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Obama to speak on birth certificate

ptif219 said:
It took years. Explain exactly what Obama did to get Bin Laden
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He gave the order.

According to you, the information was gathered while Bush was president -- why didn't he give the order?
 
Total politicall BS.

ptif219 said:
Yet the intell that gave us Bin Laden came during Bush presidency through interrogation practices Obama was against.

Bin Laden death rekindles torture debate - Yahoo! News
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McCain: Torture did not lead to bin Laden death
Thu May 12, 2011 10:52 AM EDT
us-news, politics, us, torture, bin-laden, laden, senate-armed-services-committees
Donna Cassata , Associated Press

WASHINGTON — Waterboarding and other harsh interrogation techniques were not a factor in tracking down Osama bin Laden, a leading Republican senator insisted Thursday.

Sen. John McCain, who spent 5 1/2 years as a prisoner of war in North Vietnam, also rejected the argument that any form of torture is critical to U.S. success in the fight against terrorism.

In an impassioned speech on the Senate floor, the Arizona Republican said former Attorney General Michael Mukasey and others who back those tactics were wrong to claim that waterboarding al-Qaida's No. 3 leader, Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, provided information that led to bin Laden's compound in Pakistan.

McCain spoke with an unrivaled record on the issue.

He's the top Republican on the Senate Armed Services Committee, the 2008 GOP presidential nominee who consistently challenged the Bush administration and Vice President Dick Cheney on the use of torture and a man who endured brutal treatment during the Vietnam War.

He also made many of his points in an opinion piece in The Washington Post.

McCain said he asked CIA Director Leon Panetta for the facts, and that the hunt for bin Laden did not begin with fresh information from Mohammed. In fact, the name of bin Laden's courier, Abu Ahmed al-Kuwaiti, came from a detainee held in another country.
 
ptif219 said:
Yet the intell that gave us Bin Laden came during Bush presidency through interrogation practices Obama was against.

Bin Laden death rekindles torture debate - Yahoo! News
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From your link:

And experts have long warned about the unreliability of information obtained under duress. "Nobody with a nickel's worth of intelligence goes off, after torturing somebody, runs off and acts on that information," said Shayana Kadidal of the Center for Constitutional Rights.

Tracking down bin Laden at his secret lair, from where the Al-Qaeda leader never ventured out and took extreme precautions to avoid detection, required information from a "mosaic of sources," said Attorney General Eric Holder.

With Republicans claiming the killing of bin Laden justifies the Bush administration's controversial anti-terror tactics, which Obama has largely rejected, outraging those eager to put to rest a debate that left a stain on the national conscience.

"It's disheartening to see conversation already turning to old, old debates about interrogation," said Deborah Pearlstein of Princeton University on the "Opinio Juris" blog, regretting what she called a "fruitless conversation."

"Put differently, for every 'maybe some guy in Gitmo said something useful' story, there's a 'some guy in Gitmo said something false that led us to war in Iraq' story."
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We can find information to refute your opinions ourselves, but, thanks for saving us the trouble.
 
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Defenders of the Bush administration’s interrogation policies have claimed vindication from reports that bin Laden was tracked down in small part due to information received from brutalized detainees some six to eight years ago.

But that sequence of events -- even if true -- doesn’t demonstrate the effectiveness of torture, these experts say. Rather, it indicates bin Laden could have been caught much earlier had those detainees been interrogated properly.

"I think that without a doubt, torture and enhanced interrogation techniques slowed down the hunt for bin Laden," said an Air Force interrogator who goes by the pseudonym Matthew Alexander and located Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, the leader of al Qaeda in Iraq, in 2006.

It now appears likely that several detainees had information about a key al Qaeda courier -- information that might have led authorities directly to bin Laden years ago. But subjected to physical and psychological brutality, "they gave us the bare minimum amount of information they could get away with to get the pain to stop, or to mislead us,"
 
Dirty Harry said:
Total politicall BS.



McCain: Torture did not lead to bin Laden death
Thu May 12, 2011 10:52 AM EDT
us-news, politics, us, torture, bin-laden, laden, senate-armed-services-committees
Donna Cassata , Associated Press

WASHINGTON — Waterboarding and other harsh interrogation techniques were not a factor in tracking down Osama bin Laden, a leading Republican senator insisted Thursday.

Sen. John McCain, who spent 5 1/2 years as a prisoner of war in North Vietnam, also rejected the argument that any form of torture is critical to U.S. success in the fight against terrorism.

In an impassioned speech on the Senate floor, the Arizona Republican said former Attorney General Michael Mukasey and others who back those tactics were wrong to claim that waterboarding al-Qaida's No. 3 leader, Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, provided information that led to bin Laden's compound in Pakistan.

McCain spoke with an unrivaled record on the issue.

He's the top Republican on the Senate Armed Services Committee, the 2008 GOP presidential nominee who consistently challenged the Bush administration and Vice President Dick Cheney on the use of torture and a man who endured brutal treatment during the Vietnam War.

He also made many of his points in an opinion piece in The Washington Post.

McCain said he asked CIA Director Leon Panetta for the facts, and that the hunt for bin Laden did not begin with fresh information from Mohammed. In fact, the name of bin Laden's courier, Abu Ahmed al-Kuwaiti, came from a detainee held in another country.
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McCain LOL thats funny
 
Dittohead not! said:
The information gained here? Where is here? This forum? your link?
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The link. Funny how you act stupid when you have no answer. The information gained from interrogations during Bush Presidency that led to watching the couriors that led us to Bin Laden's compound
 
ptif219 said:
The link. Funny how you act stupid when you have no answer. The information gained from interrogations during Bush Presidency that led to watching the couriors that led us to Bin Laden's compound
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Do you even read the links you post? It was a discussion of whether or not "enhanced interrogation" had provided any information. Your link gave no information that led to finding Bin Laden. Part of it (the part I quoted) was diametrically opposed to your point.
 
ptif219 said:
The link. Funny how you act stupid when you have no answer. The information gained from interrogations during Bush Presidency that led to watching the couriors that led us to Bin Laden's compound
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The only people in America who seem to have swallowed that line of 'thinking' have already drunk enough right wing kool-aid to render their thinking processes severely damaged to accepting true objective facts that do not come from far right sources. The rest of the nation is lining up and giving the President the credit he is entitled to. The far right True Believers concocted this fantasy as a way of allowing them to cling to their self induced belief system without incurring mental damage due to having to do Olympic style mental gymnastics.
 
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Dittohead not! said:
Do you even read the links you post? It was a discussion of whether or not "enhanced interrogation" had provided any information. Your link gave no information that led to finding Bin Laden. Part of it (the part I quoted) was diametrically opposed to your point.
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From my link

Key intelligence over the identity of a courier -- among the few men bin Laden trusted -- who passed messages from the terror chief to commanders in the field ultimately led US agents to his secured compound in the Pakistani garrison town of Abbottabad.

Detainees held at secret CIA "black sites," or prisons, told interrogators after the September 11, 2001 attacks on the United States about the courier known as Abu Ahmed al-Kuwaiti.

Kuwaiti was identified as a protege of Khalid Sheikh Mohammed and an assistant of Abu Faraj al-Libbi, another key Qaeda operative.

The two senior Al-Qaeda leaders may have acknowledged knowing the courier after being subjected to waterboarding, or simulated drowning, and other so-called "enhanced interrogation techniques."
 
haymarket said:
The only people in America who seem to have swallowed that line of 'thinking' have already drunk enough right wing kool-aid to render their thinking processes severely damaged to accepting true objective facts that do not come from far right sources. The rest of the nation is lining up and giving the President the credit he is entitled to. The far right True Believers concocted this fantasy as a way of allowing them to cling to their self induced belief system without incurring mental damage due to having to do Olympic style mental gymnastics.
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So show exactly what Obama did to make this happen and where his information came from.
 
ptif219 said:
So show exactly what Obama did to make this happen and where his information came from.
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You want me to show you top secret classified information available only to the highest levels of the US government?

Sorry, but I live in the real world where such things would be considered illegal breaches of national security and crimes against the government and the people it represents. As a patriot and American I am loathe to even consider such traitorous conduct and it sickens me to think that other Americans would stoop so low as to use such a request for petty partisan purposes.
 
haymarket said:
You want me to show you top secret classified information available only to the highest levels of the US government?

Sorry, but I live in the real world where such things would be considered illegal breaches of national security and crimes against the government and the people it represents. As a patriot and American I am loathe to even consider such traitorous conduct and it sickens me to think that other Americans would stoop so low as to use such a request for petty partisan purposes.
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oh the drama. what you are saying is that you don't know and you don't have any information available.
 
haymarket said:
You want me to show you top secret classified information available only to the highest levels of the US government?

Sorry, but I live in the real world where such things would be considered illegal breaches of national security and crimes against the government and the people it represents. As a patriot and American I am loathe to even consider such traitorous conduct and it sickens me to think that other Americans would stoop so low as to use such a request for petty partisan purposes.
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Good excuse. Another words you have no proof of anything Obama did to make this happen
 
TurtleDude said:
oh the drama. what you are saying is that you don't know and you don't have any information available.
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What I am saying is that the post I answered was was completely devoid of any actual rational point and was only a impotent exercise in extremist political hackery displaying a hatred of the President based on an extremist belief system fueled by hatred of the President. Its a right wing perpetual motion machine.
 
ptif219 said:
Good excuse. Another words you have no proof of anything Obama did to make this happen
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Check the date of when it happened and check when you boy Bush stopped being President. You might note a few years between those two events. Rational Americans care about such things.
 
haymarket said:
Check the date of when it happened and check when you boy Bush stopped being President. You might note a few years between those two events. Rational Americans care about such things.
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Correct but the information that led up to getting Bin Laden came during Bush you have shown no proof Obama did anything.
 
ptif219 said:
Correct but the information that led up to getting Bin Laden came during Bush you have shown no proof Obama did anything.
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Do you mean Bin Laden accepting credit for 911?
 
ptif219 said:
No I mean the information the CIA got during interrogations that happened during Bush Presidency
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Hmm, what information was that?
 
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