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[Ohio]- SECRETARY OF STATE HUSTED CERTIFIES SIGNATURES FOR REFERENDUM ON SENATE BILL

Re: [Ohio]- SECRETARY OF STATE HUSTED CERTIFIES SIGNATURES FOR REFERENDUM ON SENATE B

TurtleDude said:
more populist nonsense. GE generates lots of wealth for lots of people and lots of taxes for the government-from the income taxes dividend owners pay to payroll taxes
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GE paid not one cent of income tax, and not only that, it also received a government handout. Screw the BS argument about generating wealth for others. I generate wealth for others when I go shopping. Your argument is just another BS argument for robber barons who want to obtain their wealth on the backs of others.
 
Re: [Ohio]- SECRETARY OF STATE HUSTED CERTIFIES SIGNATURES FOR REFERENDUM ON SENATE B

danarhea said:
GE paid not one cent of income tax, and not only that, it also received a government handout. Screw the BS argument about generating wealth for others. I generate wealth for others when I go shopping. Your argument is just another BS argument for robber barons who want to obtain their wealth on the backs of others.
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more populist drivel. GE paid taxes in other countries

they lost money or had recognizable losses that offset corporate profits

should GE pay taxes on income realized in other countries where they paid taxes on it?

where does that income go? to stockholders who paid taxes on it

why should GE's income be TAXED TWICE?
 
Re: [Ohio]- SECRETARY OF STATE HUSTED CERTIFIES SIGNATURES FOR REFERENDUM ON SENATE B

haymarket said:
from Winston




the reply


State of Ohio employees working for a wage do NOT PAY TAXES?!?!?!?!?!?!?

Where do you get stuff like this?????
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IDK... I guess he thinks some people working hard, don't deserve the money they earn
 
Re: [Ohio]- SECRETARY OF STATE HUSTED CERTIFIES SIGNATURES FOR REFERENDUM ON SENATE B

TurtleDude said:
that is as silly as saying a bank robber is truly a taxpayer if he takes money he didn't own and uses it to pay taxes. what he is doing is paying taxes with other peoples' money, they are the taxpayers not him
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So all the people working in the private sector including all the politicians are bank robbers now? Have they not earned the money they were paid?
 
Re: [Ohio]- SECRETARY OF STATE HUSTED CERTIFIES SIGNATURES FOR REFERENDUM ON SENATE B

winston53660 said:
And guess what law enforcement (paid for by tax dollars) will catch him/her send him her to court (paid for by tax dollars) and if convicted imprison (paid for by tax dollars) him/her.

To bad your bank robber here can not use your costco approach to taxation.
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Actually, a bank robber would be required to pay the taxes on the money he gained by stealing it, not doing so would result in tax evasion. That's the tax law. :lol:
 
Re: [Ohio]- SECRETARY OF STATE HUSTED CERTIFIES SIGNATURES FOR REFERENDUM ON SENATE B

SheWolf said:
Actually, a bank robber would be required to pay the taxes on the money he gained by stealing it, not doing so would result in tax evasion. That's the tax law. :lol:
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if he reported them as other income

he is not forced to say where he got the money because it would violate the 5th amendment

its the same reason why gun registration laws do not apply to felons.
 
Re: [Ohio]- SECRETARY OF STATE HUSTED CERTIFIES SIGNATURES FOR REFERENDUM ON SENATE B

SheWolf said:
So all the people working in the private sector including all the politicians are bank robbers now? Have they not earned the money they were paid?
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that completely misses the point.
 
Re: [Ohio]- SECRETARY OF STATE HUSTED CERTIFIES SIGNATURES FOR REFERENDUM ON SENATE B

apdst said:
Those sales taxes--not income taxes--were paid with tax money, which created zero new revenue. It amounts to nothing more than taking money from one government account and putting it into another, which doesn't accomplish a damn thing.

Imagine this: you have $10,000. You deposit it into one account. Then, you take out $5,000 and use it to open a new account at another bank. What's the end result? You still only have $10,000.
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Exactly which public workers are you talking about? You seem to be saying that they aren't paying income taxes, am I wrong?
 
Re: [Ohio]- SECRETARY OF STATE HUSTED CERTIFIES SIGNATURES FOR REFERENDUM ON SENATE B

TurtleDude said:
Oh I see, everyone always sticks exactly to the thread title
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Yeah, we try to at least
 
Re: [Ohio]- SECRETARY OF STATE HUSTED CERTIFIES SIGNATURES FOR REFERENDUM ON SENATE B

danarhea said:
GE paid not one cent of income tax, and not only that, it also received a government handout. Screw the BS argument about generating wealth for others. I generate wealth for others when I go shopping. Your argument is just another BS argument for robber barons who want to obtain their wealth on the backs of others.
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You have hit it right out of the park. The claims of Turtle are akin to somebody saying that while they did not pay the entire bill that they should have paid, they did hand over lots of money so they should be allowed to slide on the rest. That would never fly and it should not fly just because they are a huge corporation with a bunch of attorneys and CPA's filling many cubicles.
 
Re: [Ohio]- SECRETARY OF STATE HUSTED CERTIFIES SIGNATURES FOR REFERENDUM ON SENATE B

apdst said:
I think that since you feed from the trough, as well, you can't understand/won't admit that recycling government money doesn't create new tax revenue.

Picture this: I own a business. I charge my employees 15% of their payroll to work for me. I turn around and use that 15% for my payroll account. Am I creating new revenue for my business?
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That's not a good example... Directly charging your employees for an expense like that would result in tax write off for them anyway. You'd loss a tax deduction, but your net income would be higher and would be taxed, making up for your employees tax write off.
 
Re: [Ohio]- SECRETARY OF STATE HUSTED CERTIFIES SIGNATURES FOR REFERENDUM ON SENATE B

TurtleDude said:
more populist nonsense. GE generates lots of wealth for lots of people and lots of taxes for the government-from the income taxes dividend owners pay to payroll taxes
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I think GE was actually one of the companies that received a lot of bad publicity because they made huge profits, but paid no taxes...
 
Re: [Ohio]- SECRETARY OF STATE HUSTED CERTIFIES SIGNATURES FOR REFERENDUM ON SENATE B

TurtleDude said:
more populist drivel. GE paid taxes in other countries

they lost money or had recognizable losses that offset corporate profits

should GE pay taxes on income realized in other countries where they paid taxes on it?

where does that income go? to stockholders who paid taxes on it

why should GE's income be TAXED TWICE?
Click to expand...

Everybody is taxed twice... You pay taxes on the money before you receive it, and when you spend it, you pay a sales tax.

In terms of corporate profit and stockholders, the income is taxed twice, but taxpayer is NOT taxed twice.. The first time, the taxes are paid on the company's retained earnings account. The second time it's taxed, it's a capital gains tax for the stockholder.

Average people are taxed twice, companies are not taxed twice and in GE's case, they weren't taxed at all.
 
Re: [Ohio]- SECRETARY OF STATE HUSTED CERTIFIES SIGNATURES FOR REFERENDUM ON SENATE B

TurtleDude said:
if he reported them as other income

he is not forced to say where he got the money because it would violate the 5th amendment

its the same reason why gun registration laws do not apply to felons.
Click to expand...

Where did I ever claim a robber would be forced to say where the money came from? All I said is it's still considered taxable income according to the tax code.
 
Re: [Ohio]- SECRETARY OF STATE HUSTED CERTIFIES SIGNATURES FOR REFERENDUM ON SENATE B

SheWolf said:
I think GE was actually one of the companies that received a lot of bad publicity because they made huge profits, but paid no taxes...
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they obviously did not make enough profits in the USA to overcome their losses

the Chairman of GE (a local boy from Cincinnati) sits on some Obama Committee and is a big supporter of "Dear Leader"

the bad publicity came from the lefties who don't understand taxes and some righties who hate the fact that one guy in GE is an Obama slurper
 
Re: [Ohio]- SECRETARY OF STATE HUSTED CERTIFIES SIGNATURES FOR REFERENDUM ON SENATE B

SheWolf said:
Where did I ever claim a robber would be forced to say where the money came from? All I said is it's still considered taxable income according to the tax code.
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True enough-I wasn't claiming you said that-I was explaining how it works legally

the IRS has a specific line for "illegal income"
 
Re: [Ohio]- SECRETARY OF STATE HUSTED CERTIFIES SIGNATURES FOR REFERENDUM ON SENATE B

TurtleDude said:
they obviously did not make enough profits in the USA to overcome their losses

the Chairman of GE (a local boy from Cincinnati) sits on some Obama Committee and is a big supporter of "Dear Leader"

the bad publicity came from the lefties who don't understand taxes and some righties who hate the fact that one guy in GE is an Obama slurper
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So you're claiming to be a tax attorney now?
 
Re: [Ohio]- SECRETARY OF STATE HUSTED CERTIFIES SIGNATURES FOR REFERENDUM ON SENATE B

SheWolf said:
Everybody is taxed twice... You pay taxes on the money before you receive it, and when you spend it, you pay a sales tax.

In terms of corporate profit and stockholders, the income is taxed twice, but taxpayer is NOT taxed twice.. The first time, the taxes are paid on the company's retained earnings account. The second time it's taxed, it's a capital gains tax for the stockholder.

Average people are taxed twice, companies are not taxed twice and in GE's case, they weren't taxed at all.
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the owners of the company are taxed twice because all the assets of the company are owned by the shareholders

so if a corporation is owned by ten people (assume not a subchapter s) and it makes a net profit of 1 million dollars should each owner get 100K and then pay taxes on it or should the corporation pay say 35% on that and then the taxpayers each pay 15% on the 65K they each get after the corporate taxes?

or to use Obama logic. should they pay 40% on the 65K each gets?
 
Re: [Ohio]- SECRETARY OF STATE HUSTED CERTIFIES SIGNATURES FOR REFERENDUM ON SENATE B

SheWolf said:
So you're claiming to be a tax attorney now?
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I suspect since I took every tax class available at a law school that was reputed to be one of the top 4 in that area, and since I am a director of a LLC that is an investment holding company I suspect I know a bit more than the average poster here though I dont claim to be say Donald Alexander who was the best tax lawyer I ever knew (he was IRS commissioner for almost 8 years) and billed as the best tax lawyer in the USA in the 80s

I do not practice tax though I have been involved in issues like "Summons enforcement" issues
 
Re: [Ohio]- SECRETARY OF STATE HUSTED CERTIFIES SIGNATURES FOR REFERENDUM ON SENATE B

For those unaccustomed to the loopholes and shelters of the corporate tax code, GE's success at avoiding taxes is nothing short of extraordinary. The company, led by Immelt, earned $14.2 billion in profits in 2010, but it paid not a penny in taxes because the bulk of those profits, some $9 billion, were offshore. In fact, GE got a $3.2 billion tax benefit.
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General Electric Paid No Federal Taxes in 2010 - ABC News

According to the article GE avoided taxes through off shoring, not by carrying over NOLs.
 
Re: [Ohio]- SECRETARY OF STATE HUSTED CERTIFIES SIGNATURES FOR REFERENDUM ON SENATE B

TurtleDude said:
the owners of the company are taxed twice because all the assets of the company are owned by the shareholders

so if a corporation is owned by ten people (assume not a subchapter s) and it makes a net profit of 1 million dollars should each owner get 100K and then pay taxes on it or should the corporation pay say 35% on that and then the taxpayers each pay 15% on the 65K they each get after the corporate taxes?

or to use Obama logic. should they pay 40% on the 65K each gets?
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So you think shareholders get 100 percent of the companies profits?
 
Re: [Ohio]- SECRETARY OF STATE HUSTED CERTIFIES SIGNATURES FOR REFERENDUM ON SENATE B

from Turtle on the false allegation of double taxation


the owners of the company are taxed twice because all the assets of the company are owned by the shareholders
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As a trained attorney, you have instructed others here in posts about the legal personhood of corporations. You have pointed out to many that a corporation is a legal person in the eyes of the law. You also know that an individual is also a legal person in the eyes of the law.

A corporation paying its taxes is one transaction for one legal person.

An individual paying their taxes is one transaction for one different legal person.

Those are two distinct and different persons paying two and distinct and different sets of taxes.

There is no double taxation involved there.
 
Re: [Ohio]- SECRETARY OF STATE HUSTED CERTIFIES SIGNATURES FOR REFERENDUM ON SENATE B

SheWolf said:
General Electric Paid No Federal Taxes in 2010 - ABC News

According to the article GE avoided taxes through off shoring, not by carrying over NOLs.
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you mean being taxed in other jurisdictions

We have GE Aircraft about 15 minutes from us. I wonder how they didnt pay any taxes on that

whose fault is that-GE or Congress or the tax code?

what about the 47% of voters who pay no income taxes?

GE provides a ton of jobs in the area where I live-many of them to union blue collar dem voters

what do those 47% provide to us?
 
Re: [Ohio]- SECRETARY OF STATE HUSTED CERTIFIES SIGNATURES FOR REFERENDUM ON SENATE B

haymarket said:
from Turtle on the false allegation of double taxation




As a trained attorney, you have instructed others here in posts about the legal personhood of corporations. You have pointed out to many that a corporation is a legal person in the eyes of the law. You also know that an individual is also a legal person in the eyes of the law.

A corporation paying its taxes is one transaction for one legal person.

An individual paying their taxes is one transaction for one different legal person.

Those are two distinct and different persons paying two and distinct and different sets of taxes.

There is no double taxation involved there.
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AS a trained attorney I find this law to be unfair and it should be repealed

don't confuse disagreement with a lack of knowledge
 
Re: [Ohio]- SECRETARY OF STATE HUSTED CERTIFIES SIGNATURES FOR REFERENDUM ON SENATE B

SheWolf said:
So you think shareholders get 100 percent of the companies profits?
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no, in some cases the directors believe that the profit should be used for improvements or new machinery or facilities. But I don't think the government should get any of it until the taxpayers spend it. (I oppose taxes on income)

Do you think corporate profits should be taxed both at a 35% corporate level and then again at a 40% individual level?
 
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