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Democrat NLRB ‘recess’ appointments rushed, don’t appear on White House nominee list

Re: Democrat NLRB ‘recess’ appointments rushed, don’t appear on White House nominee l

apdst said:
I'm sure you were just as outraged when the Democrats did the same thing.
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Yes. I hate this. I think used sparingly, its part of the sport, but the government has to work. You can use it to generally obstruct, which is exactly what has been happening in recent years. If one party does it, the other is to do it and we are going to have a government/system that just does not work. Confirm the presidential appointees and only sabotage the extremist appointments.
 
Re: Democrat NLRB ‘recess’ appointments rushed, don’t appear on White House nominee l

upsideguy said:
Yes. I hate this. I think used sparingly, its part of the sport, but the government has to work. You can use it to generally obstruct, which is exactly what has been happening in recent years. If one party does it, the other is to do it and we are going to have a government/system that just does not work. Confirm the presidential appointees and only sabotage the extremist appointments.
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Then they need to change the rules. What Obama did was to go further nuclear.
 
Re: Democrat NLRB ‘recess’ appointments rushed, don’t appear on White House nominee l

Eighty Deuce said:
Read the thread. The Senate's obligation, and right, to advise and consent.

Further, the links also reference Jay Carney, government sources, and other major media, addressing this issue.

As noted, now a President can bypass the Senate on every nomination. Does not even need to submit the entity for the Senate to check the person out. Now you tell me if that was how the Founders drafted things up ? Thanks in advance. :roll:
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can it be said that the congress fulfilled this obligation?
if not 'yes', then would that not provide Obama with basis to justify his 'recess' appointments
 
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Re: Democrat NLRB ‘recess’ appointments rushed, don’t appear on White House nominee l

apdst said:
Well, no, it's a fact that Congress was still in session when he made the appointment. He circumvented the law.
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You really need to alert the media.... the local FOX outlet would be your first and best bet to spring this breaking news.
 
Re: Democrat NLRB ‘recess’ appointments rushed, don’t appear on White House nominee l

Eighty Deuce said:
You are not close to being in a position to label anything I do as "disengenuous". If you want to just disagree, fine. But otherwise, shove it.

Like it or not, the Republicans did not invent this procedure. The Democrats did, and as per the Constitution, the Senate makes its rules. Bush never went nuclear in response to the Democrats. But now Obama did.

<sigh>
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It is disingenuous as the whole thing is just a serious of shams.... The Senate has made no serious effort to consider any of this appointees. The backlog is a US record. Then the Senate comes up with this sham called a virtual session to protect their obstructionism. The work has to get done. People that are all up and arms about the Obama move should be equally dismayed about virtual sessions. I am for functional government, as we all should be. All of this is an affront to our Constitution. IMHO, people that feel otherwise are just endorsing the games and are upset by moves adverse to their position in these games (they are upset about the politics/outcome rather than the substance of what is going on) and therefore are essentially disingenuous.
 
Re: Democrat NLRB ‘recess’ appointments rushed, don’t appear on White House nominee l

justabubba said:
can it be said that the congress fulfilled this obligation?
if not 'yes', then would than not provide Obama with basis to justify his 'recess' appointments
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I do not believe so with these two "nominees", as the issue in this thread is that these two were never submitted to a Senate in normal session. That is what makes this different from Cordray. Congress was denied any opportunity to advise, consent, reject, etc. with these two.
 
Re: Democrat NLRB ‘recess’ appointments rushed, don’t appear on White House nominee l

upsideguy said:
It is disingenuous as the whole thing is just a serious of shams.... The Senate has made no serious effort to consider any of this appointees. The backlog is a US record. Then the Senate comes up with this sham called a virtual session to protect their obstructionism. The work has to get done. People that are all up and arms about the Obama move should be equally dismayed about virtual sessions. I am for functional government, as we all should be. All of this is an affront to our Constitution. IMHO, people that feel otherwise are just endorsing the games and are upset by moves adverse to their position in these games (they are upset about the politics/outcome rather than the substance of what is going on) and therefore are essentially disingenuous.
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If you want to label the GOP as disengenuous, etc., then fine. But you have zero basis on which to call me such. Do not do it again, OK ;)
 
Re: Democrat NLRB ‘recess’ appointments rushed, don’t appear on White House nominee l

Eighty Deuce said:
Then they need to change the rules. What Obama did was to go further nuclear.
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The whole idea of recess appointments is an abuse of power. Recess appointments were designed for emergency appointments when congress was out of session and congressman often hailed from states that were several days travel away from Washington. Now we have virtual sessions, another abuse of power and then a recess appointment during a virtual session. Moreover, the Senate refuses to do its duty of advice and consent.... we have one abuse of power after the other. The whole thing is an outrage. Pretty hard to be more outraged with one step in the process over another; its all outrageous.

Its ok to keep the rules. Just don't abuse them. The Senate should just do its job and consider ALL of the appointments. If they want to use this tactic on RARE occasion, OK. But it should not be standard operating procedure.
 
Re: Democrat NLRB ‘recess’ appointments rushed, don’t appear on White House nominee l

upsideguy said:
Yes. I hate this. I think used sparingly, its part of the sport, but the government has to work. You can use it to generally obstruct, which is exactly what has been happening in recent years. If one party does it, the other is to do it and we are going to have a government/system that just does not work. Confirm the presidential appointees and only sabotage the extremist appointments.
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I don't have a problem with it and I'll tell you why. I don't want the president--any president--to be able to appoint just any swinging dick, especially if it's a life time appointment, without that person being questioned, questioned, impeded and then questioned some more.
 
Re: Democrat NLRB ‘recess’ appointments rushed, don’t appear on White House nominee l

apdst said:
I don't have a problem with it and I'll tell you why. I don't want the president--any president--to be able to appoint just any swinging dick, especially if it's a life time appointment, without that person being questioned, questioned, impeded and then questioned some more.
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[emphasis added by bubba]

recess appointments can never exceed two years
 
Re: Democrat NLRB ‘recess’ appointments rushed, don’t appear on White House nominee l

upsideguy said:
The whole idea of recess appointments is an abuse of power. Recess appointments were designed for emergency appointments when congress was out of session and congressman often hailed from states that were several days travel away from Washington. Now we have virtual sessions, another abuse of power and then a recess appointment during a virtual session. Moreover, the Senate refuses to do its duty of advice and consent.... we have one abuse of power after the other. The whole thing is an outrage. Pretty hard to be more outraged with one step in the process over another; its all outrageous.

Its ok to keep the rules. Just don't abuse them. The Senate should just do its job and consider ALL of the appointments. If they want to use this tactic on RARE occasion, OK. But it should not be standard operating procedure.
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I have made the same argument in this, and another thread. I made it when folks pointed to the 3-day gavel session as a "gimmick", pointing out that the actual Recess appointment had long been a gimmick already, so it was one gimmick combating another. In that manner, I approve of this 3-day tactic. It retains for the Senate the authority the Founders enabled, both with advise and consent, and the Senate's own Constitutional ability to make rules which empower the minority party.

That is where I fault Obama, and many of the posters here. They will not admit that it is one gimmick used to nullify a prior gimmick. I agree that the entire process has its drawbacks, but it was the process in place when this bill, and its specific language, was passed.
 
Re: Democrat NLRB ‘recess’ appointments rushed, don’t appear on White House nominee l

Eighty Deuce said:
I have made the same argument in this, and another thread. I made it when folks pointed to the 3-day gavel session as a "gimmick", pointing out that the actual Recess appointment had long been a gimmick already, so it was one gimmick combating another. In that manner, I approve of this 3-day tactic. It retains for the Senate the authority the Founders enabled, both with advise and consent, and the Senate's own Constitutional ability to make rules which empower the minority party.

That is where I fault Obama, and many of the posters here. They will not admit that it is one gimmick used to nullify a prior gimmick. I agree that the entire process has its drawbacks, but it was the process in place when this bill, and its specific language, was passed.
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Don't you mean non-process? The obstruction of ALL appointees is at least as unprecedented as anything Obama has done to get these measely few through. You act as though he filled all 200 vacancies which he could have if he chose to. Painting him as a radical again? Not going to work this time.
 
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Re: Democrat NLRB ‘recess’ appointments rushed, don’t appear on White House nominee l

iguanaman said:
Don't you mean non-process? The obstruction of ALL appointees is at least as unprecedented as anything Obama has done to get these measely few through. You act as though he filled all 200 vacancies which he could have if he chose to. Painting him as a radical again? Not going to work this time.
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And you act as an Obama supporter. ;)

I'm shocked !
 
Re: Democrat NLRB ‘recess’ appointments rushed, don’t appear on White House nominee l

apdst said:
The president can't make appointments while Congress is still in session. It's illegal. He broke the law. Period.
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Congress was NOT in session. There was NO pro-forma session that day.
 
Re: Democrat NLRB ‘recess’ appointments rushed, don’t appear on White House nominee l

Eighty Deuce said:
Plays a better hand ? LOL ..... when you play as this in a real poker game in the Wild Wild West, you get shot for cheating.

The GOP followed the rules. Liberals whine because they disagree with the motive. But they followed the rules.

Here, Obama does not follow the rules. To Hell with oversight. To hell with checking these folks out. And to hell with the same process he endorsed as a Senator. The jackass just put two folks on the NLRB via his own whim. Completely bypassed the Senate. Completely ignored the Constitution.

And the libs cheer. :roll:
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The Senate was cheating by pretending not to be in recess. Obama called their bluff.
 
Re: Democrat NLRB ‘recess’ appointments rushed, don’t appear on White House nominee l

Eighty Deuce said:
I have made the same argument in this, and another thread. I made it when folks pointed to the 3-day gavel session as a "gimmick", pointing out that the actual Recess appointment had long been a gimmick already, so it was one gimmick combating another. In that manner, I approve of this 3-day tactic. It retains for the Senate the authority the Founders enabled, both with advise and consent, and the Senate's own Constitutional ability to make rules which empower the minority party.
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Yet the Senate wasn't in town to use that authority. Sounds like recess to me. The founders gave the President the power to appoint people when the Senate wasn't around. The Senate failed miserably to use its authority even when it WAS in session, and then went home while pretending to be in session. So enough talk about the Senate using it's authority. The Senate is in hibernation, and waking up every three days to go to the bathroom. It's not working.
 
Re: Democrat NLRB ‘recess’ appointments rushed, don’t appear on White House nominee l

danarhea said:
Congress was NOT in session. There was NO pro-forma session that day.
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It fell within the 3-day gavel rule. However, the day prior, Obama could have made the appointment, although it would not have been valid past the end of 2012. By waiting one day, and breaking the rule, the appointment is no valid thorugh 2013.
 
Re: Democrat NLRB ‘recess’ appointments rushed, don’t appear on White House nominee l

misterman said:
Yet the Senate wasn't in town to use that authority. Sounds like recess to me. The founders gave the President the power to appoint people when the Senate wasn't around. The Senate failed miserably to use its authority even when it WAS in session, and then went home while pretending to be in session. So enough talk about the Senate using it's authority. The Senate is in hibernation, and waking up every three days to go to the bathroom. It's not working.
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Well, they followed the exact same process that Reid and Senator Obama advocated and used in 2007. So can you explain that ? Inquiring minds want to understand the hypocrisy that you support.
 
Re: Democrat NLRB ‘recess’ appointments rushed, don’t appear on White House nominee l

Wouldn't it be nice if they actually debated and discussed the merits of the appointment, instead of trying to use procedural rules to screw each other over?
 
Re: Democrat NLRB ‘recess’ appointments rushed, don’t appear on White House nominee l

Paschendale said:
Wouldn't it be nice if they actually debated and discussed the merits of the appointment, instead of trying to use procedural rules to screw each other over?
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Actually, the Republicans have tried. The problem is...they have a fundamental dispute about the office and the agency. The Democrats refused to address that dispute...the Republicans used the recess loophole to avoid discussing the nominee...Obama broke the rules...and here we are.

All this could have been avoided if the Democrats had, in good faith, addressed the Republican's dispute.


So it goes.
 
Re: Democrat NLRB ‘recess’ appointments rushed, don’t appear on White House nominee l

Paschendale said:
Wouldn't it be nice if they actually debated and discussed the merits of the appointment, instead of trying to use procedural rules to screw each other over?
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Going to have to agree with Mycroft here, although I sympathisize with aspects of your wish. The basic issue is will the minority in the Senate have any power beyond its ability to vote simple up-or-down on any issue. This has long been an issue, and although it has modified over the years, both sides have always agreed to some level of filibuster. If one is going to have such rules, then one has to honor them at all times.

One thing that must be acknowledged here is that since this position was created, but prior to it being filled, the voters have said that they want the GOP to have more say in all matters. They did this Nov 2010. The House passed 3 resolutions, listed earlier, that they wanted to negotiate. It was in full accordance with how the original HR 4173 was written, in that the Senate held a specific right to confirm. The Senate GOP told Obama they would take his guy if some changes were made. If not, then that guy was unacceptable.

Its upfront. Its not only within the Constitutionally authorized Senate rules, but its in the very bill HR-4173.
 
Re: Democrat NLRB ‘recess’ appointments rushed, don’t appear on White House nominee l

Eighty Deuce said:
It fell within the 3-day gavel rule.
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Can you cite this rule in the Constitution or Senate rulebook?
 
Re: Democrat NLRB ‘recess’ appointments rushed, don’t appear on White House nominee l

Eighty Deuce said:
Well, they followed the exact same process that Reid and Senator Obama advocated and used in 2007. So can you explain that ? Inquiring minds want to understand the hypocrisy that you support.
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Who said I support hypocrisy? Who said I supported using it in 2007?
 
Re: Democrat NLRB ‘recess’ appointments rushed, don’t appear on White House nominee l

misterman said:
Can you cite this rule in the Constitution or Senate rulebook?
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The requirement for the House to grant Recess is already noted. There are earlier links in this, and other threads, where Obama's own Solicitor General argued the 3-day rule as established protocol to SCOTUS. It is imperitive on you to read the thread, not for me or anyone else to continue to put your homework in front of you.


Hypocrisy is not whether you agree or disagree with the process that was in place. Hypocrisy is Obama supporting the rule before, but not now. All who endorse the flip-flop by the President are supporting hypocrisy.
 
Re: Democrat NLRB ‘recess’ appointments rushed, don’t appear on White House nominee l

Eighty Deuce said:
The requirement for the House to grant Recess is already noted. There are earlier links in this, and other threads, where Obama's own Solicitor General argued the 3-day rule as established protocol to SCOTUS.
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Obama's Solicitor General argued this? I missed that.

Hypocrisy is Obama supporting the rule before, but not now. All who endorse the flip-flop by the President are supporting hypocrisy.
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No it's not. I could believe that Obama had the power to do this before, even if he didn't take advantage of it.
 
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