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62% against stripping public employees' bargaining rights

There in lies the problem with lobbyists. What a waste of money that could be going to the employees.

I agree. I am not against unions per say. What I am against is their self serving interests. They have strayed in large from the working class and have steered toward their own personal gains at the expense of anyone in their way. They have become the very thing they originally fought against.
 
Rasmussen?!?!?!? like the used to say in the old MArvel Comics...."nuff said".
 
My point is, as a resident of New York, I know from experience that the unions have a lot of influence here, between what they spend themselves on vilifying their opposition and donate to the candidates that support them.

And you 'know' this because?
 
This is funny. For the first ten days of the Wisconsin stand-off, lots of righties here kept saying the public was on Walkers side and the polls would show it when they finally came out. So now we have one poll after another showing that the public does NOT support a Walker type plan either in Wisconsin or in their own state. Walker himself woud lose is his same electoral contest was held now.

So what is the response of the right? Glamming on to their favorite pollster - rasmussen - who is an obvious outlier on this issue - and what else is new on that front? And every other pollster who gives them the bad news is simply dismissed and thrown under the bus.

You righties are as predictable as the rising and the setting of the sun. You really don't give a hoot about public opinion unless it agrees with your own personal ideological opinion.
 
rasmussen was found to be the most accurate pollster in america in 2008

http://www.fordham.edu/images/acade...ccuracy in the 2008 presidential election.pdf

Prof
what your article does is examine FINAL election polls and compare them with election day results. As such, we do NOT get a look at what Rasmusses specializes in - his early polls during the early stages and middle stages of the campaign are normally tilted in favor of the republican or conservative and are usually outliers. Many have said he is trying to mold public opinion with his numbers. Of course his numbers later fall in line as the election approaches and his reputation is on the line. But in the meantime his numbers may have pushed some voters to the "winning side" that he wants seen as the rightist candidates. Your article fails to take that into consideration.
 
Prof
what your article does is examine FINAL election polls and compare them with election day results. As such, we do NOT get a look at what Rasmusses specializes in - his early polls during the early stages and middle stages of the campaign are normally tilted in favor of the republican or conservative and are usually outliers.

nonsense, rasmussen was singled out not only for the accuracy of his finals but for the steadiness of his forecasts in the months preceding the plebiscite

How Did We Do? - Rasmussen Reports™

and isn't cbs/nyt the outfit that sampled 20% union households and 36% dem vs 26% gop?

to whom do you think andrew cuomo is listening?
 
You look at but one component without looking at the entire picture

nonsense

there's no doubt that corporate cash is a colossus, the chambers, the karls, the kochs

you're the one who questioned union influence

it all comes down to character

the entire picture you're now looking at is gonna get an awful lot redder as we proceed

the roves and colemans are already cranking up the cash

and the seiu's are about to be slashed
 
Prof
your threadbare one page article from Fordham clearly states this right at the start

For all the derision directed toward pre-election polling, the final poll estimates were not
far off from the actual nationwide voteshares for the two candidates.

That is all they are comparing just as I stated.

Your comments only admit the right wing cash is more powerful and will continue to be more powerful. The Citizens United ruling will be the downfall of our political process just as Dred Scott propelled us to the Civil War.
 
your threadbare one page article from Fordham clearly states this right at the start

yes, i know

that's why you need to look at rasmussen's month-by-month

Your comments only admit the right wing cash is more powerful and will continue to be more powerful.

yup

The Citizens United ruling will be the downfall of our political process just as Dred Scott propelled us to the Civil War.

save your opinions for those who respect em
 
concerning corporate cash, do you remember when cbs' bob schieffer, ftn, 3 weeks before tsunami tuesday, asked the ax: what evidence do you have that the chamber of commerce is using foreign contributions to influence our elections?

ax answered: well, do you have any evidence that it's not, bob?

LOL!

schieffer: is that all ya got?

Schieffer Smacks Down Axelrod's Foreign Money Accusation - CBS News Video

it all comes down to character
 
yes, i know

that's why you need to look at rasmussen's month-by-month



yup



save your opinions for those who respect em

Month by month????? And please tell us how you can say who is accurate in September? When you have a situation where rasmussen is clearly the outlier and is giving us numbers way out of line - how do you justify those? What happens in November is that he gets his numbers in line by that time after he has attempted to use his polling as a news story favorable to republicans.

As for respect insult - why do you need to be rude? If you do not respect my comments I would think you would ignore them and not comment upon them. Which is clearly not the case.
 
respect for facts, not opinions

i don't expect anyone to have any respect for my mere opinions, for example

month by month---rasmussen results held steady, his final was the same as his monthlies

let's look at that nyt/cbs survey once more:

Essentially, the way CBS and the Times got the survey to produce the result was to over-sample union and public employee households. Only seven percent of the private sector workforce is unionized, but among the 984 people interviewed for the survey, 20 percent identified themselves and/or somebody in their household as union members.

Similarly, government employees approximately 10 percent of the national workforce, yet the survey respondents include an unrealistically high proportion of public employees, at 25 percent of the total.

CBS News/New York Times survey oversampled union households | Mark Tapscott | Beltway Confidential | Washington Examiner

it all comes down to character
 
As the standoff between unions and Wisconsin Republicans wages on, an analysis of the nation’s 10 largest labor unions shows some top leaders – the people being derided as “union bosses” – make six-figure salaries funded by members’ dues.

Leaders earned between $173,000 and $618,000 at major unions, the Center for Public Integrity found in examining 2009 tax records, with some groups paying dozens of employees in the six figures. At the three major unions , which together represent more than 5.6 million public workers, presidents’ salaries ranged between $400,000 and $500,000 in 2009.

Report: Union heads make six figures - Jennifer Epstein - POLITICO.com
 
I highly doubt this polling data is accurate.

Only 12 percent of workers belong to uninos, and if not for the requirement to join of some unions, that number would be in the single digits.

Most people hate unions. Trying to do business in union states is extremely difficult for companies both inside and outside of those states.

A poll can show whatever you want it to, depending on who you ask and what you ask them. I definitely think that's the case here.
 
it looks like a done deal in ohio

Ohio Advances Curbs on Public Unions - WSJ.com

this is not surprising, the pros saw it coming quite awhile ago, due to the composition of the buckeye legislature

what's going on in ohio and wisconsin is sweeping the nation, and the wave is huge

in each particular locality, it's just going to be a matter of degree

stay up
 
it looks like a done deal in ohio

Ohio Advances Curbs on Public Unions - WSJ.com

this is not surprising, the pros saw it coming quite awhile ago, due to the composition of the buckeye legislature

what's going on in ohio and wisconsin is sweeping the nation, and the wave is huge

in each particular locality, it's just going to be a matter of degree

stay up

Prof, imagine this.

What if the Dems don't win back these states in 2012 and 2014? Better yet, what if the GOP wins hands down?

These union dems are going to be faced with knowing that everything they've ever believed and taken for granted about people......was wrong.
 
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62% against stripping public employees' bargaining rights

Yeah, but those are just Americans. Who cares what they think? Republicans have made their decision, and it is the job of good little serfs to shut up and accept it.
 
Yeah, but those are just Americans. Who cares what they think? Republicans have made their decision, and it is the job of good little serfs to shut up and accept it.

Replace Republicans with Democrats and that's how most Americans felt when the Democrats passed a federal healthcare law against the will of the majority of Americans.
 
Replace Republicans with Democrats and that's how most Americans felt when the Democrats passed a federal healthcare law against the will of the majority of Americans.

Could be. I don't think most Americans were ever clear on its contents - Republicans and their news mouthpieces basically lied every time they opened their mouths about it. You're welcome to argue that Americans don't understand what is involved in this union dispute, but that's a much harder case to make.
 
I hate how much influence the unions, through the dues of the membership, have with governments from coast to coast. I'm sick and tired of watching legislatures whore themselves one day and then claim to represent the will or the best interests of the people the next day.

What I hate even more, though, is when legislators believe the way out of a fiscal crisis they inflicted on us is to turn around and break the deals they made to get into or stay in office. No. You made your bed, now you lie in it and figure out how to fix things without breaking the contracts.

Legislators that advocate breaking contracts or treaties or any kind should be rendered ineligible for re-election merely for making the suggestion -- if it's so vital to the interests of their constituents, they should be willing to fall on their own swords to make it happen.

But you don't have a problem with the PACs formed by corporate leaders and CEOs?

So CEOs should be allowed to organize, but workers shouldn't?

Is that it?
 
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