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Michele Bachmann: John Quincy Adams Was 'One Of Our Founding Fathers'

pbrauer said:
Obama made the gaffe in Beaverton, Oregon; he had visited three states that day on the campaign; he was understandably very tired. What's Michele Bachmann's excuse?
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A - ignorance
B - stupidity
C - thought process short circuited by a willfully imposed extremist belief system
D - all of the above
 
Dezaad said:
The notion that the founders worked tirelessly until slavery was abolished is revisionist crapola.
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Perhaps you should read about the lives of the "founders" beyond their role in forming the nation. Many had key roles within their respective state assemblies/legislatures as well.

Memory may be wrong, but if it isn't, didn't Jefferson introduce legislation in the Virginia Assembly to abolish slavery, and if I am not mistaken he was supported by Madison and Mason. The bill was defeated. Also others - maybe Hamilton - lead abolutionist efforts in NY, including something to protect slaves that were freed (manumition?) by their owners had their rights protected and were not illicitly re-enslaved?

Don't know if tirelessly is correct, but at least in Virginia it was a bold position to take at the time

Not to mention the work and advocay of John Adams on this issue - not John Q. :)
 
BDBoop said:
Are you saying such threads should never be created, such incidents should never be noted?
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If the option is between the idiocy of overreaction this kind of crap gets or these things happening and not being noted...I'd go with not noted every single time.
 
snilloctjc said:
Perhaps you should read about the lives of the "founders" beyond their role in forming the nation. Many had key roles within their respective state assemblies/legislatures as well.

Memory may be wrong, but if it isn't, didn't Jefferson introduce legislation in the Virginia Assembly to abolish slavery, and if I am not mistaken he was supported by Madison and Mason. The bill was defeated. Also others - maybe Hamilton - lead abolutionist efforts in NY, including something to protect slaves that were freed (manumition?) by their owners had their rights protected and were not illicitly re-enslaved?

Don't know if tirelessly is correct, but at least in Virginia it was a bold position to take at the time

Not to mention the work and advocay of John Adams on this issue - not John Q. :)
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You should read for yourself. The founders efforts as a group were decidedly mixed. They should not be discredited on the basis of slavery, but they weren't saints either. It is this nuance that she lacks. The inability to see things in full color. Combined with her other crazy talk, it adds to the picture of her mental capacity toward charting a course for a nation of the greatest complexity. Again, I reiterate, this is entirely relevant to hers or anyone's worthiness of being president.
 
Dezaad said:
You should read for yourself.

I read extensively thank you very much, and quite a bit of that is in the field of US History

The founders efforts as a group were decidedly mixed.

of course they were, so were the positions of the people in positions of power that were not "founders"

They should not be discredited on the basis of slavery, but they weren't saints either.

I don't recall calling them saints, nor is that a position I hold - they were men, very bright, educated and dedcicated men to be sure, but mere mortals in the end.

It is this nuance that she lacks. The inability to see things in full color. Combined with her other crazy talk, it adds to the picture of her mental capacity toward charting a course for a nation of the greatest complexity. Again, I reiterate, this is entirely relevant to hers or anyone's worthiness of being president.
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Many a brilliant person in history came across as dumb in public settings. I have no opinion on her "nuance, or inability to see things in full color, for me I am still learning about her. I agree it is relative, but isolated statements are no measurement tool.
 
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CaptainCourtesy said:
And Bachman, a Presidential candidate, doesn't know that J.Q Adams was not only NOT a founding father, but was born LONG after the founding fathers founding this country. So, what do each of these things prove? Just that partisan hacks on each side will make big deals out of them because they are... partisan hacks.
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I believe that John Quincy accompanied his father to France.
 
Sgt Meowenstein said:
Looks like Bachmann's handlers need to give her some more history lessons. The woman is an idiot.
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No, she absolutely positively is not an idiot. You don't get to where she's gotten by being an idiot, and this is no dumber than 57 states or inventing the Internet or any number of other gaffes uttered by top-ranking politicians on both sides of the isle over the years.

My concern with this slip-up is the fact that she didn't go "whoops" or "what I'm trying to say is" or something like that. She just dug her heels in. I'm okay with that in a Congresscritter, but not so much with a President. I'm sure Presidents do that. I'm sure Obama does it. I'm just saying I don't like that in an executive figure.

That said, I'm definitely going to vote for her if Palin doesn't run.



TED,
Committed to voting for the candidate with the greatest entertainment value. :lol:
 
Doesn't matter, Jackson can't hold the office, so I won't vote for him.

...

If he could hold the office, and he was on the ballot, you bet your sweet ass I would. :lol:
 
Your Star said:
The thing I don't like is that she won't admit to the mistake. She would get some respect from me for that.
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Same for both women.

And on the CC/Kor front - dudes. This is an internet forum. It is very, VERY rare that this board actually talks about anything important without it immediately degenerating into the left/right version of "he said/she said." So yeah. People can go on for 2000 posts about Palin's Revere idiocy. If they didn't, some poor OCD soul somewhere wouldn't have anybody to talk to. No, it's not rocket science. But if I wasn't posting whatever I post, I'd be playing WoW.
 
pbrauer said:
Obama made the gaffe in Beaverton, Oregon; he had visited three states that day on the campaign; he was understandably very tired. What's Michele Bachmann's excuse?
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How about "corpsmen"? How about "breathalyzer"? how about seeing the ghosts of dead soldiers at a memorial day ceremony? How about the Austrian "language"?



Serious hacks are serious. :roll:
 
CaptainCourtesy said:
And Bachman, a Presidential candidate, doesn't know that J.Q Adams was not only NOT a founding father, but was born LONG after the founding fathers founding this country. So, what do each of these things prove? Just that partisan hacks on each side will make big deals out of them because they are... partisan hacks.
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July 11, 1767 Just sayin.... :shrug:
 
Well, he is right. She's not an idiot. She's psychotic.
 
LesGovt said:
She gave a dumb answer. It's about as dumb as "57 states." Both are incorrect and dumb statements, but if one doesn't disqualify a candidate from being President, then the other one doesn't either. I think you liberals should give up the chase. Your candidate leads the parade. And let's not forget the current VEEP too. Woof!

Maybe this is just evidence that American History should be better taught in schools and those schools should be public, private, and parochial.
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Well the question you should ask yourself is this. If someone brought up to Obama later his comment about 57 States, do you think he'd double down or do you think he's say "I misspoke" and explain that there are only 50 states in the Republic?
 
CaptainCourtesy said:
My job around here is to point out the partisan hacks, hackish comments and positions, and hypocrisy... the last of which I demonstrated that you committed. Keeps me busy and off the streets.
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That's funny, I thought your job here was to be an unbiased moderator, not to derail threads by calling people hacks. Whatever.
 
TacticalEvilDan said:
No, she absolutely positively is not an idiot. You don't get to where she's gotten by being an idiot, and this is no dumber than 57 states or inventing the Internet or any number of other gaffes uttered by top-ranking politicians on both sides of the isle over the years.

My concern with this slip-up is the fact that she didn't go "whoops" or "what I'm trying to say is" or something like that. She just dug her heels in. I'm okay with that in a Congresscritter, but not so much with a President. I'm sure Presidents do that. I'm sure Obama does it. I'm just saying I don't like that in an executive figure.

That said, I'm definitely going to vote for her if Palin doesn't run.



TED,
Committed to voting for the candidate with the greatest entertainment value. :lol:
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You sound confused. You say it's no different than the 57 states thing, then criticize her for not backing down. Obama made the 57 states remark after campaigning and traveling around the country nonstop. He was tired and misspoke. You don't honestly believe that Obama thinks there are 57 states, do you? Bachmann actually believes the crap she's selling. Now do you see the difference?
 
Sgt Meowenstein said:
You sound confused. You say it's no different than the 57 states thing, then criticize her for not backing down. Obama made the 57 states remark after campaigning and traveling around the country nonstop. He was tired and misspoke. You don't honestly believe that Obama thinks there are 57 states, do you? Bachmann actually believes the crap she's selling. Now do you see the difference?
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How about the "austrian"'language? Or "corps-man"?
 
Sgt Meowenstein said:
You sound confused. You say it's no different than the 57 states thing, then criticize her for not backing down. Obama made the 57 states remark after campaigning and traveling around the country nonstop. He was tired and misspoke. You don't honestly believe that Obama thinks there are 57 states, do you? Bachmann actually believes the crap she's selling. Now do you see the difference?
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ReverendHellh0und said:
How about the "austrian"'language? Or "corps-man"?
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As bolded. Can you see the difference.
 
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