Indiana Democrats flee state legislature to avoid anti-union vote

iamitter · Feb 23, 2011

Gapeach said:
Apparently the people of WI wanted this...they voted for the Republicans. Now they must deal with what is being presented to them. Everyone is going to have massive cuts, this is just a beginning. Which we already have people running for the hills. Its sad. Persuade your point to the other side and get their vote but if you can not...thats the way the cookie crumbles.

You could say the same about the senate. Let's go back to 2008.
Apparently the people of US wanted this...they voted for the Democrats. Now they must deal with what is being presented to them.
And yet they didn't.

The filibuster was put there specifically to prevent the imposing of the majority on the minority. I don't see this as any different. Using parliamentary procedures to block a bill.

Badmutha · Feb 23, 2011

iamitter said:
I don't really see how this is any different than filibustering in the us senate.
If these democrats "fought for what they believed" and let the vote go, they'd lose, much like any party with less than 50 seats in the senate that filibusters.

So its ok for the Democrats to sit out the remainder of their term........to stop the bill?

Not going to work comes natural to Democrats.......
.
.
.

Gapeach · Feb 23, 2011

iamitter said:
You could say the same about the senate. Let's go back to 2008.
Apparently the people of US wanted this...they voted for the Democrats. Now they must deal with what is being presented to them.
And yet they didn't.

The filibuster was put there specifically to prevent the imposing of the majority on the minority. I don't see this as any different. Using parliamentary procedures to block a bill.

To me its a bit different. We get our senators from every state of the nation. WI gets their reps from...WI. I dont believe I have the words to express what I mean tonight, so I believe I am finished with at least this post for the night

X Factor · Feb 23, 2011

iamitter said:
You could say the same about the senate. Let's go back to 2008.
Apparently the people of US wanted this...they voted for the Democrats. Now they must deal with what is being presented to them.
And yet they didn't.

The filibuster was put there specifically to prevent the imposing of the majority on the minority. I don't see this as any different. Using parliamentary procedures to block a bill.

So now it's the Dems who are the "Party of No" or actually the "Party of No Show".

iamitter · Feb 23, 2011

Badmutha said:
So its ok for the Democrats to sit out the remainder of their term........to stop the bill?

Not going to work comes natural to Democrats.......
.
.
.

If that's what the constituents who voted for them want them to do, yes.
Otherwise, no.

I don't think skipping work is right, I'd much prefer they had a law like the US senate.

danarhea · Feb 23, 2011

The Democrats shouldn't be leaving the state, but the Republicans have handled this whole situation badly. They got the majorities in Wisconsin, Indiana, and Ohio, and what did they do with it? They attempted to bulldoze the other side like thugs. In doing that, they started a war they could very well lose. They are already talking about recalling 7 GOP Senators in Wisconsin. This was the most ham-handed use of power I have ever seen. Not only that, but allowing themselves to be bankrolled by the infamous Koch Brothers? That was a huge mistake, as the opposition is now fired up like I haven't seen them in years, and they will now be able to get a lot of mileage out of their accusations of class warfare.

The Republicans are like bulls in a china shop. They might have some good points to make, and good things to do, but that is all being drowned out by a war they were itching to fight. Well, they've now got their war, and public opinion is now turning against them in a very bad way.

iamitter · Feb 23, 2011

X Factor said:
So now it's the Dems who are the "Party of No" or actually the "Party of No Show".

Hey, if thats what the democrats want to do, so be it. If they did what the electorate wanted them to do, or if they didn't, results will show come next election.

iamitter · Feb 23, 2011

Gapeach said:
To me its a bit different. We get our senators from every state of the nation. WI gets their reps from...WI. I dont believe I have the words to express what I mean tonight, so I believe I am finished with at least this post for the night

We get our senators from our country. I don't see it as any different, but I'll let you finish your thought whenever you get back.

nonpareil · Feb 23, 2011

Gapeach said:
I hope this doesn't surprise anyone.

This is going to become the ploy of the democrats now when they arent the majority party anymore.

How often has this happened?

It’s a rare, but not an unheard-of, tactic, and fines have been a common response by the majority party. Here’s some history: In 2005, more than 130 bills died because of missed procedural deadlines when Democratic lawmakers boycotted the House for a day. In 1995, during a longer boycott, majority House Republicans fired back against boycotting Democrats by fining them an amount equal to the per diem, though they had refused their daily expenses while absent.

In 1991, Democrats decided against censuring absent Republicans but issued fines equal to their per diem rate, plus a percentage of the daily salary of full-time House Republican staff members. The Republicans had already pledged to give up their per diems while gone. In 1975, Democrats passed a censure of boycotting Republicans, fining them $50 per day.

Need-to-know: key Q&As on today's Statehouse exodus | The Indianapolis Star | indystar.com

zimmer · Feb 23, 2011

X Factor said:
44 - Indiana Democrats flee state legislature to avoid anti-union vote -- like Wisconsin counterparts

I think I know what Dems across the country are going to be known for this year. The campaign ads just write themselves don't they?

ROTFLOL... you've gotta love it. You could play McCartney's Band on the Run to what's happening.

Just think they are vacationing on the dime of the taxpayer when they should be in session casting critical votes.

BREAKING NEWS FROM ABC, MSNBC, CBS, CNN AND THE NY TIMES (In keeping with their truthful reporting) they report this is a Senator Swap Program. Dems from WI are going to IN, and Dems from IN to WI to get cultural experience.

.

nonpareil · Feb 23, 2011

Councilman said:
Why don't they stay and fight for what they believe?

It's because they are wrong and they can't justify what they do stand for.

Wrong. They avoid a fight with the majority they can't win. It's not commendable, but it's not a solely Democrats tactic either.

upsideguy · Feb 23, 2011

Councilman said:
Why don't they stay and fight for what they believe?

It's because they are wrong and they can't justify what they do stand for.

Yes, and of course you were a big advocate that the Senate should move quickly to up and down votes and were equally aghast at all the nomination holds.... am I right?

upsideguy · Feb 23, 2011

X Factor said:
Knowing they're going to lose is not a good reason to not show up to work.

... nor a good reason to filibuster... is that what you are saying since you want our legislators to cut right to the chase?

ludahai · Feb 23, 2011

I wonder if we are going to see more of this with redistricting later this year in Republican-controlled states?

randel · Feb 23, 2011

MaggieD said:
Spoken like a guy receiving a public pension.

no ma'am...no pension here.

Badmutha · Feb 23, 2011

iamitter said:
If that's what the constituents who voted for them want them to do, yes.
Otherwise, no.

I don't think skipping work is right, I'd much prefer they had a law like the US senate.

So the Democrat constitutent voted to put them in office.........

.........so they would run away from said office.......like a bunch of whiney brats.
.
.
.
.

roughdraft274 · Feb 23, 2011

X Factor said:
At least the GOP showed up to work. This make Dems look like cowards.

If the tides were turned everyone's opinions would be different. If Republicans had to do this to block the healthcare bill you'd be pissed if they didn't do it.

Besides, everyone is saying that this is bad for Dems but they are essentially standing up for their constituents. This is likely to fire up their base much like the healthcare bill did for the republicans. I see this as a good move for them politically.

Sixty-one percent of Americans surveyed for a USA Today/Gallup Poll said they would oppose a law in their own state similar to the one that has sparked massive protests in Wisconsin, while 33 percent said they would support such legislation. Six percent said they had no opinion.

Read more: Poll: Most oppose Wisconsin-style bills - Jennifer Epstein - POLITICO.com

X Factor · Feb 23, 2011

roughdraft274 said:
If the tides were turned everyone's opinions would be different. If Republicans had to do this to block the healthcare bill you'd be pissed if they didn't do it.

And if they had, you'd be pissed at the GOP for doing it.

Besides, everyone is saying that this is bad for Dems but they are essentially standing up for their constituents. This is likely to fire up their base much like the healthcare bill did for the republicans. I see this as a good move for them politically.

Yes, as I said, left wing shills will like this, but it isn't only the base that can get anyone elected. The independents aren't going to be impressed.

roughdraft274 · Feb 23, 2011

X Factor said:
Yes, as I said, left wing shills will like this, but it isn't only the base that can get anyone elected. The independents aren't going to be impressed.

Sixty-one percent of Americans surveyed for a USA Today/Gallup Poll said they would oppose a law in their own state similar to the one that has sparked massive protests in Wisconsin, while 33 percent said they would support such legislation. Six percent said they had no opinion.

I'm sure there's some independents in that 61 percent...

At least democrats and liberals aren't calling Walker a dictator simply cause he's doing something that doesn't poll well...

:doh

It's like both sides completely switched places yet the only thing that's remained the same is that everyone is absolutely positive that the other side will destroy america...

MaggieD · Feb 23, 2011

haymarket said:
Read the rules that govern the state legislatures in question and you can answer your own question with the facts.

Better idea to just pass along what you know....Councilman, at least in Wisconsin, legislators can't fillibuster...which, in itself, is poor procedure. Soooo......off they go. When they forbade it, they tried to do the right, sensible thing.

Guess if we ever get term limits (hahahaha!!), it'll be okay to avoid them if you change your name.

X Factor · Feb 23, 2011

roughdraft274 said:
I'm sure there's some independents in that 61 percent...

At least democrats and liberals aren't calling Walker a dictator simply cause he's doing something that doesn't poll well...

What do you mean? It's not conservatives holding those signs.

Regarding your poll, we've already talked about it in another thread. I could cite a few polls of my own.

http://www.ibtimes.com/articles/114185/20110218/unions.htm

http://www.gallup.com/poll/122744/Labor-Unions-Sharp-Slide-Public-Support.aspx

ksu_aviator · Feb 23, 2011

First, Texas Democrats ran away in 2003. Then Wisconsin Democrats fled earlier this month. Now Indiana Democrats run away. I don't know about you, but I always thought a jackass couldn't move faster than a slow stroll. Apparently they run as fast as the wind.

jamesrage · Feb 23, 2011

X Factor said:
44 - Indiana Democrats flee state legislature to avoid anti-union vote -- like Wisconsin counterparts

I think I know what Dems across the country are going to be known for this year. The campaign ads just write themselves don't they?

It looks like states across the country need to enact laws that make it to where votes can still go on if politicians flee their state to prevent a vote. Although I somehow doubt that they will do that.

Personally if I was republicans in those states I would be severely pissed at my elected officials for not using the option of fleeing the state to prevent legislation they opposed when the democrats had the majority.

DiAnna · Feb 23, 2011

nonpareil said:
Wrong. They avoid a fight with the majority they can't win. It's not commendable, but it's not a solely Democrats tactic either.

I think you're right. Seems to me that a few years back the GOP minority in one or more states pulled the same thing. I can't remember which states, but I do remember that I've been pissed off every time this tactic has been used, no matter which "side" was using it.

danarhea · Feb 24, 2011

MaggieD said:
Spoken like a guy receiving a public pension.

Hmm. I have a question here. If someone works all his life, he doesn't deserve a pension, if the pension comes from the public sector? The way I see it, he deserves a pension if he has worked in either the public or private sector.

Indiana Democrats flee state legislature to avoid anti-union vote

Sleeper Agent

Active member

Anti-Socialist

Sleeper Agent

Slayer of the DP Newsbot

Sleeper Agent

Sleeper Agent

Educating the Ignorant

Pragmatic Idealist

Pragmatic Idealist

Defender of the Faith

ThunderCougarFalconBird

Anti-Socialist

ThunderCougarFalconBird

Anti-Socialist

Democrats are the fascists

Hooter Babe

Slayer of the DP Newsbot