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Britain's Lord Nazir Ahmed Offers £10 Million Bounty for Obama, Bush

The last thing I need is somebody named Red Dave from Ankara, Turkey telling me about the U.S. Constitution. You don't understand the U.S. Constitution, much in the same way you only have a comic book/leftist understanding of the United States.
 
Wiggen said:
The last thing I need is somebody named Red Dave from Ankara, Turkey telling me about the U.S. Constitution. You don't understand the U.S. Constitution, much in the same way you only have a comic book/leftist understanding of the United States.
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Clearly i do, as i understand that article 6, paragraph two states that any treaty the U.S signs becomes part of U.S law. Or am i mistaken?
 
alexa said:
You make a good point there because there are many people who believe the Iraq war in particular was illegal, including the British governments lawyers and the UN. You can listen to what actually happened on my link. He does appear to be talking of raising money to bring Bush and Blair to the ICC. Interestingly when I landed on a Pakistani site they were not even discussing this, they were discussing the emphasis of his talk which was evolution not revolution. They thought he sounded a bit too English and preferred revolution.

You also need to understand how badly the war against Afghanistan has harmed Pakistan, the number they have dead and the infiltration of extremists into Pakistan and the social consequences of that. I imagine that that will make no difference to some here but imagine if you were living there. Might you not think justice should be the same for all? I'd be extremely surprised if this speech came from an intent to inflame. I suspect it was quite the opposite, though I can understand it might not be seen as that from people here.

Anyway, nothing to do with Obama, it is just Bush and Blair.

Suspended peer says Obama 'bounty' a 'pack of lies' - Channel 4 News
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Pakistan is a hellhole of a country that is the most dangerous place on the planet. Had they taken care of Osama bin Laden and the Taliban ten years ago instead of getting into bed with them, there would have been no need for the U.S. to go after them.

They get no sympathy from me - they gave the man who masterminded the murder of 3000 people a sanctuary for ten years. Screw them.
 
Red_Dave said:
Clearly i do, as i understand that article 6, paragraph two states that any treaty the U.S signs becomes part of U.S law. Or am i mistaken?
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Here's a tip for you. The U.S. Constitution means whatever the U.S. Supreme Court says it means. Until you Euro-Lefties take over the Supreme Court, your beliefs on this matter are meaningless.
 
alexa said:
You make a good point there because there are many people who believe the Iraq war in particular was illegal, including the British governments lawyers and the UN. You can listen to what actually happened on my link. He does appear to be talking of raising money to bring Bush and Blair to the ICC. Interestingly when I landed on a Pakistani site they were not even discussing this, they were discussing the emphasis of his talk which was evolution not revolution. They thought he sounded a bit too English and preferred revolution.

You also need to understand how badly the war against Afghanistan has harmed Pakistan, the number they have dead and the infiltration of extremists into Pakistan and the social consequences of that. I imagine that that will make no difference to some here but imagine if you were living there. Might you not think justice should be the same for all? I'd be extremely surprised if this speech came from an intent to inflame. I suspect it was quite the opposite, though I can understand it might not be seen as that from people here.

Anyway, nothing to do with Obama, it is just Bush and Blair.

Suspended peer says Obama 'bounty' a 'pack of lies' - Channel 4 News
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I thought you told me this was made up by the Jews in Washington, D.C. Now it turns out it's a Pakistani paper after all. Make up your mind.
 
Wiggen said:
Here's a tip for you. The U.S. Constitution means whatever the U.S. Supreme Court says it means. Until you Euro-Lefties take over the Supreme Court, your beliefs on this matter are meaningless.
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So explain which part of the consitution i misunderstand

Is the UN charter not a treaty?

Did the U.S not sign it?

Are treaties signed by the U.S not legally binding?
 
Wiggen said:
I thought you told me this was made up by the Jews in Washington, D.C. Now it turns out it's a Pakistani paper after all. Make up your mind.
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No, I never said that. I quoted the source of the OP which wrongly said he had put a bounty on Obama.
 
I'll repeat it again, in case you really don't understand. The U.S. Constitution means whatever the Supreme Court says it means. Until you Euro-Lefties attain a majority on that court, and I wouldn't hold my breath if I was you, your opinion means nothing. You can read the Constitution until your blue in the face. Knock yourself out. Please.
 
alexa said:
No, I never said that. I quoted the source of the OP which wrongly said he had put a bounty on Obama.
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Yes, actually you did.

Let me refresh your memory from post #51:


The Middle East Media Research Institute (MEMRI) is a Middle Eastern not for profit[1] press monitoring organization with headquarters located in Washington, DC. MEMRI was co-founded in 1998 by Yigal Carmon, a former colonel in the Israeli military intelligence and Meyrav Wurmser, an Israeli-born, American political scientist.

Nice try, though.
 
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Wiggen said:
I'll repeat it again, in case you really don't understand. The U.S. Constitution means whatever the Supreme Court says it means. Until you Euro-Lefties attain a majority on that court, and I wouldn't hold my breath if I was you, your opinion means nothing. You can read the Constitution until your blue in the face. Knock yourself out. Please.
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no it doesnt, IT MEANS WHAT IT ****ING SAYS
 
Wiggen said:
The last thing I need is somebody named Red Dave from Ankara, Turkey telling me about the U.S. Constitution. You don't understand the U.S. Constitution, much in the same way you only have a comic book/leftist understanding of the United States.
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Well certainly Jo Blog who was just wanting to get on with his life had nothing to do with it. Imra Khan said many years ago, this war had made Pakistan into a failed state. Some people are trying to avoid that. I think in his own way one of them is Ahmed.

BBC News - Did Pakistan know about Osama Bin Laden hiding there?
 
Wiggen said:
Yes, actually you did.

Let me refresh your memory from post #51:


The Middle East Media Research Institute (MEMRI) is a Middle Eastern not for profit[1] press monitoring organization with headquarters located in Washington, DC. MEMRI was co-founded in 1998 by Yigal Carmon, a former colonel in the Israeli military intelligence and Meyrav Wurmser, an Israeli-born, American political scientist.

Nice try, though.
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which is the wiki details of who the OP are. That is exactly what I provided the details of the souce of the OP. It was them. Go to the op and check it out. For me it is late, so time to sleep.
 
Red_Dave said:
no it doesnt, IT MEANS WHAT IT ****ING SAYS
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No, it means what the Supreme Court says it means. It was written in the 18th century and what was applicable then is always reviewed in light of existing circumstances.

Maybe you should sign up for that class in the U.S. legal system, assuming they bother with such things in Turkey.
 
alexa said:
which is the wiki details of who the OP are. That is exactly what I provided the details of the souce of the OP. It was them. Go to the op and check it out. For me it is late, so time to sleep.
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The context of your post clearly indicated that you believed this was a fabricated story by the Jews. As is frequently the case with you.
 
alexa said:
Well certainly Jo Blog who was just wanting to get on with his life had nothing to do with it. Imra Khan said many years ago, this war had made Pakistan into a failed state. Some people are trying to avoid that. I think in his own way one of them is Ahmed.

BBC News - Did Pakistan know about Osama Bin Laden hiding there?
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Pakistan was a basket case long before any war. They've always been a seething hotbed of radicalism and anti-western sentiment. They've been a failed state since day one.
 
Wiggen said:
No, it means what the Supreme Court says it means. It was written in the 18th century and what was applicable then is always reviewed in light of existing circumstances.

Maybe you should sign up for that class in the U.S. legal system, assuming they bother with such things in Turkey.
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I should probably point out that i no longer live in Turkey and have neither the will nor the capacity to work out how to change my location. That said the situation is revealing itself to be an interesting idiot filter.
 
samsmart said:
Actually, the military is sworn to protect the Constitution. If a President does perpetuate human rights abuses, the military has the right to not follow those orders since they go against the Constitution.
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And where do we as military members get to draw the line? Do I get to disable a fleet of A-10s prior to an attack on Kurdish rebels in Turkey because my personal belief is flying CAS for Turkish F4s while they drop 500 pounders on the 'enemy' because they live on the wrong side of the border is a 'war crime'? Does an NCO get to refuse the orders of the CiC because he believes he is a fraud and all of his orders are unlawful? Does the military en-masse get to just simply refuse to deploy because they disagree with what they interpret as an unlawful order? Hey...how about if we just decide that the orders issued by the CiC are unlawful and unconstitutional and decide it is not just our right but DUTY to overthrow the CiC and all other government officials?
 
soooooooooooooo....this thread looks like fun * thinks about dipping his toe in but instead walks away.
 
Wiggen said:
I'll repeat it again, in case you really don't understand. The U.S. Constitution means whatever the Supreme Court says it means. Until you Euro-Lefties attain a majority on that court, and I wouldn't hold my breath if I was you, your opinion means nothing. You can read the Constitution until your blue in the face. Knock yourself out. Please.
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That's not true at all bro, the Constitution means what it says. The Supreme Court exists to interpret whether or not something is permissible, according to Constitutional law.
 
Andalublue said:
I don't want to believe or disbelieve it, I just don't automatically assume that because a newspaper reports it it must be true. Time and investigation will prove the matter one way or the other. I'm not attacking them as a source, I'm simply saying that neither you nor I know whether this is a reputable paper or whether it has some agenda in making the claims it made in its report. i've never heard of it before. Have you?

If Lord Ahmed made the statements quoted by the newspaper at a public event or even a behind-closed-doors internal event, there is bound to be some phyical record of that speech. I'm sure the investigation will turn up that evidence if it exists. Do you have some reason for believing the journalist over the politician? I don't. Neither profession is exactly the last word in reliability. Why rush to judgement when the facts aren't yet known?
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:shrug: I already told you -- the paper has less of a reason to make it up than he has to deny it.

Besides, I "rushed" to nothing; I posted the OP with no comment.
 
alexa said:
which is the wiki details of who the OP are. That is exactly what I provided the details of the souce of the OP.
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You keep clinging to MEMRI being the "source." They aren't. This has been pointed out to you, yet you keep insisting that they are.

This is pretty stark dishonesty on your part.
 
alexa said:
No, I never said that. I quoted the source of the OP which wrongly said he had put a bounty on Obama.
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Yet according to your own link, he did offer to do so for Bush and Blair:

America has just said that they will give a reward of $10m to anyone who arrests or hands over Hafiz Saeed. I am saying that even if I have to beg in Haripur, and the whole of Pakistan, the US or Britain. Even if I have to beg I am willing to raise and offer £10m so that George W Bush and Tony Blair can be brought to the ICC for justice on war crimes charges.Even if I have to sell my house I am ready to give it away. The thing is that, if they are talking sensibly then I too am talking sensibly. The US has put pressure on Pakistan. To release this pressure I am are saying this. But the thing is, a political move should be countered with a political move."
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Which is different from what he said in his denial.
 
If there's one never ending thing in this world, it's human stupidity.

It's not even funny, to be honest.
 
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