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Dayton Police Department Ordered to Lower Standards to Hire More Blacks

In my state they all get funded equally. they actually take money away from rich schools and give it to the poor schools to balance it out. kids in the poor school districts still perform worse.

Personal choice.
 
In my state they all get funded equally. they actually take money away from rich schools and give it to the poor schools to balance it out. kids in the poor school districts still perform worse.

your schools are funded by income and sales tax, very little by property tax. which funds are taken away from rich schools?
 
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With what you said above, how do you take this into account.

When I was in school, in California, there were busloads of students brought in from Compton and other cities in LA to the valley. We had one of the best academic records in all of LAUSD, we couldn't win a football game to save our lives but that is another story, however that did not help most of the students bussed over.

The students that wanted to learn could and the ones that didn't threw it away.

The one guy I kept in touch with, was a bussed student. He is black. He did take advantage of the education and graduated.

He then proceded to put himself through college. It took him 10 years to get his first degree, but he did it himself. I never heard him say he couldn't do it, or he wasn't allowed because of his skin color. He did it all himself.

I realise that is anecdotal information, but my point still stands.

If the student wants to learn, they will.

A test should never be dumbed down for a certain group that has sat in the exact same classes as the other groups.

It is all about personal choice.

How do you take this into account:

I went to school in a middle class neighborhood. I went to private school for personal reasons, but the public schools were great.

Almost every single person who goes to the public schools goes to college and gets good career. A very small number drop out.

A few miles away is an inner-city school that my father was a principal at for 25 years. He ran it very well and was an award-winning, respected principal - because he wouldn't take crap for his students. When he left the school/retired, it declined...a lot, for many reasons (education in general started getting worse, the new principals were incompetent). I know all this because we have family friends who work there.

There are a few great students who do well, mostly because they have great parents who are involved in their education. But the majority of them don't do well and it's not because of something within them that prevents them from learning.

I never said a test should be dumbed down. My first sentence adamantly rejects that idea. In fact, one of my biggest problems with so many arguments about education on here is that we should dumb down education because 'certain people' can't learn. I'm all about high expectations...for everybody.

Why are the numbers of students who suck at school higher than in low-income neighborhoods than wealthy? It's not just personal choice, if only for the fact that personal choice like everything in this world, has a cause.

I'm getting so sick of this attitude that people just CHOOSE to be where they are. It's absolutely ridiculous and contrary to reason and experience.
 
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It's not a myth. There are many reports on it. Here's one of many. Thanks for the selective numbers though.

http://www.wested.org/online_pubs/pp-03-01.pdf



First you infer that the poor are the ones serving in the military, now you discredit my state source and factual numbers as selective?


I gave you the link to the state study. If you want to discuss then do so. If not then try to at least not loom silly discounting the very numbers puy before you.
 
your schools are funded by income and sales tax, very little by property tax. which funds are taken away from rich schools?

sales tax. many of the "richer" cities have levied additional local sales taxes to go towards education. the state simply reduced their funding by the same amount and sent that money elsewhere.

I taught for 9 years in Hunstville AL. there are 5 high schools in the system. they are all funded identically, being in the same city school system. the two high schools where the kids from the rich part of town attend score well on the standardized tests, the two inner city schools are always to the bottom. it is not a matter of funding. that is a freakin copout
 
I think Oscar's right to a certain degree. The amount of money put into a school system isn't necessarily correlated with the quality of the education.
 
I think Oscar's right to a certain degree. The amount of money put into a school system isn't necessarily correlated with the quality of the education.

I just find it odd that so many people want to blame everyone but the students for the student's poor performance.
 
sales tax. many of the "richer" cities have levied additional local sales taxes to go towards education. the state simply reduced their funding by the same amount and sent that money elsewhere.

I taught for 9 years in Hunstville AL. there are 5 high schools in the system. they are all funded identically, being in the same city school system. the two high schools where the kids from the rich part of town attend score well on the standardized tests, the two inner city schools are always to the bottom. it is not a matter of funding. that is a freakin copout

funding should be equal, across the board, with the exception of certain types a special education needs or possibly some social needs. we all know this is a many pronged problem, the parents, the lack of good teachers in poor areas, and in some cases, yes, the lack of funding. the last problem is the kids and the environments they live in.
 
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First you infer that the poor are the ones serving in the military, now you discredit my state source and factual numbers as selective?

I gave you the link to the state study. If you want to discuss then do so. If not then try to at least not loom silly discounting the very numbers puy before you.

Selective as in they don't give an entire picture of the system.

How and when did I ever discredit the military? People who have come from poor backgrounds serve in the military. Our military is American and poor people do exist in America and actually, many people use the military's education benefits to pay for education that would be more difficult to afford. Would it make you feel better if I said that the military has people of all backgrounds, rich, poor, black, white, etc. What is your problem?
 
I think Oscar's right to a certain degree. The amount of money put into a school system isn't necessarily correlated with the quality of the education.

It's a factor. There are numerous studies about the affect of funding on education. No one has claimed that funding is the only issue. In fact, many of us have said that many factors go into it: funding is one of them...which why a lot of poor kids have outdated text books and no money for after school activities and rich kids rarely face that problem.

People also have to remember that funding in one state is not the same as it is in others.
 
funding should be equal, across the board, with the exception of certain types a special education needs or possibly some socila needs. we all know this is a many pronged problem, the parents, the lack of good teachers in poor areas, and in some cases, yes, the lack of funding. the last problem is the kids and the environments they live in.

I disagree, I've been there and seen them. the first problem is the kids and the environments they live in. until you change their attitudes towards getting a good education, all the funding and fancy schools and smarty teachers in the world won't help.
 
Lowering the standards purdy much says that minorities are too stupid to meet the basic requirements.
 
Lowering the standards purdy much says that minorities are too stupid to meet the basic requirements.

Which is not the right behavior to be rewarding. It doesn't say the people are too stupid it just says our educational system continues to fail, parent continue to fail, and those who can do the job or have the ability don't want to, whether that's due to the enviornment or maybe they don't believe it's worth saving or protecting. :shrug:
 
Which is not the right behavior to be rewarding. It doesn't say the people are too stupid it just says our educational system continues to fail, parent continue to fail, and those who can do the job or have the ability don't want to, whether that's due to the enviornment or maybe they don't believe it's worth saving or protecting. :shrug:

I don't agree. This is the same as financial welfare. It exists, because of the preconceived notion, by some, that minorities can't make it on their own and need to have help.
 
Yet more evidence that this administration's Eric Holder is a bigot.

The purpose of testing is to identify those qualified to do the job. It should not be set aside when not enough people of Eric Holder's race are shown to be qualified.

Here's what should be done if some feel minorities are insufficiently represented on their police forces: They should demand to know why the teachers unions are failing to educate their children so they can pass those tests and get those jobs, and what teachers are going to be fired to improve the quality of education for their children.

LOL... you had to throw in unions

I am a little confused by the article. When I read it, it sounds like the dept is having trouble finding people to replace retiring officers.. so there is a shortage...

It sounded to me that people can't pass the test and qualify so that's why they are lowering standards, but then the article says it to hire more blacks?

It is really messed up...
 
I don't agree. This is the same as financial welfare. It exists, because of the preconceived notion, by some, that minorities can't make it on their own and need to have help.

I agree to a point, but I think we have to look at the locations where this is happening. It could be that those who can won't --- if that's at least partly the case, why won't they? Is the pay too low, rewards too low or is it not worth doing in those towns/cities? I'm looking beyond the DoJ lowing the standards... the standards were already low to begin with. Is it really because education and dependency on government handouts is causing people in these areas to become as stupid as Idiocracy portrays or is it just not worth doing and/or there's something else going on that we don't know about?
 
Lowering the standards purdy much says that minorities are too stupid to meet the basic requirements.

It says they're less educated, which, as a population, they are.
 
I agree to a point, but I think we have to look at the locations where this is happening. It could be that those who can won't --- if that's at least partly the case, why won't they? Is the pay too low, rewards too low or is it not worth doing in those towns/cities? I'm looking beyond the DoJ lowing the standards... the standards were already low to begin with. Is it really because education and dependency on government handouts is causing people in these areas to become as stupid as Idiocracy portrays or is it just not worth doing and/or there's something else going on that we don't know about?

That's highly possible. Are there any booms going on in Ohio, right now?
 
It says they're less educated, which, as a population, they are.

Purdy much what I just said, because minority kids go to the same schools and are taught by the same teachers that white kids are. Thanks for agreeing with my assessment.
 
I don't agree. This is the same as financial welfare. It exists, because of the preconceived notion, by some, that minorities can't make it on their own and need to have help.

no, it's not. why you think it exists aside, it still means a person would be working and NOT receiving welfare. in fact, that person would then be a paxpayer, right? and if that person is a taxpayer, it follows that he feels some sort of investment in community, right? and if he holds a steady job, he might encourage his children to do the same thing, right? and then maybe he can buy a house, and a car, so he's a consumer as well. all because a score changed by 5 points, or whatever it was.
 
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no, it's not. why you think it exists beside thepoint, it still means a person would be working and NOT receiving welfare. in fact, that person would then be a paxpayer, right? and if that person is a taxpayer, it follows that he feels some sort of investment in community, right? and if he holds a steady job, he might encourage his children to do the same thing, right? and then maybe he can buy a house, and a car, so h'es a consumer as well. all because a score changed by 5 points, or whatever it was.

And collecting a government check. Not much difference than welfare. And, no, they wouldn't suddenly become, "tax payers". That's nothing more than recycling money.

It's idiotic for public employees to pay taxes to the state, parish, or federal government that employs them.

if he holds a steady job, he might encourage his children to do the same thing, right?

Actually, what it teaches his kids, is that they don't have to try, because sooner, or later, some Liberal do-gooder is coming by with a handout.
 
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And collecting a government check. Not much difference than welfare. And, no, they wouldn't suddenly become, "tax payers". That's nothing more than recycling money.

It's idiotic for public employees to pay taxes to the state, parish, or federal government that employs them.

i see. so you would do away with public police, firefighters, teachers, etc. let me know how that works out.

completely ridiculous line of reasoning, btw.
 
i see. so you would do away with public police, firefighters, teachers, etc. let me know how that works out.

completely ridiculous line of reasoning, btw.

I'm glad that you freely admit the truth about your own post. That's big of you.
 
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