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Tea Party Crowd Yells Let Him Die

rcart76 said:
First the applauding for executions in Texas and now the willingness to let people just die if they didn't have insurance. Man the blood thirst in the republican party is border line medievel. And they say us liberals are godless.
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Under a system where there's zero government intervention in the health care system, and either insurance money or private money is used to cover all health care expenses, an individual who had an accident and had no health insurance would be at the mercy of either society or his friends and family. If he were a wonderful individual--someone who had served his community, helped others, then I would say the community in which he lives has an ethical, but NOT legal, obligation to help him out w/medical expenses, or, at the very least, his friends/family.

Unfortunately, this is one of those cases where relative morality rears its head, i. e. there's no universal agreement on when someone deserves to be subsidized by others.
 
Henrin said:
Their care is inferior and their waiting on average is longer. As for cost, I wouldn't be so quick to say it's a considerable advantage to our own.

As for everyone coming to that conclusion, its obvious when you put the government in power over a system they will enjoy it.
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On average they live longer and on average they wait less.

See, Canada and the UK aren't the only other two countries, but did you notice how those are always the two examples given? Usually hip replacements, too.

Because most of the other countries wait less than we do.
 
DashingAmerican said:
I'm not saying let him die, I'm saying treat him and then bill him.
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Joe Citizen is uninsured and earns 45k a year. He is a renter and is making payments on his car. He is 30 years old and perfectly healthy. However, he is involved in a serious accident and is in a coma for 6 months - requiring a 6 month hospital stay. That stay results in approximately 400,000 dollars in medical bills. Sure the hospital will bill him but the chance of that provider getting even 5% of the money is very low. So what happens is that cost then gets passed on to everyone else. Its a terrible system, but unless we require everyone to have insurance, its something we just have to live with because no one would just let the guy die.
 
SouthernDemocrat said:
Joe Citizen is uninsured and earns 45k a year. He is a renter and is making payments on his car. He is 30 years old and perfectly healthy. However, he is involved in a serious accident and is in a coma for 6 months - requiring a 6 month hospital stay. That stay results in approximately 400,000 dollars in medical bills. Sure the hospital will bill him but the chance of that provider getting even 5% of the money is very low. So what happens is that cost then gets passed on to everyone else. Its a terrible system, but unless we require everyone to have insurance, its something we just have to live with because no one would just let the guy die.
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Which is precisely the argument the GOP used when they proposed a health insurance mandate. We're paying for their healthcare already, it's inhumane to let them die, so let's make them chip into the pot too and save ourselves some money by using preventative medicine instead of emergency rooms. We're tired of footing the bill for cheapskates who can afford insurance but don't get it!

Now? ZOMG SOCIALISM!
 
SouthernDemocrat said:
Joe Citizen is uninsured and earns 45k a year. He is a renter and is making payments on his car. He is 30 years old and perfectly healthy. However, he is involved in a serious accident and is in a coma for 6 months - requiring a 6 month hospital stay. That stay results in approximately 400,000 dollars in medical bills. Sure the hospital will bill him but the chance of that provider getting even 5% of the money is very low. So what happens is that cost then gets passed on to everyone else. Its a terrible system, but unless we require everyone to have insurance, its something we just have to live with because no one would just let the guy die.
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Joe Citizen makes 21k more than me a year and I have medical insurance.
 
DashingAmerican said:
Joe Citizen makes 21k more than me a year and I have medical insurance.
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Well, I am sorry to hear that you are only earning 24k a year. However, I am not saying that Joe Citizen that earn's 45k a year cannot afford insurance, at the very least a high deductible catastrophic policy, I am saying that if he chooses not to buy it, and then incurs a huge medical bill for life saving treatment that cost will be passed on to everyone else because no one other than a sociopath would let the guy die simply because he was uninsured (even if he could have afforded it and chose not to).
 
DashingAmerican said:
I'm all for helping a struggling person,
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But if it comes from your tax dollars and is a public service then no???

but being forced to do something is not charity.
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Of course it isnt...
I dont like my tax dollars going to fund illegitimate wars.... But healthcare is a basic right. How are you going to say it is right that 45,000 people die a year because they cant afford health insurance is ok? How is your health a privatized game?

Whatever happened to being responsible for yourself...oh ya, the 60's happened, nevermind.
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This is the 60's fault????
I believe the first person to come up with some form of socialized medical care was John Adams...
 
TheDemSocialist said:
But if it comes from your tax dollars and is a public service then no???


Of course it isnt...
I dont like my tax dollars going to fund illegitimate wars.... But healthcare is a basic right. How are you going to say it is right that 45,000 people die a year because they cant afford health insurance is ok? How is your health a privatized game?


This is the 60's fault????
I believe the first person to come up with some form of socialized medical care was John Adams...
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No, not if it's from my tax dollars. The money that is taken out of my pocket would be better spent in, say a charity to St. Jude's.

I don't like my money to fund illegitimate wars either. I've been stoutly against Libya.
Healthcare is nowhere in the Constitution.

Yes, it's the 60's fault. The 60's showed a massive decline in self-responsibility.
 
DashingAmerican said:
No, not if it's from my tax dollars. The money that is taken out of my pocket would be better spent in, say a charity to St. Jude's.
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Agree. Unless the charity was gov't-run.

DashingAmerican said:
I don't like my money to fund illegitimate wars either. I've been stoutly against Libya.
Healthcare is nowhere in the Constitution.
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And Iraq, which was 1,000 times more expensive (literally) than Libya so far and equally as illegitimate.

DashingAmerican said:
Yes, it's the 60's fault. The 60's showed a massive decline in self-responsibility.
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But resulted in a massive increase in kick a$$ tunes.
 
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DashingAmerican said:
No, not if it's from my tax dollars. The money that is taken out of my pocket would be better spent in, say a charity to St. Jude's.

I don't like my money to fund illegitimate wars either. I've been stoutly against Libya.
Healthcare is nowhere in the Constitution.

Yes, it's the 60's fault. The 60's showed a massive decline in self-responsibility.
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You just stated earlier that you earn 24k a year. If that is the case, then you don't have to worry about it because you pay very little in federal income taxes. The only taxes you are paying to the federal government other than the gas tax, would be payroll taxes and you will directly benefit from them. We live in a democratic republic. If you disagree with what taxes are being used for you can vote for candidates that share your view. However, taxes are not theft, they are the money you pay for the services that have been collectively allocated to the public sector.

By the way, being that charitable contributes are tax deductible, if you believe that money would be better spent going to St. Judes, donate the money to St. Jude and deduct that donation come tax time.
 
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SouthernDemocrat said:
You just stated earlier that you earn 24k a year. If that is the case, then you don't have to worry about it because you pay very little in federal income taxes. The only taxes you are paying to the federal government other than the gas tax, would be payroll taxes and you will directly benefit from them. We live in a democratic republic. If you disagree with what taxes are being used for you can vote for candidates that share your view. However, taxes are not theft, they are the money you pay for the services that have been collectively allocated to the public sector.

By the way, being that charitable contributes are tax deductible, if you believe that money would be better spent going to St. Judes, donate the money to St. Jude and deduct that donation come tax time.
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I do vote for candidates that share my view.
 
DashingAmerican said:
Joe Citizen makes 21k more than me a year and I have medical insurance.
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Yes because all Joe citizens are just like you. Have the same lifestyle. Same numbers of sick children. same job situation....and on and on.

Seriously, get over yourself. You can't possibly suggest that because you have health insurance that everyone else should have it. That's nothing short of myopic and disingenuous.
 
Top Cat said:
Yes because all Joe citizens are just like you. Have the same lifestyle. Same numbers of sick children. same job situation....and on and on.

Seriously, get over yourself. You can't possibly suggest that because you have health insurance that everyone else should have it. That's nothing short of myopic and disingenuous.
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Nope. The hypothetical situation stated that the citizen makes double the money and yes, that person should have himself covered.
 
Henrin said:
Having the chance to make bad choices is a important.
Having a free ride out of those bad choices is wrong.

Wow, hard concept.
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Force someone to have an unwanted pregnancy because you don't have the stones to mind your own ****ing business and then when your forced morality creates an economic hardship, tough titty..

Wow, hard concept.

See how easy that is?
 
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DashingAmerican said:
Probably more aware than you.

Personal attacks don't help your case. They just make you look like an assclown.
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I'm betting you don't have kids. I certainly hope not.

I got your assclown hanging dasher.. It's people like you that represent all that's wrong with those on the right. Judgmental and myopic and believing life is as simple as Ann Coulter and Rush Limbaugh tell them it is.. And yet no at real clue what it's like for some folks who are down on their luck through circumstances beyond their control. Such non right wing things such as catastrophic or mental illness. Disability, economic hardship due to illness, etc, etc, etc. But hey, why tell you?

Let him die.
 
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DashingAmerican said:
Nope. The hypothetical situation stated that the citizen makes double the money and yes, that person should have himself covered.
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So then what you said was total BS then? Figures.
 
Top Cat said:
I got your assclown hanging dasher.. It's people like you that represent all that's wrong with those on the right. Judgmental and myopic and believing life is as simple as Ann Coulter and Rush Limbaugh tell them it is.. And yet no at real clue what it's like for some folks who are down on their luck through circumstances beyond their control. Such non right wing things such as catastrophic or mental illness. Disability, economic hardship due to illness, etc, etc, etc. But hey, why tell you?

Let him die.
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I've not said anything judgemental. Don't listen to Ann Coulter or Rush Limbaugh. I know exactly what it's like to be poor, to live in a trailer my whole life with a single mom, so shut the **** up.

If you could read, I've never said let them die. I said make them pay for the services they recieved, which is probably hard for you to concieve.

Far be it for me to expect you to actually read through the posts.
So when you know what the **** you are talking about come on back.
 
pbrauer said:
This is an indication how radical and far right the Tea Party is.

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Absolutely uncivilized. I'll bet some of them flip-flop faster than you can bat an eyelash if it personally happened to them.

roughdraft274 said:
That was hardly some standing ovation. It was two or three people. Extrapolating that to the entire group is wrong.
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Then where was the immediate reaction from the audience, RD? Where were the groans, the boos at those uncivilized outburst comments?
 
Bardo said:
Besides, the gist of Paul's answer was "yes".
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Actually, he went deeper into the problem which I think everyone is missing.

Why couldn't Jimmy afford insurance?

After the video cuts off...

PAUL: No. I practiced medicine before we had Medicaid, in the early 1960s, when I got out of medical school. I practiced at Santa Rosa Hospital in San Antonio, and the churches took care of them. We never turned anybody away from the hospitals.

Bardo said:
Do doctors still have to swear to the Hippocratic Oath? Ron Paul should know better.
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PAUL: And we've given up on this whole concept that we might take care of ourselves and assume responsibility for ourselves. Our neighbors, our friends, our churches would do it. . This whole idea, that's the reason the cost is so high.

Answer-> The cost is so high because they dump it on the government, it becomes a bureaucracy. It becomes special interests. It kowtows (bow downs) to the insurance companies and the drug companies, and then on top of that, you have the inflation. The inflation devalues the dollar, we have lack of competition.

PAUL: There's no competition in medicine. Everybody is protected by licensing. (Portion of a solution) And we should actually legalize alternative health care, allow people to practice what they want. (free markets)
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I tried to make it easier for everyone to understand. ^^. This also requires the knowledge of how free market works.
 
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