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Tea Party backers outnumbered in Wisconsin budget demonstrations

j-mac said:
If the teachers, and the other WI public servants don't want to give in a little toward their health care, and retirement just like everyone else, they need to find other employment. Public service sectors should have never been allowed to unionize in the first place.


j-mac
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Agree, education is essential, and those providing it can get representation without striking. Certainly the best way to get better wages is to quit teaching and enter a better paying profession, and if enough do that, the schools and the parents will have a bigger problem on their hands.
 
j-mac said:
I said damned near smartie. But never the less, instead of trying to cloud the issue, why don't you tell me why it is that I should pay for their HC, and Pension? Why can't they contribute?


j-mac
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The have agreed to do just that. Your wishes are granted.
 
j-mac said:
I said damned near smartie. But never the less, instead of trying to cloud the issue, why don't you tell me why it is that I should pay for their HC, and Pension? Why can't they contribute?


j-mac
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Wisconsin may be different. But teachers in AZ do contribute to their retirement. And their 401k is all their own doing, no matching contributions like so many private companies provide. My employer added 50% of my contributions, up to a maximum of 3% of my income. So I put in 3%, they put in 1.5%, every year.

Their healthcare is paid, for the teacher, but not their families. Takes $10K per year to add family to their "benefits". Our son gets better insurance for his wife and kids thru a private company, for less than half...they pay an annual deductible of $1500 per beneficiary and than the insurance company pays 100% from there on. Good thing they have that, their daughter's inoperable brain tumor and all the chemo for 4 years would have bankrupted them even if they only paid the customary 20%.
Actual state of AZ employees have a better health insurance plan than teachers, teachers get theirs through the school districts. Makes no sense that they are considered state employees for retirement purposes and then denied access to state health care benefits. Back when Janet Napolitano was governor, I was able to call in to a radio broadcast and ask about that specifically. She said she was working on adding teachers and municipal employees to the plan, but that never happened.
 
ReverendHellh0und said:
The teachers who called in a sick out, ought to be fired and stripped of their pensions.
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You should properly review their contract and determine if such a thing is possible.
 
haymarket said:
You should properly review their contract and determine if such a thing is possible.
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Probably isn't....but I would love to see that concept applied to all elected officials....corruption would dang near stop completely...
 
haymarket said:
You should properly review their contract and determine if such a thing is possible.
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Where does the contract state that lying about medical malaise is not in violation of said contract?


"sick outs" are not protests, but abuses of said contracts. They should be fired, and replaced.
 
ReverendHellh0und said:
Where does the contract state that lying about medical malaise is not in violation of said contract?


"sick outs" are not protests, but abuses of said contracts. They should be fired, and replaced.
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There were no real doctors....
I agree, fire them, but good luck replacing them....how about some parents step in and teach? BillyBob's mom can teach creationism, his dad can teach how to field strip an AK47. MaryJolene's parents can teach how to braid hair and grow good weed.

Something as important as the education of our children deserves professionals who get paid well, assuming the dead wood has been cleared out first.

Funny, mulit-million dollar contracts for sports "professionals" don't garner this kind of attention....
 
Councilman said:
Anyone who knows anything about economics knows that no Government like no individual can spend wildly and have expenditures exceed spending without maaking some drastic cuts at some point.
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Or raising taxes.
 
UtahBill said:
There were no real doctors....
I agree, fire them, but good luck replacing them....how about some parents step in and teach? BillyBob's mom can teach creationism, his dad can teach how to field strip an AK47. MaryJolene's parents can teach how to braid hair and grow good weed.

Something as important as the education of our children deserves professionals who get paid well, assuming the dead wood has been cleared out first.
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I don't think the unions allow for the removal of "dead wood" in fact, they have a last in first out, policy of tenure, no?


Funny, mulit-million dollar contracts for sports "professionals" don't garner this kind of attention....
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Sure they do, anytime there is a lockout. :prof




I would suggest they garner more.
 
ReverendHellh0und said:
I don't think the unions allow for the removal of "dead wood" in fact, they have a last in first out, policy of tenure, no?







Sure they do, anytime there is a lockout. :prof




I would suggest they garner more.
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just because unions protect employees doesn't mean employees can never be fired. even teachers.
 
UtahBill said:
There were no real doctors....
I agree, fire them, but good luck replacing them....how about some parents step in and teach? BillyBob's mom can teach creationism, his dad can teach how to field strip an AK47. MaryJolene's parents can teach how to braid hair and grow good weed.

Something as important as the education of our children deserves professionals who get paid well, assuming the dead wood has been cleared out first.

Funny, mulit-million dollar contracts for sports "professionals" don't garner this kind of attention....
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You don't think that there are thousands of certified teachers who are unemployed or work in other areas who would take 100K jobs? It was much more problematic when Reagan fired the air traffic controllers. I thought that would have been impossible to do at the time, but they worked through it. The reality is that no one is so essential that they can't be replaced. It is clear that these teachers think it is more important to do this political stunt than teach kids.

Who would want teachers like this? Maybe the best thing to do is let them finisg out the year and then fire them all, offer their replacements 75% of their pay and start with a new group of teachers who want to be teachers rather than Obama stuntartists.
 
hazlnut said:
Or raising taxes.
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That is the choice. What is interesting if you really live in California, the liberal voters refuse to raise taxes to fix their budget. Always take from someone else, but do not be part of the solution. What I call painless patriots.
 
Of course they were out numbered. Unions bussed in people from all over the US.
 
As organized labor hails an unprecedented moment of unity playing out amid a sea of supporters marching in Madison, Wis., union officials elsewhere are quietly wringing their hands about the risks of a high-stakes and historic loss against Gov. Scott Walker.

The six days of protests against Walker’s bill to curb collective bargaining rights have mesmerized cable news viewers and shown a fighting spirit and cohesion that labor groups have rarely displayed during 12 months of serving as public enemy number one in the eyes of tea party insurgents and newly empowered budget cutters.

Yet that sense of determined harmony comes at a potentially steep cost, and with no clear endgame. Some strategists and labor officials watching the protest conflagration from the outside are beginning to fret that a large-scale defeat in Wisconsin will have a devastating ripple effect, weakening labor state by state throughout the rest of the country.
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Labor faces a moment of truth - Ben Smith and Maggie Haberman - POLITICO.com

wisconsin "opens the gates for union losses on various fronts, like benefits"

the union urges teachers to return to work, the dnc "quickly distances itself from reports it was masterminding the protests"

"hostility to public sector workers is at an all time hi"

"the fight is playing out as yet another in a long string of recent state-based brawls over the hi cost of the public sector"

them's roger simon's JOURNOLISTERS from the drug tested PROFESSIONAL LEFT talkin, folks

worry
 
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haymarket said:
You should properly review their contract and determine if such a thing is possible.
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And that is a problem too. Poor skills, insubordination, or whatever the reason, you can't let the bad ones go. That is wrong.


j-mac
 
UtahBill said:
There were no real doctors....
I agree, fire them, but good luck replacing them....how about some parents step in and teach? BillyBob's mom can teach creationism, his dad can teach how to field strip an AK47. MaryJolene's parents can teach how to braid hair and grow good weed.

Something as important as the education of our children deserves professionals who get paid well, assuming the dead wood has been cleared out first.

Funny, mulit-million dollar contracts for sports "professionals" don't garner this kind of attention....
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Who should fire them? Am I confused or could these doctors be in their own practice? If they work for themselves, then there is nothing that can be done...
 
ReverendHellh0und said:
Many incompetent folk are protected by unions.
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I agree, but getting rid of unions won't ensure incompetent folk won't be protected by piss poor management or favors... I have seen women get promoted because they flirt and rub their boobs on male managers. I have also seen people get promotions for backstabbing and playing company politics too much, not because they are hardworkers.. :mad:
 
SheWolf said:
I agree, but getting rid of unions won't ensure incompetent folk won't be protected by piss poor management or favors...
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That much is probably true, but at least in business, if that sort of thing continues the business suffers and most likely shuts down. Government on the other hand, just continues to raise our taxes to pay for those who think they are the privileged class.


I have seen women get promoted because they flirt and rub their boobs on male managers. I have also seen people get promotions for backstabbing and playing company politics too much, not because they are hardworkers..
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Again, I am willing to bet those aren't the successful businesses out there. The bottom line here is why should government employees be allowed to unionize in the first place? My understanding is that Unions are in place to ensure that the greedy business people don't take advantage of them. The government is not a business.


j-mac
 
SheWolf said:
Who should fire them? Am I confused or could these doctors be in their own practice? If they work for themselves, then there is nothing that can be done...
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The University of Wisconsin is where most of them worked and the University is conducting an investigation.
 
Gill said:
I'm sure you have proof of this claim.........right ??
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as much proof that you have to the conttrary......
ask yourself, why would a real doctor do that? doesn't he have a busy practice to attend to? what is in it for him? and if he was to do it, would he do it in front of cameras? Ubercons are so easy to dupe....:2razz:
 
OK, is it time let go of a few thousand teachers yet? If the Dems don't crawl out of the sewer soon, cuts gotta be made.

It's not like Walker didn't say he was going to do all of this. Dems are familiar with following through on campaign promises.
 
I grew up in SE Texas, left in 64.....there were a few good teachers in my high school, a lot of average ones, one very good, one very bad....the very bad one had tenure, and the very good one left after the school board got on his case for exposing our tender minds to books like "To Kill a Mockingbird", and "The Scarlet Letter".

Some things are different now, but there will always be a mix of good, bad, and average teachers. If Wisconsin runs off the good ones, and it looks like they will, we can only hope that Wisconsin kids don't suffer for it.
 
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