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Eighteen involved in gang rape of 11 year old girl in Texas

DiAnna said:
You had better produce one post of mine that fantasized torturing such criminals, because I'm not going to ignore such lying slander here. Before you had merely annoyed me. Now you have pissed me the hell off.
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I'm sorry, I mustve confused you as participating in the rest of the rabid throng. Apologies.

I think it's sick to rather assume that the victim must be lying than allow for the possibility of the rape.
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It's actually more likely than a gangbang of 18 men on an 11 year old. Children can be easily led to give answers condemning the innocent, particularly in instances of molestation, etc.

You're more so. Wanting to hurt someone who's hurt your family is perfectly normal.
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I wasn't ware the 11 year old had family members on this board.

Well, what if they're convicted, then what? Group therapy?
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Why yes I advocate overlooking child rape, you read me perfectly! /s
Why are you loading assumption onto me? Is overlooking childrape a 'liberal' thing you attribute to me?

Why do people find it so hard to reserve judgment? You do not possess whatever evidence the police say they have, nor were you there to understand what occurred. It is not even clear from the information provided that all the people arrested actually did anything.
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I would consider this the same way the Navy did for an incident that happened onboard our ship that had photographic evidence, anyone in any photo/video that depicts the crime in any way, i.e. the girl is in the picture too, naked or obviously involved in any sexual activity, or they are talking about the incident or the trailer or room where the attack occurred can be positively identified, should be charged in the crime, whether there is evidence they participated in the actual rape or not. At the very least, they would be an accessory.

From what I have seen and read, it certainly sounds like the girl had sex with at least some of these guys. Even the lawyer of at least a few of these guys isn't denying that the crime happened, according to the one lady in the video. And no matter if the girl said yes to all the guys, she is not of a legal age to consent so they still committed a crime. And I highly doubt that she looked 17 at age 11.
 
Oh I don't doubt something really bad and disturbing happened. I'm only here to remind people that not every instance of where a child says "he touched me" is it true.

Look at that teacher than had 50 counts of molestation against her DROPPED. They found out the girls involved made it up when they got caught TOUCHING EACH OTHER. The case was front page news, when she got arrested, etc. She lost her house, her job, and almost lost her husband.

When she was found not guilty of all 50 counts, it was last page news.
 
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dontworrybehappy said:
Oh I don't doubt something really bad and disturbing happened. I'm only here to remind people that not every instance of where a child says "he touched me" is it true.

Look at that teacher than had 50 counts of molestation against her DROPPED. They found out the girls involved made it up when they got caught TOUCHING EACH OTHER. The case was front page news, when she got arrested, etc. When she was found not guilty of all 50 counts, it was last page news.
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Can't control what the media does, but it looked like the system worked ~ she was acquitted.
 
X Factor said:
Can't control what the media does, but it looked like the system worked ~ she was acquitted.
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The system didn't work! She lost everything! Her reputation is ruined! Open your fycking eyes, man! She spent a half MILLION DOLLARS DEFENDING HERSELF! She doesn't get that back! She'll always be "that lady who was found not guilty of child molestation." There were STILL people writing comments on foxnews that said she should be burned alive and she got away with molestation and she should be shot, etc in comments to the article that stated she was found not guilty. So no, the system didn't "work." The system failed MISERABLY. She should have not ever even been CHARGED. Simply being CHARGED with a sex crime against a child is practically a death sentence for the person charged, their lives as they know it, will be over. The outcome of the trial not withstanding.
 
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dontworrybehappy said:
The system didn't work! She lost everything! Her reputation is ruined! Open your fycking eyes, man! She spent a half MILLION DOLLARS DEFENDING HERSELF! She doesn't get that back! She'll always be "that lady who was found not guilty of child molestation." There were STILL people writing comments on foxnews that said she should be burned alive and she got away with molestation and she should be shot, etc in comments to the article that stated she was found not guilty. So no, the system didn't "work." The system failed MISERABLY. She should have not ever even been CHARGED.
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Yeah, you and I have had this discussion before and, as I recall, you could never answer my final question. Should a molester who's really good and careful not to leave physical evidence not be charged even if the victim said it happened. Seems like a dangerous message, just be careful, and you can't even be charged. Try the evidence and let a jury decide the victim's credibility.
 
SE102 said:
I'm sorry, I mustve confused you as participating in the rest of the rabid throng. Apologies.
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It's too damned late for that. You have now posted a half-dozen quotes under my name that I never the hell made. I never made any of the quotes that you have attributed to me here. Not one.

If you think I'll overlook this travesty, you are very much mistaken. :2mad:
 
X Factor said:
Yeah, you and I have had this discussion before and, as I recall, you could never answer my final question. Should a molester who's really good and careful not to leave physical evidence not be charged even if the victim said it happened. Seems like a dangerous message, just be careful, and you can't even be charged. Try the evidence and let a jury decide the victim's credibility.
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You should never convict based on testimony alone. Not sure if you realize this, but innocent until PROVEN guilty is how our country works, even if you REALLY don't like the crime they committed. A single child saying someone did something to them with ZERO evidence is not proof. It's fluff. The child says they did it, the accused says they didn't, and with an assumption of innocence and lack of other corroborating evidence, the guy should walk. Period. Most molesters aren't that careful and there is some proof somewhere. They can't prevent witnesses from seeing their car in the area, can't prevent others from seeing them around or with a child, etc.

You say "try the evidence" but then a few words prior admit there was no evidence except for testimony. You must understand how easily a child can be coerced into saying something. I'm not saying ALL kids do this, I'm saying SOME do. And its not hard to google men who are in prison by coerced or false testimony by their kids or other kids who later recant their stories and say they made it all up.

So I'll turn this around on you, do you think YOU should be imprisoned by a child saying you touched them? After all, they could just say that you were really careful and left no evidence. Oh, sucks when the shoe is on the other foot, doesn't it? How the hell do you prove a negative?

I find it funny I'm almost being attacked on this site because I want to make SURE the person accused is actually guilty before imprisoning them or putting them to death. Little did I know that would cause such a stir.

Edit: I do not think the 11yo in this thread made this up. I want to make that clear. I am only saying it HAS happened at other times with other kids. And to me, that is just as disturbing as the OP's post itself.
 
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X Factor said:
You're more so. Wanting to hurt someone who's hurt your family is perfectly normal.
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How is it more ****ed up to not want to go on a killing spree? Do not let the Rock fool you, most people are not that awesome or undamaged when going on a vengeful killing spree.

The Giant Noodle said:
17 kids and adult kids? 17 blacks raped a 11 year old girl?
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Wait, what does them being black have to do with it?

roguenuke said:
I would consider this the same way the Navy did for an incident that happened onboard our ship that had photographic evidence, anyone in any photo/video that depicts the crime in any way, i.e. the girl is in the picture too, naked or obviously involved in any sexual activity, or they are talking about the incident or the trailer or room where the attack occurred can be positively identified, should be charged in the crime, whether there is evidence they participated in the actual rape or not. At the very least, they would be an accessory.

From what I have seen and read, it certainly sounds like the girl had sex with at least some of these guys. Even the lawyer of at least a few of these guys isn't denying that the crime happened, according to the one lady in the video. And no matter if the girl said yes to all the guys, she is not of a legal age to consent so they still committed a crime. And I highly doubt that she looked 17 at age 11.
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In the Navy everyone is over 18 and should not be at a serious physical disadvantage. One of the individuals arrested was 14. Maybe it was a bulky 14 year-old, but if it wasn't and he was surrounded by burly people many years his senior it would be unreasonable to expect him to defy the group in any way.
 
dontworrybehappy said:
You should never convict based on testimony alone. Not sure if you realize this, but innocent until PROVEN guilty is how our country works. A single child saying someone did something to them with ZERO evidence is not proof. It's fluff. Most molesters aren't that careful and there is some proof somewhere. They can't prevent witnesses from seeing their car in the area, can't prevent others from seeing them around or with a child, etc.

You say "try the evidence" but then a few words prior admit there was no evidence except for testimony. You must understand how easily a child can be coerced into saying something. I'm not saying ALL kids do this, I'm saying SOME do. And its not hard to google men who are in prison by coerced or false testimony by their kids or other kids who later recant their stories and say they made it all up.

So I'll turn this around on you, do you think YOU should be imprisoned by a child saying you touched them? After all, they could just say that you were really careful and left no evidence. Oh, sucks when the shoe is on the other foot, doesn't it?

I find it funny I'm almost being attacked on this site because I want to make SURE the person accused is actually guilty before imprisoning them or putting them to death. Little did I know that would cause such a stir.
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Your contention that direct testimony is not "evidence" is factually, not to mention legally, incorrect. Once a witness is sworn, their testimony is evidence just as sure as a bullet or a photograph or DNA is. It has to be this way, if you were robbed at gun point and nobody else is around (because most criminals don't commit crimes with a large audience watching), would you be ok with the state not charging the guy you ID'd simply because your testimony is the only evidence.

As far as kids lying, they do, but they're not sophisticated about it. Are they going to be able to hold up under cross exam? Probably not. And as for your contention that there's just always some other evidence around, what about the mom's boyfriend that slips quietly into her daughter's room every night. Imagine then, the child finally tells (most are reluctant) but by the time she does, all potential evidence is gone. That's it? The guy should not be charged and she should just be put back into that situation for the crime of being too young to know how to preserve evidence?
 
X Factor said:
Your contention that direct testimony is not "evidence" is factually, not to mention legally, incorrect. Once a witness is sworn, their testimony is evidence just as sure as a bullet or a photograph or DNA is. It has to be this way, if you were robbed at gun point and nobody else is around (because most criminals don't commit crimes with a large audience watching), would you be ok with the state not charging the guy you ID'd simply because your testimony is the only evidence.

As far as kids lying, they do, but they're not sophisticated about it. Are they going to be able to hold up under cross exam? Probably not. And as for your contention that there's just always some other evidence around, what about the mom's boyfriend that slips quietly into her daughter's room every night. Imagine then, the child finally tells (most are reluctant) but by the time she does, all potential evidence is gone. That's it? The guy should not be charged and she should just be put back into that situation for the crime of being too young to know how to preserve evidence?
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Nice reply, but once sworn in, BOTH parties testimony is equal. And obviously, you have ZERO experience in this realm.

You put a 5yo on the witness stand and drill her with cross examination, all she has to do is cry. The jurors are GOING to favor the child, YOU WILL BE BURIED. Your family will be visiting you behind bars for not years, but DECADES. Your name is already dragged through the mud just based on the fact that you were charged. If the prosecutor offers you 5 years with a plea, or 20 if it goes to trial, what will an innocent man do when his lawyer correctly says "if we go to trial and they put the little girl on the stand you are toast"?

You can come up with 500 instances of crimes where no evidence is left, and I can come up with 500 more. But more times than not, there are issues with someone being accused and convicted on testimony alone. Those are the ones that wind up being overturned. I don't like it, but don't worry about it, many men are being put in prison with nothing more than a child's testimony. Innocent or guilty, they're being locked up so you're getting your wish!

Oh, and for the record, if you are mugged and you identify the guy out of a lineup yet they find nothing to back up your testimony and the guy has an otherwise clean record, any decent lawyer will get him to walk. Sex offenses are the only types of cases where you are guilty until proven innocent.
 
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dontworrybehappy said:
Nice reply, but once sworn in, BOTH parties testimony is equal. And obviously, you have ZERO experience in this realm.
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You're right, if the accused decides to testify (they have a 5th amendment right not to) their testimony is also evidence. It's up to the jury to decide credibility.

You put a 5yo on the witness stand and drill her with cross examination, all she has to do is cry. The jurors are GOING to favor the child, YOU WILL BE BURIED. Your name is already dragged through the mud just based on the fact that you were charged. If the prosecutor offers you 5 years with a plea, or 20 if it goes to trial, what will an innocent man do when his lawyer correctly says "if they put the little girl on the stand you are toast"?

You can come up with 500 instances of crimes where no evidence is left, and I can come up with 500 more. But more times than not, there are issues with someone being accused and convicted on testimony alone. Those are the ones that wind up being overturned. I don't like it, but don't worry about it, many men are being put in prison with nothing more than a child's testimony. Innocent or guilty, they're being locked up so you're getting your wish!
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My wish is that children not continued to be victimized. If the guy is acquitted, great. If he's convicted, it's because the jury believed the victim and I'm fine with that too. Besides, if all those convictions are being overturned, what's the problem?
 
SE102 said:
It was about us all in the thread enraging ourselves over the hypothetical rape of our children. And these folks who may/may not be guilty and the Shari'ah justice you'd want to issue upon them without trial.



I would prefer not to believe that it happened, or issue a rational doubt that this was a brutal rape of an 11 year old by 18 men. But it may be possible that you gain some sick enjoyment fantasizing the righteousness with which you would torture such criminals.

Sorry. I must not be as ****ed up as you or these rapists.
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Moderator's Warning:
Knock off the personal attacks or there will be further conseqeuences.
 
The facts in this case is that there is video evidence of those 18 people raping this 11yo. It doesn't matter if there is a court proceeding saying that they are guilty or not. The evidence is clear cut to the point that it is undeniable and 100.00% proof positive that they commited a horrible crime. It doesn't matter if she agreed to it or not. The fact that these adults did this...who are suppose to know better than to screw an 11 year old girl (consenual or not), are worse than scum. Hell, its quite possible that girl hasn't even started her periods yet..much less knew what saying "yes" meant. Assuming she even said yes to begin with.
 
The Giant Noodle said:
17 kids and adult kids? 17 blacks raped a 11 year old girl? I can even comment because Im close to losing it.
about 10 minutes later......
this is what guns are made for. every call the family gets that are the least bit threatening should be traced back to the originator and they too should be arrested and their house torn apart for any evidence or wrong-doing.
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Can you please clarify this part of your comment please?
 
Dittohead not! said:
At least 18 charged in alleged gang rape of Texas girl



It's hard to imagine such a crime. Eighteen men and boys raping an 11 year old girl? Is there any punishment on this Earth severe enough for such a crime?

Time for some neutering operations, seriously.
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It's obviously that something real did happen.

But there are no details being given at all - just some basics. From that I can't form an opinon other than noting how tragic and sad it is.
 
USA_1 said:
Then you would be in prison with the survivors.

Sounds like her parents are part of the problem.
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not if i was on the jury he wouldn't
 
j-mac said:
Are you really blaming the victim here? Come on man......You can not be that obtuse.


j-mac
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Um, maybe I can't read english or you can't read english, but I don't see anywhere that he blamed the victim. I believe he said the PARENTS are partially to blame. If this little girl had been allowed to wear thong bikinis around boys all her life and suddenly finds herself being raped, you wouldn't blame the 11yo but you most certainly could blame the parents and that is NOT blaming the victim. I'm not saying that's what happened, I'm simply using that as an example.
 
New Developments in Cleveland Gang Rape Case

Timothy Ellis, 19, is among the adults now charged in the crime. His mother, Anita Ellis Hancock, spoke to FOX 26 News on Monday.

FOX 26: When you found out that your son was accused of raping an 11 year old girl...(interrupted by Hancock)

Hancock: It was in the paper.

FOX 26: What did you do? Did you talk to your son?

Hancock: Yes I did. Yes I did. I said, 'Baby, I'm your momma. You can talk to me.' (The victim) said she was 17 years old and that's what he told me.

FOX 26: But Anita, a lot of people would say, 'This is an 11 year old child. Even if she lied, she's eleven.'

Hancock: I understand that. I understand that. I'm not defending him. I'm not defending her. I'm not defending no child because if it were my child, I would feel the same way. My point is, where was her mother?

FOX 26: If this was reversed. If your son wasn't your son, but you were the mother of this 11 year old, what would you do? What would you say? What is justice?

Hancock: First of all, I would know where she was. That's the justice. Not knowing where your baby is is not justice. I feel like she should be accounted for not knowing where your baby at.

FOX 26: What lesson does you son need to learn?

Hancock: ID. Identification. This (holding up nametag and picture) is what you ask for baby.

FOX 26: So you're going to tell your son, next time he meets a girl to ask for her ID?

Hancock: Identification.

FOX 26: Are you mad at your son?

Hancock: Am I mad at him? For not being alert of age and not asking 'how old are you?' He was the only one who turned himself in because he felt bad because he has nieces. He said, "Mama ain't no way.' You can just feel the hurt.

FOX 26 does not identify victims of sexual assaults or their families. Up until recently, the victim's family lived just outside the Cleveland city limits. Neighbors say the family moved on Sunday in order to get away from the fallout surrounding the case.

>> Watch the video for Kristine Galvan's television report and her interview with a suspect's mother (non-mobile)
 
Brought to you by the the vile Caligulation that is becoming almost mainstream in the current world of perverted scum sucking filth. This is what happens when morality is subjective. This is what happens when the objectification of women is complete. This is what happens when animals have no male role model, no daddy to beat the piss out of them when they need a serious hurt.

I would like to see a public execution of every one.
 
snilloctjc said:
New Developments in Cleveland Gang Rape Case

Timothy Ellis, 19, is among the adults now charged in the crime. His mother, Anita Ellis Hancock, spoke to FOX 26 News on Monday.

FOX 26: When you found out that your son was accused of raping an 11 year old girl...(interrupted by Hancock)

Hancock: It was in the paper.

FOX 26: What did you do? Did you talk to your son?

Hancock: Yes I did. Yes I did. I said, 'Baby, I'm your momma. You can talk to me.' (The victim) said she was 17 years old and that's what he told me.

FOX 26: But Anita, a lot of people would say, 'This is an 11 year old child. Even if she lied, she's eleven.'

Hancock: I understand that. I understand that. I'm not defending him. I'm not defending her. I'm not defending no child because if it were my child, I would feel the same way. My point is, where was her mother?

FOX 26: If this was reversed. If your son wasn't your son, but you were the mother of this 11 year old, what would you do? What would you say? What is justice?

Hancock: First of all, I would know where she was. That's the justice. Not knowing where your baby is is not justice. I feel like she should be accounted for not knowing where your baby at.

FOX 26: What lesson does you son need to learn?

Hancock: ID. Identification. This (holding up nametag and picture) is what you ask for baby.

FOX 26: So you're going to tell your son, next time he meets a girl to ask for her ID?

Hancock: Identification.

FOX 26: Are you mad at your son?

Hancock: Am I mad at him? For not being alert of age and not asking 'how old are you?' He was the only one who turned himself in because he felt bad because he has nieces. He said, "Mama ain't no way.' You can just feel the hurt.

FOX 26 does not identify victims of sexual assaults or their families. Up until recently, the victim's family lived just outside the Cleveland city limits. Neighbors say the family moved on Sunday in order to get away from the fallout surrounding the case.

>> Watch the video for Kristine Galvan's television report and her interview with a suspect's mother (non-mobile)
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this silly bitch should be jailed right along with her son.
 
DiAnna said:
This crime is too horrific, too vicious for me to wrap my mind around. But it gets worse. The entire family is getting death threats. The town is actually divided about whose fault this was, the males or the little girl... or the girl's parents! All of the family's kids have had to leave town and relocate, and some of the lawyers for the boys are saying things like, "This is not a case of a child who was enslaved or taken advantage of." WTF??? 18 men and boys (or more, some say based on dozens of videos taken during the attacks it could be as many as 28 men) GANG-RAPED an 11-yr. old., but didn't enslave or take advantage of her? And half the effing town agrees?

What the hell kind of people live in Cleveland, Texas??
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i agree...sounds like half the town are inbred morons.
 
SE102 said:
Evidence that the situation is not clear cut.
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i disagree completely. what is known is that those men raped an 11 yr old girl. it doesn't matter what, if anything, that girl said or how she acted. she's 11, for god's sake.
 
An 11 year old girl does not have the mental capacity to judge the significance of having sex with 18 men and boys. Only a despicable human being would even try to implicate the girl.
 
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