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Bill Maher tells Rep. Ellison the Quran is a ‘hate-filled holy book’ that inspires

Re: Bill Maher tells Rep. Ellison the Quran is a ‘hate-filled holy book’ that inspire

Yep our ancestors were pure in spirit when they slaughtered thousands/millions? of Native Americans because they were non-Christian savages. Please. Admitting this doesn't mean that you think America is evil anymore than admitting your own faults doesn't mean you think you're evil.


Well, then by all means we should just dismantle it....Have we not evolved from then? Why is it people like you must self flagulate over the events of centuries past instead of use them for what they are intended, learning.

j-mac
 
Re: Bill Maher tells Rep. Ellison the Quran is a ‘hate-filled holy book’ that inspire

Well, then by all means we should just dismantle it....Have we not evolved from then? Why is it people like you must self flagulate over the events of centuries past instead of use them for what they are intended, learning.

j-mac

Nothing that you just said has anything to do with what I posted so...have fun with that.
 
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Re: Bill Maher tells Rep. Ellison the Quran is a ‘hate-filled holy book’ that inspire

Nothing that you just said has anything to do with I posted so...have fun with that.

You're right, I took it to its logical conclusion, or a logical conclusion....I guess that escapes you.


j-mac
 
Re: Bill Maher tells Rep. Ellison the Quran is a ‘hate-filled holy book’ that inspire

You're right, I took it to its logical conclusion, or a logical conclusion....I guess that escapes you.


j-mac

Does this mean that I get to have the last word...
 
Re: Bill Maher tells Rep. Ellison the Quran is a ‘hate-filled holy book’ that inspire

Does this mean that I get to have the last word...


Who gives a .....! Frankly I am bored. Night.


j-mac
 
Re: Bill Maher tells Rep. Ellison the Quran is a ‘hate-filled holy book’ that inspire

Who gives a .....! Frankly I am bored. Night.


j-mac

I'll take that as a "no".
 
Re: Bill Maher tells Rep. Ellison the Quran is a ‘hate-filled holy book’ that inspire

Forgive me if I don't take Andrew C. McCarthy (whoever the **** that is) at his word.

I'm a hard nut (yet respectful to all religions athiest) and my best friend is Muslim...

Andrew McCarthy was one of the federal governments' lead prosecutors against Islamist terrorists back in the 90's; for example, he put the blind sheikh away. He's sort of what you call "a subject matter expert".

as for taking him seriously, he cites the relevant sura's and verses (actually he under counts them) and some of the (nowhere near all of the) relevant Hadith. one that I've always found enlightening is Mohammad saying that any male muslim who died without taking part in a Jihad campaign died in a state similar to that of an infidel. mind you, Mohammad also said that he who committed suicide would spend eternity dying in the manner that he had killed himself, so he might disapprove of some of today's tactics even as he encouraged their general thrust. I notice that you fail to provide any support for your position, instead falling back on some kind of "my best friend is a muslim" shibboleth as though pieties counted for logic.
 
Re: Bill Maher tells Rep. Ellison the Quran is a ‘hate-filled holy book’ that inspire

one that I've always found enlightening is Mohammad saying that any male muslim who died without taking part in a Jihad campaign died in a state similar to that of an infidel.
Trouble is, you don't having a flying notion what jihad really means. If you did, you wouldn't pretend that it necessarily means involvement in violence.

mind you, Mohammad also said that he who committed suicide would spend eternity dying in the manner that he had killed himself, so he might disapprove of some of today's tactics even as he encouraged their general thrust.
He would definitely have had a problem with suicide bombers. That's not Islam, that's desperation.

I notice that you fail to provide any support for your position, instead falling back on some kind of "my best friend is a muslim" shibboleth as though pieties counted for logic.
I'm not seeing any links or sources to back up your interpretation of the Qur'an.
 
Re: Bill Maher tells Rep. Ellison the Quran is a ‘hate-filled holy book’ that inspire

I have one response to this statement.

"The Road To Hell Is Paved With Good Intentions".

and what road do bad ones pave? perhaps we should do no good in the world, for fear of unintended consequences.
 
Re: Bill Maher tells Rep. Ellison the Quran is a ‘hate-filled holy book’ that inspire

Trouble is, you don't having a flying notion what jihad really means. If you did, you wouldn't pretend that it necessarily means involvement in violence.

actually i do, the "oh it means internal struggle" is a modernistic adaptation. for Muhammad - and for the vast majority of Islamic Jurisprudence throughout history - it was overwhelmingly used specifically to reference war against the unbeliever; which, ironically, sometimes included believers (apostasy being the most heinous crime in Islam).

He would definitely have had a problem with suicide bombers. That's not Islam, that's desperation.

the automatic forgiveness of sins and entrance into paradise for any who dies killing those who don't accept your faith is definitely part of Islam.

Just like it was for Christianity.

In the 13th Century.

Suicide becomes the problem; as Lewis succinctly put it, suicide bombers are betting eternity on a theological fine point (that martyrdom automatically washes away the sin of suicide).

I'm not seeing any links or sources to back up your interpretation of the Qur'an.

then you didn't read the post he was responding to
 
Re: Bill Maher tells Rep. Ellison the Quran is a ‘hate-filled holy book’ that inspire

actually i do, the "oh it means internal struggle" is a modernistic adaptation. for Muhammad - and for the vast majority of Islamic Jurisprudence throughout history - it was overwhelmingly used specifically to reference war against the unbeliever; which, ironically, sometimes included believers (apostasy being the most heinous crime in Islam).
Proof? Three authorative sources from Islamic jurisprudence professors should be sufficient back-up for me to take the word of a non-Moslem, non-lawyer, non-academic.

the automatic forgiveness of sins and entrance into paradise for any who dies killing those who don't accept your faith is definitely part of Islam.

Just like it was for Christianity.
As you say, nothing exclusively Islamic about this.

Suicide becomes the problem; as Lewis succinctly put it, suicide bombers are betting eternity on a theological fine point (that martyrdom automatically washes away the sin of suicide).
Yes, can't disagree with this. That's why the real culprits are those who can convince the gullible that their warped interpretation of scripture is the true one.


then you didn't read the post he was responding to

Oh, you mean an opinion piece by a right-wing ideologue. Someone ought to fill you in on methods of academic enquiry.
 
Re: Bill Maher tells Rep. Ellison the Quran is a ‘hate-filled holy book’ that inspire

It's obvious that almost all holy books can be used as tools either for great good or great evil. Otherwise there wouldn't be good/bad Muslims/Chrstians.

The argument that any religion is "pure evil" is absurd.

And don't give me that "all Christians know that the New Testament supersedes the Old Testament" bit, otherwise the Ten Commandments and that so often quoted Leviticus verse wouldn't be a part of mainstream Christianity.
 
Re: Bill Maher tells Rep. Ellison the Quran is a ‘hate-filled holy book’ that inspire

Proof? Three authorative sources from Islamic jurisprudence professors should be sufficient back-up for me to take the word of a non-Moslem, non-lawyer, non-academic.

interesting. i'll have to go back to my books. alright; are you willing to accept the same level of proof for your assertion? three authoritative sources from Islamic history declaring that when the Prophet discussed Jihad he was predominantly not talking about warfare?

As you say, nothing exclusively Islamic about this.

true; just as there is nothing exclusively Chinese about believing in Dragons. But most of the rest of the world has developed past that stage. Islam, it seems, has yet to do so.

Yes, can't disagree with this. That's why the real culprits are those who can convince the gullible that their warped interpretation of scripture is the true one.

:shrug: not sure it's all that warped. wiping out the Jews? check. the fact that there are only two divisions in the world ; dar al Islam and dar al Haarb? check. placing nonbelievers who are people of the book into a state of dhimmitude and killing the rest? check.

Islamism is a modern response to the West and the Enlightenment, but it has deep, deep roots in Islamic culture and jurisprudence.

Oh, you mean an opinion piece by a right-wing ideologue. Someone ought to fill you in on methods of academic enquiry.

:roll: this is what's known as an ad sourcinem attack. the man cited his sources and listed the relevant Sura and Verse. I notice no one else seems very interested in doing the same.
 
Re: Bill Maher tells Rep. Ellison the Quran is a ‘hate-filled holy book’ that inspire

It's obvious that almost all holy books can be used as tools either for great good or great evil. Otherwise there wouldn't be good/bad Muslims/Chrstians.

The argument that any religion is "pure evil" is absurd.

And don't give me that "all Christians know that the New Testament supersedes the Old Testament" bit, otherwise the Ten Commandments and that so often quoted Leviticus verse wouldn't be a part of mainstream Christianity.

in fact the New Testament says specifically and in multiple places that it supercedes the old and that large sections of the Levitical Law are no longer valid.
 
Re: Bill Maher tells Rep. Ellison the Quran is a ‘hate-filled holy book’ that inspire

interesting. i'll have to go back to my books. alright; are you willing to accept the same level of proof for your assertion? three authoritative sources from Islamic history declaring that when the Prophet discussed Jihad he was predominantly not talking about warfare?

How many debates do there have to be before people recognise the logical impossibility of proving a negative. I couldn't possibly do that even if I wished to, which I probably would wish to. Prove Santa Claus doesn't exist.

Argument from ignorance - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

:shrug: not sure it's all that warped. wiping out the Jews? check. the fact that there are only two divisions in the world ; dar al Islam and dar al Haarb? check. placing nonbelievers who are people of the book into a state of dhimmitude and killing the rest? check.

Islamism is a modern response to the West and the Enlightenment, but it has deep, deep roots in Islamic culture and jurisprudence.

That particular logical fallacy is known as a straw man. We were discussing Islam and the Qur'an, not Islamism. You prove nothing by pretending that the point at issue is something that it is not.

Straw man - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

:roll: this is what's known as an ad sourcinem attack. the man cited his sources and listed the relevant Sura and Verse. I notice no one else seems very interested in doing the same.
The word is unchanging, the interpretations are unceasing.
 
Re: Bill Maher tells Rep. Ellison the Quran is a ‘hate-filled holy book’ that inspire

in fact the New Testament says specifically and in multiple places that it supercedes the old and that large sections of the Levitical Law are no longer valid.

So then tell me why so many Christians use this as their justification for demonizing homosexuals

Leviticus 18:22

22 “‘Do not have sexual relations with a man as one does with a woman; that is detestable.
 
Re: Bill Maher tells Rep. Ellison the Quran is a ‘hate-filled holy book’ that inspire

interesting. i'll have to go back to my books. alright; are you willing to accept the same level of proof for your assertion? three authoritative sources from Islamic history declaring that when the Prophet discussed Jihad he was predominantly not talking about warfare?
'Books', AKA an Islamophobic website.

:shrug: not sure it's all that warped. wiping out the Jews? check. the fact that there are only two divisions in the world ; dar al Islam and dar al Haarb? check. placing nonbelievers who are people of the book into a state of dhimmitude and killing the rest? check.
Err, you seem to be extremely ignorant of a relevant history. The only person who has set out on a systematic destruction of the Jewish people is a Christian man named Hitler who said 'by fighting against the Jew, he was doing the Lord's work'.

There are more than two divisions of the world in Islam. Dar al Islam and Dar al Harb are just two. You seem to be forgetting Dar al Hudna, Dar al Ahd, Dar al Amn, and Dar al Dawa.

Islamism is a modern response to the West and the Enlightenment, but it has deep, deep roots in Islamic culture and jurisprudence.
Islam has no culture and you have absolutely no idea what the word jurisprudence means, yet alone how to use it. Are you thinking of Arabic culture? Because Arabs account for 15% of all of Islam.

:roll: this is what's known as an ad sourcinem attack. the man cited his sources and listed the relevant Sura and Verse. I notice no one else seems very interested in doing the same.
Sense... are you incapable of making any? Do you know what literary context means? You and your source author seem to wholly ignorant on why to use LITERARY CONTEXT when reading the CONTEXT of LITERATURE.
 
Re: Bill Maher tells Rep. Ellison the Quran is a ‘hate-filled holy book’ that inspire

'Books', AKA an Islamophobic website.

Would that then by deductive reason mean that the "Books" or websites you ascribe to are "Islamocentric"?


j-mac
 
Re: Bill Maher tells Rep. Ellison the Quran is a ‘hate-filled holy book’ that inspire

The Quran is a hate filled book. So is the Holy Bible. And, for that matter, so is Bill Maher and his scummy little movie.
 
Re: Bill Maher tells Rep. Ellison the Quran is a ‘hate-filled holy book’ that inspire

Would that then by deductive reason mean that the "Books" or websites you ascribe to are "Islamocentric"?


j-mac

"phobic" and "centric" are not antonyms.
 
Re: Bill Maher tells Rep. Ellison the Quran is a ‘hate-filled holy book’ that inspire

"phobic" and "centric" are not antonyms.

thanks for the lesson, were you confused by my point?


j-mac
 
Re: Bill Maher tells Rep. Ellison the Quran is a ‘hate-filled holy book’ that inspire

thanks for the lesson, were you confused by my point?


j-mac

There was no point.

I don't seek out websites or books that are entirely biased and not impartial to affirm my preconceived notions on a subject. That is a job for people with an agenda (ie - many of the people I have responded to in this thread).
 
Re: Bill Maher tells Rep. Ellison the Quran is a ‘hate-filled holy book’ that inspire

There was no point.

I don't seek out websites or books that are entirely biased and not impartial to affirm my preconceived notions on a subject. That is a job for people with an agenda (ie - many of the people I have responded to in this thread).


So says you.

j-mac
 
Re: Bill Maher tells Rep. Ellison the Quran is a ‘hate-filled holy book’ that inspire

So says you.

j-mac

Great insight! Keep up the intellectual work! Posts like these are what make DebatePolitics great!
 
Re: Bill Maher tells Rep. Ellison the Quran is a ‘hate-filled holy book’ that inspire

Great insight! Keep up the intellectual work! Posts like these are what make DebatePolitics great!


As opposed to what? Your own insulting, and condescending drivel?

j-mac
 
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