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Howard Dean: "The Truth Is Everybody Needs To Pay More Taxes, Not Just The Rich"

MMC said:
What was difficult to understand. One could have looked at the House and specifically at the Democrats when Obama submitted his budget proposals. Twice Obama submitted and he could not get one Democrat to vote for it. Which doesn't include the Senate. Do you think they had a different agenda than what Obama was looking for? Why would his own party not back such proposals? Or at least why Not the Demos even in the State of Illinois.
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The Democrats would not vote for the budget because of the amendments made by the GOP, but nice job of changing the subject to something other than what my comment was about.
 
Gonzo Rodeo said:
Because if Republicans don't, they catch flack for being "unpatriotic." And if Democrats don't, it starts another debate and they don't want to distract from the current class warfare rhetoric. So, feed the monkey while it's still on your back, right before you shoot it in the face.
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I don't buy it.....not unanimous agreement by both sides.
 
KevinKohler said:
So, to you, killing people who are not as bright, or as healthy, is the same as taking more money away from wealthier people than what we take from less wealthy people?
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if the good of society is all that matters.......

taking money from the wealthy does exactly what in terms of real good?
 
Guy Incognito said:
I'm not just saying cut spending, I am saying completely eliminate social security, medicare/medicaid, and slash defense to skeleton crew status. That's the only way out. Anything else is pissing in the wind, including any tax suggestion up to and including 100% confiscation.

If 100% confiscation could get us out of this mess, I would advocate just that. But the only sensible solution is elimination of the Big Three government expenses. Have you seen the numbers?? It is staggering. The welfare payouts and defense spending dwarf anything else out there. Increasing revenue is great (I'm being ideologically neutral here, just talking in terms of solutions), but it won't work.

We are junkies. A junkie can try to increase he revenue, maybe he sends out job applications or searches for scrap metal or panhandles or something. That is analogous to taxes. What the junkie needs is to get off the junk. The junk is analogous to medicare, medicaid, and defense overspending. Until the junkie is clean, there is no way that revenue increases can even make a dent.
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100% confiscation-you advocate it?
 
TurtleDude said:
if the good of society is all that matters.......

taking money from the wealthy does exactly what in terms of real good?
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First, the good of the society is not ALL that matters...it's a balance beam, in which we delicately capitulate from one side to the other...the good of the many, over the good of the few...

Second, taking money from the more wealthy affects the ability to afford our government, and all it's services, without reducing the spending power of the greatest segment of the consumer culture...the middle class.
 
KevinKohler said:
First, the good of the society is not ALL that matters...it's a balance beam, in which we delicately capitulate from one side to the other...the good of the many, over the good of the few...

Second, taking money from the more wealthy affects the ability to afford our government, and all it's services, without reducing the spending power of the greatest segment of the consumer culture...the middle class.
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so you think the government's current level of spending is proper and the government actually needs more money?
 
TurtleDude said:
so you think the government's current level of spending is proper and the government actually needs more money?
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Spending is a huge issue. Come one, Turtle, you know me by now. Smaller government. But cutting spending alone is not gonna get us out of the mess we are in, and I think you know this. You simply don't want to concede, unless the other side does as well, correct?
 
KevinKohler said:
Spending is a huge issue. Come one, Turtle, you know me by now. Smaller government. But cutting spending alone is not gonna get us out of the mess we are in, and I think you know this. You simply don't want to concede, unless the other side does as well, correct?
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why should anyone agree to a tax hike or support one until the government actually agrees to massive cutting. and why should the rich-who already pay too much and ARE NOT DRIVING THE BIG SPENDING be the only one's who pay more
 
TurtleDude said:
why should anyone agree to a tax hike or support one until the government actually agrees to massive cutting. and why should the rich-who already pay too much and ARE NOT DRIVING THE BIG SPENDING be the only one's who pay more
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I don't think anyone is advocating tax hikes without spending cuts. Er, at least, not here at DFs.
 
KevinKohler said:
I don't think anyone is advocating tax hikes without spending cuts. Er, at least, not here at DFs.
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LOL the Obama administration plans on spending more

and tell me why the rich are the only ones who should sacrifice to pay down (LOL) a deficit that was driven by the middle class
 
TurtleDude said:
LOL the Obama administration plans on spending more

and tell me why the rich are the only ones who should sacrifice to pay down (LOL) a deficit that was driven by the middle class
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The deficit wasn't driven by the middle class. It was driven by congress, by a government that consistently spent more than it had. What are the number one costs to this country, and who are the number one beneficiaries of those costs?
 
KevinKohler said:
The deficit wasn't driven by the middle class. It was driven by congress, by a government that consistently spent more than it had. What are the number one costs to this country, and who are the number one beneficiaries of those costs?
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who votes congress into office and who does congress pander to
 
TurtleDude said:
if the good of society is all that matters.......

taking money from the wealthy does exactly what in terms of real good?
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It allows us to repay our debt to SS that enabled your temporary tax cuts to be continued during two decade long wars.
 
Catawba said:
It allows us to repay our debt to SS that enabled your temporary tax cuts to be continued during two decade long wars.
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more stupidity. the middle class tax cuts "cost more" than that for the rich and the rich are still paying more than what they should
 
KevinKohler said:
The middle class is not what got Obama re-elected.
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depends how you define the middle class. People making less than 50K a year voted for Obama more than Romney. People making more than 50K voted more for Romney. lots of people under 50K are "middle class\\and I was talking about the big spending congress over the years
 
lpast said:
I agree with this statement, that everyone that can needs to pay a bit more taxs and not just the rich.
This is a primer to prepare for an ultimate compromise that does include tax increases on the middleclass..it might come in the form of no more tax deductions on mortgages..which im against.


he only problem is -- and this is initially going to seem like heresy from a progressive is -- the truth is everybody needs to pay more taxes, not just the rich. And it's a good start. But we're not going to get out of this deficit problem unless we raise taxes across the board, to go back to what Bill Clinton had and his taxes. And if we don't do that, the problem is the pressure is going to be on spending even more.


Howard Dean: "The Truth Is Everybody Needs To Pay More Taxes, Not Just The Rich" | RealClearPolitics
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As hard as it is for me to agree with Howard Dean, he is right. If the middle class wants cradle-to-grave government care, then it is the middle class that has to step up to the plate and pay for it. The $16,000,000,000,000 debt we have represents $16,000,000,000,000 is benefits, services and transfer payments that the government has made that have not yet been paid for. The American people need to decide what it is they want, and what they are willing to pay for.
 
TurtleDude said:
depends how you define the middle class. People making less than 50K a year voted for Obama more than Romney. People making more than 50K voted more for Romney. lots of people under 50K are "middle class\\and I was talking about the big spending congress over the years
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Middle class folks are defined by their ability to purchase a house, own a car, etc.

A SINGLE person making 50K a year COULD be middle class...but frankly...only in places with lower economies, like SC, and such. For the rest of the US, in order to be "middle class" these days, it means earning at least 100K per household or MORE.
 
KevinKohler said:
Middle class folks are defined by their ability to purchase a house, own a car, etc.

A SINGLE person making 50K a year COULD be middle class...but frankly...only in places with lower economies, like SC, and such. For the rest of the US, in order to be "middle class" these days, it means earning at least 100K per household or MORE.
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sadly middle class has no real definition. The obamatards consider anyone making over 200K a year rich but once can argue that the bottom 20% is Poor, the upper 20% is rich and the middle three quintiles is the middle class

its an elusive definition. and a couple making 50K in some places can live really well while making 50K a year in San Francisco or NYC is not doing very well
 
TurtleDude said:
sadly middle class has no real definition. The obamatards consider anyone making over 200K a year rich but once can argue that the bottom 20% is Poor, the upper 20% is rich and the middle three quintiles is the middle class

its an elusive definition. and a couple making 50K in some places can live really well while making 50K a year in San Francisco or NYC is not doing very well
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50K a year for a family of 3 or 4 is not really doing that well...anywhere. NOT middle class. LOWER middle, at BEST. That's 25K per spouse, or around 11 dollars an hour, 40 hours per week, on a yearly basis. It's grocery store wages. In order to be middle class, you gotta be able to buy a house. No one is buying a house on those wages...not anywhere.
 
KevinKohler said:
50K a year for a family of 3 or 4 is not really doing that well...anywhere. NOT middle class. LOWER middle, at BEST. That's 25K per spouse, or around 11 dollars an hour, 40 hours per week, on a yearly basis. It's grocery store wages. In order to be middle class, you gotta be able to buy a house. No one is buying a house on those wages...not anywhere.
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since when is buying a house the determinative
 
Fletch said:
As hard as it is for me to agree with Howard Dean, he is right. If the middle class wants cradle-to-grave government care, then it is the middle class that has to step up to the plate and pay for it. The $16,000,000,000,000 debt we have represents $16,000,000,000,000 is benefits, services and transfer payments that the government has made that have not yet been paid for. The American people need to decide what it is they want, and what they are willing to pay for.
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The original working class built this country..the middleclass today work all their lives and make the soft ass's rich...the military protects the soft ass's interests...the police and fire are there 24/7 teachers teach their kids...I hope you all keep the same attitude the made you lose this election...you will lose again and lose by more.\
If you took all the rich and successful and mid to upper middleclass that voted for obama and put them on romneys scorecard...he would have won by a landslide...only a fool could think romney lost only because of people wanting a handout
 
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