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Brutal-the Killer of 16 is from a nearby Town

TurtleDude

warrior of the wetlands
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"Bobby" Bales was from Norwood, Ohio, a city entirely surrounded by Cincinnati. A blue collar town that once thrived until the big auto manufacturing plant closed a couple decades ago.

ABC local news (Channel 9, WCPO) reporting it now
 
Truly sorry this happened. How long can we, as a country, keep sending the soldiers back into the same situation, without one of them losing it. Sad situation.
 
"Bobby" Bales was from Norwood, Ohio, a city entirely surrounded by Cincinnati. A blue collar town that once thrived until the big auto manufacturing plant closed a couple decades ago.

ABC local news (Channel 9, WCPO) reporting it now

Sad to hear that. Why was this town not incorporated into Cincinnati as is the usual custom in most metropolitan areas?
 
Even more difficult to understand is the respective voting records of many of the folks in congress. The list includes many you would think would be supportive of Veteran's issues, like John McCain. Unconscionable to me.
 
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Sad to hear that. Why was this town not incorporated into Cincinnati as is the usual custom in most metropolitan areas?

That's a good question that I don't have an answer for. It was a thriving community until the big auto plant went bye bye. There are lots of small communities that border Cincinnati-St Bernard, Fairfax, Newtown, Amberly Village, Golf Manor, Lockland, etc but I believe Norwood is the only one surrounded completely. It was an auto town where for years men would graduate from Norwood, maybe do some college or serve and then go work in the auto plant. Sadly the design was "obsolete" . Norwood has sent a lot of guys to the volunteer army--one of the guys who moonlighted in a friend's gun shop was in the special forces and was part of the "nonexistent" Delta Force who was part of the "Black Hawk Down" nastiness
 
That's a good question that I don't have an answer for. It was a thriving community until the big auto plant went bye bye. There are lots of small communities that border Cincinnati-St Bernard, Fairfax, Newtown, Amberly Village, Golf Manor, Lockland, etc but I believe Norwood is the only one surrounded completely. It was an auto town where for years men would graduate from Norwood, maybe do some college or serve and then go work in the auto plant. Sadly the design was "obsolete" . Norwood has sent a lot of guys to the volunteer army--one of the guys who moonlighted in a friend's gun shop was in the special forces and was part of the "nonexistent" Delta Force who was part of the "Black Hawk Down" nastiness

...And now this "innocent child murdering" nastiness. It's a shame for the community...
 
Truly sorry this happened. How long can we, as a country, keep sending the soldiers back into the same situation, without one of them losing it. Sad situation.

Oh Yeah, it's kinda sad about the women and babies he murdered too.

Amazing.
 
Oh Yeah, it's kinda sad about the women and babies he murdered too.

Amazing.


amazing is your silly cheap shot at Billy the Kid who makes a great point.
 
...And now this "innocent child murdering" nastiness. It's a shame for the community...

Oh Yeah, it's kinda sad about the women and babies he murdered too.

Amazing.

This guy will either spend the rest of his life in prison, or he will be executed. If he is executed, fingers from across the pond will waggle in disapproval as well.

Nobody has justified what this man did, not even the man himself. To that point, he was a brilliant, well-respected and highly-decorated soldier, serving honorably for 11 years. He suffered multiple injuries over the course of his four deployments, and his extended absence caused his family severe financial problems. The man snapped. For some reason, a few hours after seeing a buddy's leg blown off before his eyes, this sergeant experienced some kind of acute mental breakdown and committed a horrific mass murder of innocent civilians.

If y'all can't allow us to discuss how these decades' old wars are affecting our soldiers without characteristic British snideness so frequently directed at us and our military, then at least be respectful enough to say nothing at all.
 
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I heard on the radio this could be a tough case to get a conviction because the only witnesses are in Afghanistan and trying to get them here to testify would be impossible...I'm sure the defense will find a way to use this....I sincerely hope this isn't the case because if it is, it will only put the rest of the troops over there in more danger...
 
If y'all can't allow us to discuss how these decades' old wars are affecting our soldiers without characteristic British snideness so frequently directed at us and our military, then at least be respectful enough to say nothing at all.

That's an unfair comment and not worthy of you, DiAnna. I don't think Manc's comment is snide at all. I think he means it. Wiggen, as far as I'm aware, is not British.
 
That's an unfair comment and not worthy of you, DiAnna. I don't think Manc's comment is snide at all. I think he means it. Wiggen, as far as I'm aware, is not British.

I respectfully disagree, Andy. I've shared political forums with Manc for many years. When he wants to, he can make drive-by snideness an art form. If I've misunderstood either of the posts I quoted, the writers are more than welcome to clarify what they really meant versus my interpretation of what I read.
 
I respectfully disagree, Andy. I've shared political forums with Manc for many years. When he wants to, he can make drive-by snideness an art form. If I've misunderstood either of the posts I quoted, the writers are more than welcome to clarify what they really meant versus my interpretation of what I read.
Well, we must have had different experiences of dealing with him. I've always found him to be decent and sensible and not prone to baiting or flaming. Wiggen, not so much. I really don't think he's a Brit, but he is on my iggy.

Back on the topic, I really don't want to judge or sentence the guy before all the facts come. That doesn't just mean I don't want people rush to condemn and call for the death penalty. I don't want that, but I'm also made uncomfortable by certain posters and certain media outlets that seem to be rushing to mitigate his actions and shift the blame elsewhere. It's too soon for that too. I can understand the instinct to protect one's own but this incident I think goes way beyond respect for the military and patriotic closing of ranks. Personally I'd like to see him tried by the International Criminal Court which would offer both Americans and, more importantly in this case, Afghans some semblance of confidence that the eventual verdict will not be politically manipulated.
 
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Well, we must have had different experiences of dealing with him. I've always found him to be decent and sensible and not prone to baiting or flaming. Wiggen, not so much. I really don't think he's a Brit, but he is on my iggy.

Back on the topic, I really don't want to judge or sentence the guy before all the facts come. That doesn't just mean I don't want people rush to condemn and call for the death penalty. I don't want that, but I'm also made uncomfortable by certain posters and certain media outlets that seem to be rushing to mitigate his actions and shift the blame elsewhere. It's too soon for that too. I can understand the instinct to protect one's own but this incident I think goes way beyond respect for the military and patriotic closing of ranks. Personally I'd like to see him tried by the International Criminal Court which would offer both Americans and, more importantly in this case, Afghans some semblance of confidence that the eventual verdict will not be politically manipulated.

Nope, never happen. No NATO nation with soldiers serving in a war zone would allow a renegade soldier to be tried on foreign soil, subject to foreign laws. Nobody in this thread is trying to protect Bales. He will never see the light of day outside a prison again, and may very well be executed for his horrific crimes. We were just trying to understand what makes a 11-year decorated war veteran go bat**** insane, when he's never shown anything but soft-spoken respect for the citizens of both countries to which he has been deployed.

I thought, and still think, we are entitled to that discussion without condescending or snide remarks implying that we care more about our soldier than all the innocent lives that he took. I stand by my earlier post in that regard.
 
Nope, never happen. No NATO nation with soldiers serving in a war zone would allow a renegade soldier to be tried on foreign soil, subject to foreign laws.
Probably not. I think it's a shame that NATO combatants aren't held to the same standards as their opponents.
He will never see the light of day outside a prison again, and may very well be executed for his horrific crimes.
Maybe, maybe not. No proof in Afghan massacre.
when he's never shown anything but soft-spoken respect for the citizens of both countries to which he has been deployed.
I hadn't read that. Link?

I thought, and still think, we are entitled to that discussion without condescending or snide remarks implying that we care more about our soldier than all the innocent lives that he took. I stand by my earlier post in that regard.
You stand by your anti-British snipe when you take exception to just one British poster's remark?
 
That's an unfair comment and not worthy of you, DiAnna. I don't think Manc's comment is snide at all. I think he means it. Wiggen, as far as I'm aware, is not British.

I can assure you he is not British. He's a US Veteran by the way.
 
The reason why NATO troops are not tried in the host country is a status of forces agreement that forbids it. Some SOFs allow it in very rare instances, for decades sailor and marine rapists were flown quickly out of Okinawa for trail stateside. I escorted a soldier to the airport after he served a few years in a German jail for rape, he was to finish his sentence in Leavenworth.

A big reason we withdrew so quickly from Iraq is the Iraqis refused to extend the SOF so out we came.

Now this E-6 has a few red flags in his past. Apparently he schemed some retiree out of his life's savings before ducking into the army.

He had to attend anger management classes so some assault charge would be dropped.

A BIG red flag for those who have served is his being past over for promotion. Decorated veterans, wounded in combat and having served multiple tours as a rule don't get passed over for promotion. Something happened.

Finally a Military Courts Martial isn't much like a civilian court. There judges are serving officers with an option a token senior NCO to sit in judgement. They can be incredibly harsh or lenient. Past history would lean toward if found guilty not receiving the max.
 
amazing is your silly cheap shot at Billy the Kid who makes a great point.

Really - what great point was that? That we should expect every soldier who's had multiple tours of duty to go on a baby-murdering rampage? That we should feel sorry for those who do, and to hell with their victims?

Yeah. Great point.
 
This guy will either spend the rest of his life in prison, or he will be executed. If he is executed, fingers from across the pond will waggle in disapproval as well.

Nobody has justified what this man did, not even the man himself. To that point, he was a brilliant, well-respected and highly-decorated soldier, serving honorably for 11 years. He suffered multiple injuries over the course of his four deployments, and his extended absence caused his family severe financial problems. The man snapped. For some reason, a few hours after seeing a buddy's leg blown off before his eyes, this sergeant experienced some kind of acute mental breakdown and committed a horrific mass murder of innocent civilians.

If y'all can't allow us to discuss how these decades' old wars are affecting our soldiers without characteristic British snideness so frequently directed at us and our military, then at least be respectful enough to say nothing at all.

British snideness? I'm as American as you are - maybe more so because I gave this country four years of my life serving in that military that you profess to love so much. What this murdering animal did is an insult to every GI who has worn the uniform and managed not to become a baby killer.

And this guy's personal history isn't nearly as all-american as you would like.
 
British snideness? I'm as American as you are - maybe more so because I gave this country four years of my life serving in that military that you profess to love so much. What this murdering animal did is an insult to every GI who has worn the uniform and managed not to become a baby killer.

And this guy's personal history isn't nearly as all-american as you would like.


Apologies, I thought you had previously claimed to have been born in the UK. I stand by my comments. If you are entitled to snipe at other posters, then I am entitled to snipe at you. :)

As for Bales, I only know what I heard on CNN interviews with people familiar with his service background and friends of the family. Those with whom he served are in a state of shock, and repeatedly said he was calm under fire and demanded his troops treat locals with respect. Friends of the family have said that repeated deployments and being passed over for promotion have led to severe financial problems, which may have contributed to his mental break. As this man and his family are put under a microscope, we may learn things about him that indeed should have served as a red flag to his superiors. That should be investigated thoroughly to prevent such flags from being ignored. That said, his family has been subjected to death threats and have had to be moved onto a military base for protection. Unacceptable.

Trying to understand what caused this is NOT making excuses for him. I hope he goes to prison for life. I've said that repeatedly.
 
Fair enough. And yes, I was born in the UK but came to this country at a very early age. I still have relatives in the UK.
 
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