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Über Rich Renouncing U.S Citizenship as IRS Cracks Down on Tax Evaders [W:209]

Cardinal Fang said:
Yeah, bring back Lochner.
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completely irrelevant and you might even have known that when you posted it.


I realize to be an elitist lefty one has to assume he knows what is better for "the common man" than those people themselves. They need your beneficent leadership if they are ever to escape their benighted existence as wage slaves preyed upon by the evil capitalist Like all children, they need a wise and able parent to teach them and guide them.
 
TurtleDude said:
completely irrelevant and you might even have known that when you posted it.


I realize to be an elitist lefty one has to assume he knows what is better for "the common man" than those people themselves. They need your beneficent leadership if they are ever to escape their benighted existence as wage slaves preyed upon by the evil capitalist Like all children, they need a wise and able parent to teach them and guide them.
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"Good intentions will always be pleaded for every assumption of authority. It is hardly too strong to say that the Constitution was made to guard the people against the dangers of good intentions. There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to govern. They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters." - Daniel Webster
 
Centinel said:
"Good intentions will always be pleaded for every assumption of authority. It is hardly too strong to say that the Constitution was made to guard the people against the dangers of good intentions. There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to govern. They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters." - Daniel Webster
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excellent point and there are some naive and uneducated lefties who actually believe that the stuff they support is designed to help more than themselves. However, when it comes to the rich lefties, politicians, trustafarians, ivory tower elitists or machiavellian power hungry control freaks, I don't believe for a second they actually believe the crap they spew. Its all about more wealth and power
 
TurtleDude said:
I don't believe your nonsense.
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Just the facts, ma'am. And look at the garbage you DO believe.

TurtleDude said:
the only rich who bray for higher taxes tend to be those who believe that such a system actually insulates their position or those who never earned a dime of it in the first place.
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No, not at all. Some of the rich got that way in part by being fairly smart. They are able to discern what others seemingly cannot, namely that without broad-based wealth and demand in the economy, the road gets very rough. The feudalism that you seek is actually a much harder road to travel, even if you do send a smaller check to the IRS. People who understand wealth can see that, but you aren't in that club, so you don't.
 
TurtleDude said:
completely irrelevant and you might even have known that when you posted it.


I realize to be an elitist lefty one has to assume he knows what is better for "the common man" than those people themselves. They need your beneficent leadership if they are ever to escape their benighted existence as wage slaves preyed upon by the evil capitalist Like all children, they need a wise and able parent to teach them and guide them.
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Every human being dies. Just something I thought I would interject here. You are going to die. I'm going to die. Every person is going to die. And much of what makes us who we are as individuals was never chosen by us. We are heavily socialized primates living out a mortal existence trying to be something other than heavily socialized primates but failing on every turn because we are driven by the very impulses that have allowed our species to survive this long. This argument you are having is your own attempt to rationalize a pattern of behavior that was socialized into you and you are going to live out your entire life in this manner. As you grow older, like all humans, your focus will become increasingly narrow and your ability to adapt will significantly diminish as you lose the capacity to see beyond your cognitive biases.

In short, you are just an animal with a brain evolved enough to create abstract justifications to convince yourself why you can treat other human beings in the manner that you do. In the end, you are going to be worm food.
 
TurtleDude said:
completely irrelevant and you might even have known that when you posted it.
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Not much of a lawyer. The Lochner Era was based principally upon defense of a supposed right of contract. You're back to coal trade on the Ohio River in the 18th century.

TurtleDude said:
I realize to be an elitist lefty one has to assume he knows what is better for "the common man" than those people themselves. They need your beneficent leadership if they are ever to escape their benighted existence as wage slaves preyed upon by the evil capitalist Like all children, they need a wise and able parent to teach them and guide them.
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Babble posted in the absence of anything actually meaningful to say.
 
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Centinel said:
"Good intentions will always be pleaded for every assumption of authority. It is hardly too strong to say that the Constitution was made to guard the people against the dangers of good intentions. There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to govern. They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters." - Daniel Webster
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LOL! Daniel Webster was five years old when the Constitution was written. Try introducing him when the topic is the role of out-and-out elitists in the years leading up to the Civil War.
 
Cardinal Fang said:
Just the facts, ma'am. And look at the garbage you DO believe.


No, not at all. Some of the rich got that way in part by being fairly smart. They are able to discern what others seemingly cannot, namely that without broad-based wealth and demand in the economy, the road gets very rough. The feudalism that you seek is actually a much harder road to travel, even if you do send a smaller check to the IRS. People who understand wealth can see that, but you aren't in that club, so you don't.
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You keep talking out your rear as to me. As I have noted, every six months or so some new poster comes along and makes such idiotic claims only to get schooled by one of the moderators.

Captain Courtesy noted that no one is purely altruistic and I believe him. You pretend that your desire for higher taxes on the wealthy is out of some sort of concern for society as a whole. I call that crap and its obvious that your sanctimonious posts are pretext for greed. . The government wasting more money isn't going to help the middle class and in many ways hurts it by suggesting to the middle class that its the rich, and the rich alone, who have a duty to pay down the deficit and fund all the garbage that the indolent middle class continues to feel entitled to.

Your posts contain the same logic as the pusher who claims what he does is good for his clients while damning us who want the slothful addicts to face cold turkey
 
Cardinal Fang said:
Not much of a lawyer. The Lochner Era was based principally upon defense of a supposed right of contract. You're back to coal trade on the Ohio River in the 18th century.


Babble posted in the absence of anything actually meaningful to say.
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your mindless yapping is silly. You were suggesting that corporations can force people to sign contracts working 90 hours a week. And of course you reject out of hand anything that rejects your smarmy elitist smugness of the trustafarian
 
TNAR said:
How much money do you make? I think that if you make more than $20,000 you are simply being greedy and should be forced to give the rest of your money to those who are greedy like yourself.

There are certainly "spoiled kid" here but I think you are pointing your finger in the wrong direction.
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I'm not sure I follow your logic TNAR... ? ?

If I make someone makes more than $20,000 they should give the rest of their money to other people who make more than $20,000 ... is that what you are saying? ?

Which direction am I pointing my finger?
 
TurtleDude said:
what exactly is the increase in taxes on someone who has earned income of one million a year from your SS scheme alone?
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ALL Americans who earn money would pay the same 12% in FICA tax. Currently between 91 and 93% of Americans pay FICA tax on 100% of their earnings. The rest get a far lower and discriminatory rate based on the 109K cap bringing down their percentage tremendously as the income level rises.

My proposal grants your wish Turtle. You are one of the people who constantly trumpet a flat tax where all pay the same percentage. That is what we are giving you regarding FICA.
 
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haymarket said:
ALL Americans who earn money would pay the same 12% in FICA tax. Currently between 91 and 93% of Americans pay FICA tax on 100% of their earnings. The rest get a far lower and discriminatory rate based on the 109K cap bringing down their percentage tremendously as the income level rises.

My proposal grants your wish Turtle. You are one of the people who constantly trumpet a flat tax where all pay the same percentage. That is what we are giving you regarding FICA.
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He and the rich dont want a flat tax for social security....they dont need it so they dont want to pay into it..
 
haymarket said:
ALL Americans who earn money would pay the same 12% in FICA tax. Currently between 91 and 93% of Americans pay FICA tax on 100% of their earnings. The rest get a far lower and discriminatory rate based on the 109K cap bringing down their percentage tremendously as the income level rises.

My proposal grants your wish Turtle. You are one of the people who constantly trumpet a flat tax where all pay the same percentage. That is what we are giving you regarding FICA.
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the more you pay the more you should get back. You want another tax to be yet another scheme to redistribute money from an overtaxed minority to the voters who put your masters in office. FICA was never supposed to be a tax per se so stop the silly rants.
 
lpast said:
He and the rich dont want a flat tax for social security....they dont need it so they dont want to pay into it..
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true, it should not be mandatory.
 
TurtleDude said:
the more you pay the more you should get back. You want another tax to be yet another scheme to redistribute money from an overtaxed minority to the voters who put your masters in office. FICA was never supposed to be a tax per se so stop the silly rants.
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Its a MANDATORY deduction...so what should it have been called.
 
TurtleDude said:
true, it should not be mandatory.
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but it is and always has been....the babyboomers never whined about being FORCED into social security their entire working lives and they never complained...about pay for the greatest generation who mostly didnt pay anything into it and collected it for decades...
This is the new "RICH" the send it to china and we dont want to pay for anything for anyone..im entitled rich just cuz im rich...other lesser humans exist only to make me richer and are disposable...pffffffffffffffft
 
lpast said:
Its a MANDATORY deduction...so what should it have been called.
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review the legislative history behind it. The supporters were very careful to not call it a tax nor was it intended to be used for general revenue purposes. It was capped because the benefits were capped-much like the forced insurance retirement program it was billed at. Haymarket thinks that every bit of money taken by the government ought to be progressive. HE isn't content to have a highly progressive income tax. There is no reason why people who already pay most of the FIT should have to pay most of the FICA as well
 
lpast said:
but it is and always has been....the babyboomers never whined about being FORCED into social security their entire working lives and they never complained...about pay for the greatest generation who mostly didnt pay anything into it and collected it for decades...
This is the new "RICH" the send it to china and we dont want to pay for anything for anyone..im entitled rich just cuz im rich...other lesser humans exist only to make me richer and are disposable...pffffffffffffffft
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could you set aside your silly class envy for once and actually deal with reality? The rich already pay 40% of the income tax, all of the estate tax and now the parasites think they should pay most of the FICA tax as well-ask Haymarket, he thinks this FICA should apply to investment as well as earned income as well which would result in huge tax hikes on the people who already pay 40% of the income tax
 
TurtleDude said:
You keep talking out your rear as to me. As I have noted, every six months or so some new poster comes along and makes such idiotic claims only to get schooled by one of the moderators.
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LOL! I point out the obvious holes in your arguments and the glaring flaws in your phony claims. The fact that you can't defend yourself without calling for some sort of divine intervention on the part of moderators is certainly telling with regard to the degree of desperation you experience here.

TurtleDude said:
Captain Courtesy noted that no one is purely altruistic and I believe him.
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The fact that you believe him isn't really much of an endorsement.

TurtleDude said:
You pretend that your desire for higher taxes on the wealthy is out of some sort of concern for society as a whole. I call that crap and its obvious that your sanctimonious posts are pretext for greed. . The government wasting more money isn't going to help the middle class and in many ways hurts it by suggesting to the middle class that its the rich, and the rich alone, who have a duty to pay down the deficit and fund all the garbage that the indolent middle class continues to feel entitled to.
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The rich have an obligation to stop trying to rape everybody else as they have been trying to do since Reagan, turning up the volume quite considerably under Dirtbag Bush with just wonderful results. You know, we have laws at least here and there requiring criminals to turn over their profits from say writing a book about their crimes to the victims of those crimes. In the same sense, it hardly seems excessive to demand that those who have been stealing from society stop doing that and start paying their own way once again.

TurtleDude said:
Your posts contain the same logic as the pusher who claims what he does is good for his clients while damning us who want the slothful addicts to face cold turkey.
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No, they contain the sort of logic that you simply can't deal with. Don't take it personally, though. It isn't just you -- it's every other gullible and thoroughly deceived soul on the right-wing as well.
 
Cardinal Fang said:
LOL! I point out the obvious holes in your arguments and the glaring flaws in your phony claims. The fact that you can't defend yourself without calling for some sort of divine intervention on the part of moderators is certainly telling with regard to the degree of desperation you experience here.


The fact that you believe him isn't really much of an endorsement.


The rich have an obligation to stop trying to rape everybody else as they have been trying to do since Reagan, turning up the volume quite considerably under Dirtbag Bush with just wonderful results. You know, we have laws at least here and there requiring criminals to turn over their profits from say writing a book about their crimes to the victims of those crimes. In the same sense, it hardly seems excessive to demand that those who have been stealing from society stop doing that and start paying their own way once again.


No, they contain the sort of logic that you simply can't deal with. Don't take it personally, though. It isn't just you -- it's every other gullible and thoroughly deceived soul on the right-wing as well.
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Your idiotic generalizations that the rich are rapiing people pretty much sum up the essence of your attitude. And I tire of your sanctimonious attitude. Yes I saw your claim that you are some big washington left wing think tank economist "nearing the end of your career" who has "been paid to give economic advice" etc. Its all crap and your arrogance towards other posters contained in your posts is clearly signs of something other than actually knowing what you are talking about.

You can rant all you want that the rich are "Stealing" from society. I think most of us see what the real issue is
 
TurtleDude said:
the more you pay the more you should get back. You want another tax to be yet another scheme to redistribute money from an overtaxed minority to the voters who put your masters in office. FICA was never supposed to be a tax per se so stop the silly rants.
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You are confusing a private IRA for your own individual retirement with Social Security which is a national program which has both an individual component and a societal component.

Silly rants!?!?!?!?!? FICA is indeed a tax. That is simple reality. To deny that reality would indeed be the definition of the word SILLY.

You have been educated on this before. Perhaps you have forgotten?

http://www.ssa.gov/oact/progdata/taxRates.html

Social Security's Old-Age, Survivors, and Disability Insurance (OASDI) program and Medicare's Hospital Insurance (HI) program are financed primarily by employment taxes. Tax rates are set by law (see sections 1401, 3101, and 3111 of the Internal Revenue Code) and apply to earnings up to a maximum amount for OASDI.

The rates shown reflect the amounts received by the trust funds. In certain years, the effective rate paid by employees, employers, and/or self-employed workers was less than the rate received by the trust funds, with the difference covered by general revenue. See the footnotes for details.
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FICA

Federal Insurance Contributions Act (FICA) tax ( /ˈfaɪkə/) is a United States payroll (or employment) tax[1] imposed by the federal government on both employees and employers to fund Social Security and Medicare[2] —federal programs that provide benefits for retirees, the disabled, and children of deceased workers. Social Security benefits include old-age, survivors, and disability insurance (OASDI); Medicare provides hospital insurance benefits for the elderly. The amount that one pays in payroll taxes throughout one's working career is associated indirectly with the social security benefits annuity that one receives as a retiree.
 
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TurtleDude said:
your mindless yapping is silly. You were suggesting that corporations can force people to sign contracts working 90 hours a week. And of course you reject out of hand anything that rejects your smarmy elitist smugness of the trustafarian
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Pointless. In faithful right-wing knee-jerk fashion, you offered up the right-of-contract as some sort of sacred icon or talisman needing only to be waved to have its effect. As any legal novice would have, you then failed to notice any connection at all between that claim and the disgraced Lochner Era that was in quite significant part based upon it. Everything you've posted since then has been the simple gibberish of a failed cover-up.
 
hazlnut said:
In fairness, I know retired people who live in Wyoming or Nevada for 6mos and a day just to avoid state taxes.
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Great strategy except for that part about living in Wyoming or Nevada for six months and a day each year. There may be better options that these power-brains haven't thought of yet.
 
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