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Late Clash on Abortion Shows Conservatives’ Sway

And I would disagree, especially since they are committing no murders.

abortion = premeditated murder of an unborn child...

If Planned Parenthood provides abortion services, then thay are, in fact, committing murders...

Again, if they want federal funding, get out of the baby murder business...
 
abortion = premeditated murder of an unborn child...

If Planned Parenthood provides abortion services, then thay are, in fact, committing murders...

Again, if they want federal funding, get out of the baby murder business...

I love arguing with you anti-choicers on issue such as this. Using the word "murder" is nothing but a silly appeal to emotion logical fallacy. I'm sure you know what the word murder means. It is a legal term. Since abortion is legal, your terminology fails as does your argument.
 
They will be born and live the life that their parents can manage for it. Do I win something?

But the thing is the woman does not want the child! So if money for poor women seeking abortions are not funded what do you think will happen? Do we really wanna go back to the days of cheap back alley abortions, women killing themselves and the fetus by drinking Drano? Do you wish to live in that kind of world?

This is nothing more than folks trying to cut funding based on morals and not looking at the big picture. Not to mention a sneaky way to see if this would go over well and test the waters to try to overthrow a womans right to an abortion. I am on to this sneak tactic and the folks are not gonna go along with it buster.
 
But the thing is the woman does not want the child! So if money for poor women seeking abortions are not funded what do you think will happen? Do we really wanna go back to the days of cheap back alley abortions, women killing themselves and the fetus by drinking Drano? Do you wish to live in that kind of world?

This is nothing more than folks trying to cut funding based on morals and not looking at the big picture. Not to mention a sneaky way to see if this would go over well and test the waters to try to overthrow a womans right to an abortion. I am on to this sneak tactic and the folks are not gonna go along with it buster.

Like I said, Kali. His response was an overly simplistic answer to a very complex question.
 
Yes. An award for the most overly simplistic response to a complex question.

What am I supposed to say? That life isn't always golden? That being born and being allowed to live your life no matter how bad is better than being put down? What am I supposed to say here that would please you?
 
I love arguing with you anti-choicers on issue such as this. Using the word "murder" is nothing but a silly appeal to emotion logical fallacy. I'm sure you know what the word murder means. It is a legal term. Since abortion is legal, your terminology fails as does your argument.

Look, I know what murder means. I am not going to get into an argument with you over this. We are free to agree to disagree.

However, it IS against God's law. Thus, I consider this to be murder.

Also, I am not anti-choice. Women have the choice when they engage in the sexual act in the first place. Your terminology is simply a pathetic appeal to emotion which does nothing to enhance your argument.

Let's agree to disagree on this... I really don't want to rehash this argument today... I have a marathon tomorrow and need to focus on that...
 
I would say that I am pro-choice. And I do not support federally funding of abortions. I do support funding of Planned Parenthood because they provide far more services than abortions. Having assisted people in obtaining services there, and having never assisted anyone in obtaining an abortion through PP, I can speak pretty authoritatively on that.

As far as I am concerned so long as it is providing people with abortions it should not get government money at all. One third of its budget comes from government money. Maybe removing them from the spigot will cause them to evaluate whether even a business as lucrative as slaughtering babies is worth the loss of hundreds of millions of dollars.
 
I love arguing with you anti-choicers on issue such as this. Using the word "murder" is nothing but a silly appeal to emotion logical fallacy. I'm sure you know what the word murder means. It is a legal term. Since abortion is legal, your terminology fails as does your argument.
What you refer to as "a silly appeal to emotion" is how we see it. It's he destruction of an actual baby. Is it too unreasonable and emotional to oppose that? BTW, if you're going to call us anti-choice, is it ok if I call you pro-abortion?
 
What am I supposed to say? That life isn't always golden? That being born and being allowed to live your life no matter how bad is better than being put down? What am I supposed to say here that would please you?

You might want to try to look at the big picture, here. Actions have consequences, consequences that affect more than just the individual. More unwanted children means more possible abuse... or more need for social services... or more individuals with monetary issues... or more issues with health care, etc... This is not just an issue of what one's parents can manage. If one's parents cannot manage, which does occur, society as a whole is impacted, both in local and global ways. It is far more complex than a simple answer. Those who want to outlaw abortion need to present some sort of plan for managing the amount of unwanted children that will then be presented. Without a plan addressing that issue, those who want abortion ended are not really addressing the problem at all. All they are doing is trying to legislate their own morality, having zero consideration on the global impact.

So, to answer your question, precisely, give us your SPECIFIC plan of how society should then deal with all the unwanted children that a policy of no abortions will yeild.
 
Look, I know what murder means. I am not going to get into an argument with you over this. We are free to agree to disagree.

However, it IS against God's law. Thus, I consider this to be murder.

Also, I am not anti-choice. Women have the choice when they engage in the sexual act in the first place. Your terminology is simply a pathetic appeal to emotion which does nothing to enhance your argument.

Let's agree to disagree on this... I really don't want to rehash this argument today... I have a marathon tomorrow and need to focus on that...

That's fine. Enjoy your marathon.
 
And I would disagree, especially since they are committing no murders.

Wrong, abortion doctors and clinics commit murder all the time and get away with it for YEARS.

West Philadelphia abortion doctor Kermit Gosnell routinely delivered live babies in the third trimester of pregnancy, then murdered them by "sticking scissors into the back of the baby's neck and cutting the spinal cord," according to the Philadelphia District Attorney.

Gruesome details in report on Philadelphia abortion doctor | Philadelphia Inquirer | 01/19/2011

An abortion doctor who catered to minorities, immigrants and poor women was charged with eight counts of murder in the deaths of a patient and seven babies who were born alive and then killed with scissors, prosecutors said Wednesday.

Dr. Kermit Gosnell, 69, made millions of dollars over 30 years, performing as many illegal, late-term abortions as he could, prosecutors said. State regulators ignored complaints about him and failed to visit or inspect his clinic since 1993, but no charges were warranted against them, District Attorney Seth Williams said.

Philadelphia Abortion Doctor Charged With 8 Counts of Murder - FoxNews.com
 
The most radical social conservative elements, really terrorists amongst us, have tried to bring America to its knees. They failed but they were far too close to succeeding.

When you say stupid **** like this, you give ammo that some on the right will try and use against all of us. It will fail, but still. Advocating for what you believe in is not terrorism.
 
What you refer to as "a silly appeal to emotion" is how we see it. It's he destruction of an actual baby. Is it too unreasonable and emotional to oppose that? BTW, if you're going to call us anti-choice, is it ok if I call you pro-abortion?

1) It is an appeal to emotion. It's not murder, no matter how you slice it. I am uninterested if that is how you see it. It is presenting a logical fallacy and I will confront anyone I see who uses it. I've done it before to Chuz Life and Hicup. You want to use the word "kill", and you will have no problem with me. Murder is incorrect.

2) I use the term "anti-choice" specifically when I see someone posting the term "pro-abortion". They are both idiot terms and do not reflect how each side presents themselves. Someone in this thread used the term. I will back off from continuing to use MY idiot term as a response until I see it again.
 
The most radical social conservative elements, really terrorists amongst us, have tried to bring America to its knees. They failed but they were far too close to succeeding.

Mayor Snorkum is willing to bet money this guy would be screaming a bloody fit about bigotry, stereotyping, and hatred if anyone posted that all muslims are terrorists, however, he feels perfectly at ease in labelling as "terrorist" all those who oppose the murder of the unborn child, even though 99.9999% of them view the problem as one to be solved at the ballot box, not the target range.
 
Wrong, abortion doctors and clinics commit murder all the time and get away with it for YEARS.

West Philadelphia abortion doctor Kermit Gosnell routinely delivered live babies in the third trimester of pregnancy, then murdered them by "sticking scissors into the back of the baby's neck and cutting the spinal cord," according to the Philadelphia District Attorney.

Gruesome details in report on Philadelphia abortion doctor | Philadelphia Inquirer | 01/19/2011

An abortion doctor who catered to minorities, immigrants and poor women was charged with eight counts of murder in the deaths of a patient and seven babies who were born alive and then killed with scissors, prosecutors said Wednesday.

Dr. Kermit Gosnell, 69, made millions of dollars over 30 years, performing as many illegal, late-term abortions as he could, prosecutors said. State regulators ignored complaints about him and failed to visit or inspect his clinic since 1993, but no charges were warranted against them, District Attorney Seth Williams said.

Philadelphia Abortion Doctor Charged With 8 Counts of Murder - FoxNews.com

I'm not talking about acts that are actually illegal. These WOULD be considered murders, as they are being done during the 3rd trimester, something that I believe is illegal. I'm talking about abortions that are legal. They are not murder.
 
As far as I am concerned so long as it is providing people with abortions it should not get government money at all. One third of its budget comes from government money. Maybe removing them from the spigot will cause them to evaluate whether even a business as lucrative as slaughtering babies is worth the loss of hundreds of millions of dollars.

Nice to find we have something we can agree on... :)
 
When you say stupid **** like this, you give ammo that some on the right will try and use against all of us. It will fail, but still. Advocating for what you believe in is not terrorism.

Hes from San Francisco represented by tunacan Nan Pelosi I would expect nothing less lol...shrug that kind of stuff doesnt effect me and It certainly doesnt reflect on other liberals and their position as far as im concerned anyway...
 
Wrong, abortion doctors and clinics commit murder all the time and get away with it for YEARS.

West Philadelphia abortion doctor Kermit Gosnell routinely delivered live babies in the third trimester of pregnancy, then murdered them by "sticking scissors into the back of the baby's neck and cutting the spinal cord," according to the Philadelphia District Attorney.

Gruesome details in report on Philadelphia abortion doctor | Philadelphia Inquirer | 01/19/2011

An abortion doctor who catered to minorities, immigrants and poor women was charged with eight counts of murder in the deaths of a patient and seven babies who were born alive and then killed with scissors, prosecutors said Wednesday.

Dr. Kermit Gosnell, 69, made millions of dollars over 30 years, performing as many illegal, late-term abortions as he could, prosecutors said. State regulators ignored complaints about him and failed to visit or inspect his clinic since 1993, but no charges were warranted against them, District Attorney Seth Williams said.

Philadelphia Abortion Doctor Charged With 8 Counts of Murder - FoxNews.com

I'm not pro-choice or pro-abortion, but it seems that those individuals have been made to answer for their actions and what they did was clearly violated the bounds of what is considered a legal abortion.
 
Well, to be fair, it could be called murder...if murder didn't have the meaning it does have.
 
As far as I am concerned so long as it is providing people with abortions it should not get government money at all. One third of its budget comes from government money. Maybe removing them from the spigot will cause them to evaluate whether even a business as lucrative as slaughtering babies is worth the loss of hundreds of millions of dollars.

Disagree. They're funding should not be pulled. They should be restricted from using that funding for abortions... this I would support.
 
Well, to be fair, it could be called murder...if murder didn't have the meaning it does have.

And steak could be called fencing... if steak didn't have the meaning that it does have.
 
1
2) I use the term "anti-choice" specifically when I see someone posting the term "pro-abortion". They are both idiot terms and do not reflect how each side presents themselves. Someone in this thread used the term. I will back off from continuing to use MY idiot term as a response until I see it again.

I am going to bail from this thread for now, but I just want the record to show that I did not use the term "pro-abortion"...
 
What am I supposed to say? That life isn't always golden? That being born and being allowed to live your life no matter how bad is better than being put down? What am I supposed to say here that would please you?

The problem here is you apply logic where none exist for the life you strive to protect. In other words, the unborn child has no idea how "its" life will turn out. It has no choices at this early stage of its as to how to survive, provide for nor protect itself. Nor does it know how to make its way through life on its own. The child, at the very least, is completely dependent on atleast the one who bore it - the mother. You'd have a stronger argument if you had said, "That the newborn child is given a chance to survive and have a life, good or bad..."

But yes to your original statement. That's pretty much what you should have said because it atleast would indicate you are considerate and compassionate towards the plight of both the parent (mother at a minimum) and the unborn child. You would atleast be arguing to give life a chance but under the proper arguable conditions.
 
I am going to bail from this thread for now, but I just want the record to show that I did not use the term "pro-abortion"...

You are correct... and I retract from addressing that towards you. I apologize. I have to go back and see who did.

Edit: should have known. It was jamesrage.
 
I'm not talking about acts that are actually illegal. These WOULD be considered murders, as they are being done during the 3rd trimester, something that I believe is illegal. I'm talking about abortions that are legal. They are not murder.

It happens all the time its UNDERREPORTED by the liberal press...abortion is over used and abused in this country because women are encouraged to abort because theres so many people making millions of taxpayer bucks off it.
 
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