Misbehaving Boy, 8, Pepper Sprayed By Police

apdst said:

That's why my kids's teachers have my permission to light their asses up, if they step out of line. They don't have permission to call the cops in to spray chemicals in their eyes.

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they dont NEED your permission to call the cops and spray chemicals in your kids eyes if your kid acts like this brat did.

In this case the police acted incorrectly. Without a doubt, the child's behavior was outrageous and unacceptable, yet there was no need to pepper spray the child. These are professionals and unless they are rookies, they very well may have had to deal with people who were acting a lot worse than this child. I find it hard to believe that the police found it impossible to subdue the child without using pepper spray.

Mr. Invisible said:

In this case the police acted incorrectly. Without a doubt, the child's behavior was outrageous and unacceptable, yet there was no need to pepper spray the child. These are professionals and unless they are rookies, they very well may have had to deal with people who were acting a lot worse than this child. I find it hard to believe that the police found it impossible to subdue the child without using pepper spray.

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Alright, this has already been addressed ad nauseum, but I'll bite. How would YOU advise subduing smaller-than-adult individual carrying a foot long stabbing weapon, who has already made threatening statements to you and refuses to surrender when asked to do so? Oh, and he also essentially has hostages...


I think the situation was a bit beyond "unacceptable behavior."


There is absolutely NOTHING wrong with using an essentially harmless method to subdue a subject rather than escalating things further by attempting physical force.

Mr. Invisible said:

In this case the police acted incorrectly. Without a doubt, the child's behavior was outrageous and unacceptable, yet there was no need to pepper spray the child. These are professionals and unless they are rookies, they very well may have had to deal with people who were acting a lot worse than this child. I find it hard to believe that the police found it impossible to subdue the child without using pepper spray.

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the only other "less forceful" option would have been to lay hands on the little bastard and subdue him. since he was wielding a weapon, this would have put both him and the cops at risk of physical injury. pepper spray or taser were the only two viable options. the cops acted correctly in using the least amount of force that would effectively end the situation without putting anyone at undue risk.

moral of the story: if you don't want the cops to be OC spraying your kid, teach the little bastard how to behave properly.

theangryamerican said:

Alright, this has already been addressed ad nauseum, but I'll bite. How would YOU advise subduing smaller-than-adult individual carrying a foot long stabbing weapon, who has already made threatening statements to you and refuses to surrender when asked to do so? Oh, and he also essentially has hostages...





There is absolutely NOTHING wrong with using an essentially harmless method to subdue a subject rather than escalating things further by attempting physical force.

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'

Over the top rhetoric.

1. The foot long wood is BS

He was also trying to allegedly stab them with wood trim he had broken off the walls.

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Where does that say it was a foot long?

2. Hostages is also BS

Police in suburban Denver are defending their use of pepper spray on an 8-year-old boy they say was throwing a violent tantrum at school.

Denver's KUSA-TV reported Tuesday that the boy had allegedly been spitting and cursing at teachers February 22 at Glennon Heights Elementary in Lakewood.

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Mr. Invisible said:

'

Over the top rhetoric.

1. The foot long wood is BS



Where does that say it was a foot long?

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yeah, for all you know it could've been 2,3 or even 4 feet long. you can bet your ass it wasn't a ****ing toothpick

2. Hostages is also BS

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I do agree that calling the teachers hostages it a bit over the top.

Mr. Invisible said:

'

Over the top rhetoric.

1. The foot long wood is BS



Where does that say it was a foot long?

2. Hostages is also BS

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Alright, I concede the hostages was a bit over the top, since they were safely locked in a closet. But the police are the ones that stated the piece of wood was over a foot long, so I take that at face value. So, care to state how YOU would handle the situation, sir?

Mr invisible, check back around post 15 or 20 I think. A more detailed story was posted. It included the fact that the wooden object was described by the police as a foot long piece of wooden trim with a knife like point. It notes the child was throwing things, including a tv. It also stated that housed a cart to try and bust down the door to the room the teacher had taken the kids into after attempts to calm the kid failed

apdst said:

I have a special needs kid that has two, or three episodes a year. We've never had to resort to this level of force to get her under control. This hits alot closer to home than you think it does.

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And I work in a hospital and have worked in juvenile facilities where kids like this can get seriously hurt by physically restraining them. Care providers get sued because its damn near impossible to use soft restraint techniques on an adolescent without causing harm.

And frankly...your credibility suffers when you state that the cops would have been better off grabing the kid by the arm and beating his ass. Do you know the physical damage that can be caused by merely grabbing an out of control child by the arm? Followed by an ass beating? Really? And thats the cops role? And that beating would have gotten more of an outcry?

apdst said:

Do you understand the difference between a spanking and a beating?

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Sure. Now..son...come here...bend over. I know this is going to hurt me worse than its going to hurt you. no...stop wrtihing around son...Im just going to...son...now...stop...dont bite you little basta...sonova...now...SON...Im telling you...no...Im ORDERING you to calm down and take your spankin...put that stapler down....

You and reality arent friends in this situation. I think you spoke off the cuff from the get go and wont back down just cuz....

theangryamerican said:

Alright, I concede the hostages was a bit over the top, since they were safely locked in a closet. But the police are the ones that stated the piece of wood was over a foot long, so I take that at face value. So, care to state how YOU would handle the situation, sir?

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A quote from the article you posted on the 2nd page of the topic:

"It wasn't the first time officers had been called to pacify Aidan, Davis said. They'd been able to talk him down in two other incidents."

Personally, I would have tried talking to the kid. See if there was something he wanted, see if there was some type of deal that could be brokered.

Now if that failed and the cops then used the pepper spray, I wouldn't have had a problem.

MaggieD said:

Occurs to me we would be having a different discussion had the boy had a fatal allergic reaction to its active ingredient. The NYC PD reports that allergic reactions happen to 1 out of 100. (That's "reactions", not fatal reactions.)http://www.nyc.gov/html/ccrb/pdf/pepperreport.pdf

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We'd also be having a different discussion if the cop grabbed the kid who then spun around causing a spiral fracture, or by merely attempting to hold him choked the kid, or the kid ended up with torn ligaments or rotator cuff damage from simple restraint techniques.

VanceMack said:

And I work in a hospital and have worked in juvenile facilities where kids like this can get seriously hurt by physically restraining them. Care providers get sued because its damn near impossible to use soft restraint techniques on an adolescent without causing harm.

And frankly...your credibility suffers when you state that the cops would have been better off grabing the kid by the arm and beating his ass. Do you know the physical damage that can be caused by merely grabbing an out of control child by the arm? Followed by an ass beating? Really? And thats the cops role? And that beating would have gotten more of an outcry?

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I love how he stats he'd be perfectly fine with an ass beating by cops for his kids, but he'd go after the cops if they dared pepper spray his precious child. :rofl:

Mr. Invisible said:

A quote from the article you posted on the 2nd page of the topic:

"It wasn't the first time officers had been called to pacify Aidan, Davis said. They'd been able to talk him down in two other incidents."

Personally, I would have tried talking to the kid. See if there was something he wanted, see if there was some type of deal that could be brokered.

Now if that failed and the cops then used the pepper spray, I wouldn't have had a problem.

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and you know they did not try that this time because??? How, exactly do you know they did not try?

Whovian said:

I love how he stats he'd be perfectly fine with an ass beating by cops for his kids, but he'd go after the cops if they dared pepper spray his precious child. :rofl:

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He's a good guy...I think he just bet a huge stack of chips on a pair of dueces and is riding out the bet. All thats left at that point is going all in...

Mr. Invisible said:

A quote from the article you posted on the 2nd page of the topic:

"It wasn't the first time officers had been called to pacify Aidan, Davis said. They'd been able to talk him down in two other incidents."

Personally, I would have tried talking to the kid. See if there was something he wanted, see if there was some type of deal that could be brokered.

Now if that failed and the cops then used the pepper spray, I wouldn't have had a problem.

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That story also said that they pepper sprayed only after they couldnt calm the kid down implying that the cops did try to talk him down first

He was wielding a weapon. They'd have been justified in shooting him and we'd all be better off for it.

The police showed admirable restraint.

If the parents had spanked the litle **** there probably wouldn't be a problem..

Mr. Invisible said:

A quote from the article you posted on the 2nd page of the topic:

"It wasn't the first time officers had been called to pacify Aidan, Davis said. They'd been able to talk him down in two other incidents."

Personally, I would have tried talking to the kid. See if there was something he wanted, see if there was some type of deal that could be brokered.

Now if that failed and the cops then used the pepper spray, I wouldn't have had a problem.

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Both the actual article and several other posters have now mentioned to you that the police attempted to talk to the kid and defuse the situation before spraying him. This was very clear. Please feel free to recant your position now. :2razz:

I don't get you people. We want to blame the faculty. We want to blame the parent. We want to find a way where one can be absolved at the expense of the other. How about we think more clearly on this....

First of all, the faculty is so scared of being sued that they are willing to cater to the youngsters. The parents are too scared of not being liked that they cater to the youngsters. This is the fault of political correctness and the "sparing of the rod & time-out" fury that became so obsessively famous throughout the 1990s. Witness the result. Furthermore, if this generation's young parents are ****, it would be eye opening to also acknowledging that the same young teachers come from the same "time-out" generation.

So how about we start looking at the pathetic decline in responsibility and integrity in today's America that has absolutely done its best to strangle the living **** out of our education system and parenting.

But we won't do that will we? We will find a way through the courts to award the parent for her horrible parenting and complete lack of values, reward the child for his horrible behavior, force the police into handcuffs so as to ensure the further degredation of our future generations.

Oh and don't think this starts at the bottom. We have a government full of fulls that are more than willing to **** a large portion of this nation out of pay checks just to behave much like this 8 year old. So should we even expect any integrity at all below the halls of Washington?

Way to think small dip ****s.

Let’s see, assault with a deadly weapon (spitting at the teacher, brandishing the shiv at her, the cops and the other kids), causing property damage and resisting arrest. Any other crimes that I missed?

So…when is the state prosecuting the mother for her child’s actions? Are the teacher, the school, and/or the parents of the other kids going to sue this bitch's stupid ass? What are Colorado's laws regarding 35th trimester abortions?

Viktyr Korimir said:

He was wielding a weapon. They'd have been justified in shooting him and we'd all be better off for it.

The police showed admirable restraint.

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true, they will probably wind up having to shoot him in about 10 years. hopefully before he kills someone.

This is an excellent video about self defense, and especially how to defend yourself against someone with a pointed stick.

Whovian said:

and you know they did not try that this time because??? How, exactly do you know they did not try?

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A quote from that same article

"It wasn't the first time officers had been called to pacify Aidan, Davis said. They'd been able to talk him down in two other incidents.

Mandy Elliott said she wished authorities had chosen to talk him down in the latest incident. She also wanted police to get special training in dealing with children. Aidan has since transferred to another school."

Try harder.

Mr. Invisible said:

A quote from that same article

"It wasn't the first time officers had been called to pacify Aidan, Davis said. They'd been able to talk him down in two other incidents.

Mandy Elliott said she wished authorities had chosen to talk him down in the latest incident. She also wanted police to get special training in dealing with children. Aidan has since transferred to another school."

Try harder.

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I guess you missed (or ignored) the multiple posts where people pointed out to you that the officers DID try to talk him down.

For example, post 244...
http://www.debatepolitics.com/breaking-news-mainstream-media/96170-misbehaving-boy-8-pepper-sprayed-police-25.html#post1059397428

Fail.