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Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights withou

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Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

Yeah, we've been shown. But it's all distortion and make believe.

That is your opinion, the facts prove differently.
 
Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

what exactly does Andrew Klavan have wrong? Specifics??
Why don't read what the man wrote, he said he doesn't take him seriously? Do you know what that means? Clue: It doesn't mean he has to detail to YOU or anyone else what Klaven got wrong. HE DOESN'T TAKE HIM SERIOUSLY!!!!
 
Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

Why don't read what the man wrote, he said he doesn't take him seriously? Do you know what that means? Clue: It doesn't mean he has to detail to YOU or anyone else what Klaven got wrong. HE DOESN'T TAKE HIM SERIOUSLY!!!!

Right, the messenger not the message is important to you? What is it specifically in that video that is wrong regarding public unions? I have seen unions absolutely destroy business and a lot of unemployed union employees now receiving taxpayer money since they no longer have a job after running business out of business. yes, unions are great, aren't they?
 
Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

Right, the messenger not the message is important to you? What is it specifically in that video that is wrong regarding public unions? I have seen unions absolutely destroy business and a lot of unemployed union employees now receiving taxpayer money since they no longer have a job after running business out of business. yes, unions are great, aren't they?

Some corporations are good and some are bad, some people are good and some are bad, it's life.
 
Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

Some corporations are good and some are bad, some people are good and some are bad, it's life.

Yes, but when we have a bad corporation they go out of business as they lose customers, when we have a bad public union it stays in existence and continues to get funded.
 
Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

That is your opinion, the facts prove differently.

What facts? Your belief that people can't own the money that they receive as compensation for their labor? Is that a fact? No, it's an opinion. This entire fantasy of "the unions are supported with tax payer dollars" is just pissing into the wind. In the end, unions are a useful structure to have if properly controlled and maintained. They still serve a purpose even. And this whole trying to make it look like the government is funneling money into the unions....they may be but it ain't because teachers have to pay dues. It will be some shady back room thing none of us know about. And if you don't think they ain't doing to others to, then you're living in a fantasy world as well. This happens a lot. Look at Bush's Medicare Part D, it was a give away to the pharmaceutical companies. Look at the lack of regulation on the banks and wallstreet which lead to the economic collapse. You think that was coincidence? Hell no! The banks and the aristocracy have the ear of the government. That was a one-two punch from Clinton/Bush to deregulate that. Look at the oil companies. Not only do they get tons of money from the government but the regulatory committee there was apparently just doing cocaine and hookers instead of looking for problems. Where was the check? Hell, even FEMA uses a lot of money...where did it all go? Cause it certainly didn't go into fixing New Orleans. This is America, we could have fixed New Orleans up like new within a year.

The list goes on and on. Government has its hands in everything. Yet I'm supposed to sit here and actually believe this nonsense about public funding of a union because the teachers have to pay dues and they happen through coincidence of their job be paid by the tax payers. That's what I'm supposed to believe. That's what I'm supposed to have a problem with. That. And all this other **** is going down in the government, all this other money is ending up in shady places, and I'm supposed to be concerned about some po-dunk union in the backwoods of Wisconsin. All because the teachers who belong to the union have to pay dues.

People in this country better start getting priorities set, else we are going to lose this Republic.
 
Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

Yes, but when we have a bad corporation they go out of business as they lose customers, when we have a bad public union it stays in existence and continues to get funded.

No we don't. When we have bad corporations, they get hand outs from the government (which IS taxpayer money) to stay afloat even when they are the one's who broke the system in the first place. There's no free market capitalism in America anymore. This is corporate capitalism.
 
Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

You have been shown over and over how taxpayer money gets to the unions, you choose to ignore it.

Do you feel that you can defend your position in a debate?
 
Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

What facts? Your belief that people can't own the money that they receive as compensation for their labor? Is that a fact? No, it's an opinion. This entire fantasy of "the unions are supported with tax payer dollars" is just pissing into the wind. In the end, unions are a useful structure to have if properly controlled and maintained. They still serve a purpose even. And this whole trying to make it look like the government is funneling money into the unions....they may be but it ain't because teachers have to pay dues. It will be some shady back room thing none of us know about. And if you don't think they ain't doing to others to, then you're living in a fantasy world as well. This happens a lot. Look at Bush's Medicare Part D, it was a give away to the pharmaceutical companies. Look at the lack of regulation on the banks and wallstreet which lead to the economic collapse. You think that was coincidence? Hell no! The banks and the aristocracy have the ear of the government. That was a one-two punch from Clinton/Bush to deregulate that. Look at the oil companies. Not only do they get tons of money from the government but the regulatory committee there was apparently just doing cocaine and hookers instead of looking for problems. Where was the check? Hell, even FEMA uses a lot of money...where did it all go? Cause it certainly didn't go into fixing New Orleans. This is America, we could have fixed New Orleans up like new within a year.

The list goes on and on. Government has its hands in everything. Yet I'm supposed to sit here and actually believe this nonsense about public funding of a union because the teachers have to pay dues and they happen through coincidence of their job be paid by the tax payers. That's what I'm supposed to believe. That's what I'm supposed to have a problem with. That. And all this other **** is going down in the government, all this other money is ending up in shady places, and I'm supposed to be concerned about some po-dunk union in the backwoods of Wisconsin. All because the teachers who belong to the union have to pay dues.

People in this country better start getting priorities set, else we are going to lose this Republic.

It has nothing to do with it being their money but instead of what they are forced to do with it by unions. That is the issue, forced union dues. Calling it a po-dunk union says a lot about you.

As for the rest of your post it is too ill informed to even discuss. You continue to buy the rhetoric that govt. pays oil companies instead of those companies getting to keep more of what they earned. Quite a bit of difference. Liberalism has been successful in the brainwashing. You are hardly a Libertarian.
 
Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

Do you feel that you can defend your position in a debate?

Absolutely, I have no problem defending my position based upon actual work experience as well as actual verifiable facts. You offer opinions as fact but only opinions from leftwing sources.
 
Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

No we don't. When we have bad corporations, they get hand outs from the government (which IS taxpayer money) to stay afloat even when they are the one's who broke the system in the first place. There's no free market capitalism in America anymore. This is corporate capitalism.

I was totally against the bailouts and remain against bailouts. Yes, you are right taxpayer dollars went to some businesses but that is the exception rather than the rule.
 
Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

Yes, but when we have a bad corporation they go out of business as they lose customers, when we have a bad public union it stays in existence and continues to get funded.

Unions are democratic institutions, so the leadership can be changed democratically - no so with a corporation. And failed corporations taking down go hard working people, but conservatives never seem to think of workers.
 
Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

It has nothing to do with it being their money but instead of what they are forced to do with it by unions. That is the issue, forced union dues. Calling it a po-dunk union says a lot about you.

As for the rest of your post it is too ill informed to even discuss. You continue to buy the rhetoric that govt. pays oil companies instead of those companies getting to keep more of what they earned. Quite a bit of difference. Liberalism has been successful in the brainwashing. You are hardly a Libertarian.

We have union jobs and non-union jobs. If you don't want the former, do the latter. If you don't want the latter, do the former. Simple. Everybody has a choice.
 
Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

it has nothing to do with it being their money but instead of what they are forced to do with it by unions. That is the issue, forced union dues. Calling it a po-dunk union says a lot about you.

As for the rest of your post it is too ill informed to even discuss. You continue to buy the rhetoric that govt. Pays oil companies instead of those companies getting to keep more of what they earned. Quite a bit of difference. Liberalism has been successful in the brainwashing. You are hardly a libertarian.

THEY JOINED THE UNION! For the love of all that is holy, why the HELL do you think one should be able to join an organization and not pay dues to it? Should I be able to get Netflix for free? I mean, they're "forcing" me to pay a monthly fee.

Jesus tap dancing Christ on a pogo stick; have we lost all logic and rational in this country? Is this what it's coming down to here? People, you have to THINK. You have to research, you have to be responsible. You can't go along flinging out this poo like "oh the unions are publicly funded because the teachers who are in the union have to pay dues to the union". Do you even listen to yourself?

You can say I'm hardly a "libertarian" but that's hardly an insult coming from the likes of you.
 
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Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

Unions are democratic institutions, so the leadership can be changed democratically - no so with a corporation. And failed corporations taking down go hard working people, but conservatives never seem to think of workers.

How much does union management get paid and who pays them? If a corporation fails it goes out of business and yes, employees lose their jobs. Public services never go out of business and the taxpayers just pay the bill.
 
Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

We have union jobs and non-union jobs. If you don't want the former, do the latter. If you don't want the latter, do the former. Simple. Everybody has a choice.

In Wisconsin if you want to be a teacher you join the union or you go to a private or charter school where jobs are scarce.
 
Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

I was totally against the bailouts and remain against bailouts. Yes, you are right taxpayer dollars went to some businesses but that is the exception rather than the rule.

It's the rule. All these corporations get tons of money, tons of tax holes, tons of preferential laws and enforcement out of our government.
 
Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

If they wanted a job, they had no choice.

If they wanted THAT job. There are other jobs out there. They are adults, they made a choice, they exercised their right to contract. And you're bitching because they are held to the obligations of their contract. WTF.
 
Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

You have been shown over and over how taxpayer money gets to the unions, you choose to ignore it.
The money a government worker earns is funded by the taxpayers regardless of whether they belong to a union or not. Fail!!!
 
Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

Absolutely, I have no problem defending my position based upon actual work experience as well as actual verifiable facts. You offer opinions as fact but only opinions from leftwing sources.

I haven't seen one verifiable fact from you which supports your conclusion.
 
Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

It's the rule. All these corporations get tons of money, tons of tax holes, tons of preferential laws and enforcement out of our government.

All allowing them to keep more of what they earn and what do they do with that money.
 
Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

I haven't seen one verifiable fact from you which supports your conclusion.

The brainwashed can never see.
 
Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

Absolutely, I have no problem defending my position based upon actual work experience as well as actual verifiable facts. You offer opinions as fact but only opinions from leftwing sources.

Fine. here are the rules and guidelines. Go down and familiarize yourself with the rules and we can start maybe next Monday.I’ll PM a mod that is familiar with the true debate format and see if we can sit it up.:2wave:



Your contending that paying union dues, that you earned, if you’re a public sector employee is taxpayer funding of Unions. is that correct?



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Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

All allowing them to keep more of what they earn and what do they do with that money.

Well earn things in questionable ways, gaurantee certain profits, bail them out when they mess up, rob employees of pension plans, etc.
 
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