers have every right to determine what they're allowed to use it on. If the welfare recipients don't like it, they can get jobs.
 
Re: Welfare Recipients Take out Cash at Strip Clubs, Liquor Stores and X-rated Shops.

While it appears that states can restrict EBT cash withdrawal locations, it doesn't do anything to stop someone from using a bank ATM, get 20 bucks, and pick up a dildo for later.

Which is why I don't think you ought to be able to get cash off the cards at all. You'd be hard pressed to find a retail establishment out there that doesn't take credit cards.

And I don't think they have a say in what a person does with that money anyway. If the state is dumb enough to give cash, then they don't get to attach strings.

Cool, let's stop giving it to them then.
 
Re: Welfare Recipients Take out Cash at Strip Clubs, Liquor Stores and X-rated Shops.

I always liked this idea because I thought that it could also help curb the immigration problem we have in America. There are people crossing the border from Mexico to come here and do jobs that Americans simply refuse to do - pick fruit/vegetables, for example. These types of jobs could be the ones assigned to people on assistance, thereby pushing jobs away from illegals/immigrants and giving them back to Americans.

Exactly, and welfare shouldn't be a do nothing program; it will only encourage people to stay on it. Help out, yes, we've seen what happens without these programs and we can reasonably use the aggregate power of government to provide a structure that aids the individual during tough times. I'm not against something like that in theory. But there's no such thing as a free lunch and the welfare program should be a fairly large pain in the ass. The point is that you shouldn't want to be on it, and look for ways to get off it ASAP.

Now it's not just as simple as an easily abused system. And as specklebang pointed out above, it's a fairly negligible percentage. There are many factors which encourage staying on welfare including the corporate welfare systems we have which destroy economic mobility. To right the problem would take major upheavals on several levels of current practice and "regulation" (the likes the Republocrats will NEVER implement, their buddy's are the corporations and banks). But you have to start somewhere and you have to move towards fixing a problem instead of exacerbating it.
 
Re: Welfare Recipients Take out Cash at Strip Clubs, Liquor Stores and X-rated Shops.

When these people are using tax money, the taxpayers have every right to determine what they're allowed to use it on. If the welfare recipients don't like it, they can get jobs.

I agree in principle, but it is very difficult to actually enforce. If they are going to waste money, that's one thing, but if they don't have public housing or food stamps for their groceries to turn to, most who need to change their behavior probably will or suffer as a consequence.
 
Re: Welfare Recipients Take out Cash at Strip Clubs, Liquor Stores and X-rated Shops.

I agree in principle, but it is very difficult to actually enforce. If they are going to waste money, that's one thing, but if they don't have public housing or food stamps for their groceries to turn to, most who need to change their behavior probably will or suffer as a consequence.

Or they just turn to crime or fraud, which a lot of them are already engaged in already. It's not that difficult to enforce, you just require them to use their EBT cards for everything, they cannot ever get a penny in cash off the cards, and spending habits are tracked. Computers are good at that kind of thing, hardly any human intervention is required. If you start seeing variances, you address them. Stores which are "charging" the cards and just giving cash back ought to be pretty easy to detect and the owners should be charged with credit card fraud.

It's not hard to do if you've got the balls to do it.
 
Back
Top Bottom