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Obama Health-Care Reform Act Ruled Unconstitutional(edited)

Sgt Meowenstein said:
And all of that doesn't change the fact that the mandate was a Republican idea...yaaawn...
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Did you see this post?

Originally Posted by disneydude
Yeah...you stick with the Great Republican idea to require everyone to buy insurance.....That's the dumbest part of the whole program.


Try this link about whose idea it was, Republicans Spurn Once-Favored Health Mandate : NPR

A commitee hardly constitutes The Great Republican Idea,

Pauly, a conservative health economist at the University of Pennsylvania's Wharton School, says it wasn't just his idea. Back in the late 1980s — when Democrats were pushing not just a requirement for employers to provide insurance, but also the possibility of a government-sponsored single-payer system — "a group of economists and health policy people, market-oriented, sat down and said, 'Let's see if we can come up with a health reform proposal that would preserve a role for markets but would also achieve universal coverage.' "


In case you were wondering where your talking point came from.

Just wondering why you keep going on with the same thing over and over..........
 
cholla said:
Did you see this post?

Originally Posted by disneydude
Yeah...you stick with the Great Republican idea to require everyone to buy insurance.....That's the dumbest part of the whole program.


Try this link about whose idea it was, Republicans Spurn Once-Favored Health Mandate : NPR

A commitee hardly constitutes The Great Republican Idea,

Pauly, a conservative health economist at the University of Pennsylvania's Wharton School, says it wasn't just his idea. Back in the late 1980s — when Democrats were pushing not just a requirement for employers to provide insurance, but also the possibility of a government-sponsored single-payer system — "a group of economists and health policy people, market-oriented, sat down and said, 'Let's see if we can come up with a health reform proposal that would preserve a role for markets but would also achieve universal coverage.' "


In case you were wondering where your talking point came from.

Just wondering why you keep going on with the same thing over and over..........
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In the best case scenario - Republicans as far back as Nixon supported a mandate. Who did it first? We probably will never really know, but at least we know Republicans did support such a move and Democrats do now - so both have had their time with mandates. The difference is, a Conservative wouldn't like the mandate no matter which political party suggested it. Politically speaking if Republicans could get away with a mandate they probably would try. I'm just glad we have a few actual Conservatives in Congress --- whether or not that will make much of a difference - we'll have to see.

iamitter provided the link meowmix didn't or wasn't able to, and it turned out to be right. HOW right? That's up to you to decide, but it's enough for me.
 
Henrin said:
Every generation gets less socially liberal as they age. Your assumption that each generation gets more socially liberal is not really supported because more and more socially liberal things happen and therefore opens people up to more state control in coming generations.

What I'm saying here, is if I'm socially liberal and so and so has already been done, its very clear to all that I will support something more socially liberal than what is in place. Government control and the people that support is in an avalanche. In order to keep working for social liberal goals its only logical that you have to get more and more in the same direction.
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I completely understand where you're coming from. However, I wouldn't say they get less socially liberal themselves, just relative to everyone else. ie. My views on social issues today will doubtfully change, but there may arise new ones I don't support, which would make me more "conservative", but wouldn't actually change my views.

I don't know if I'd fit into this mantra though because I just don't support any government regulation of personal lives, regardless of what other people think about it.
 
Ockham said:
In the best case scenario - Republicans as far back as Nixon supported a mandate. Who did it first? We probably will never really know, but at least we know Republicans did support such a move and Democrats do now - so both have had their time with mandates. The difference is, a Conservative wouldn't like the mandate no matter which political party suggested it. Politically speaking if Republicans could get away with a mandate they probably would try. I'm just glad we have a few actual Conservatives in Congress --- whether or not that will make much of a difference - we'll have to see.

iamitter provided the link meowmix didn't or wasn't able to, and it turned out to be right. HOW right? That's up to you to decide, but it's enough for me.
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"Brown, whose election to replace the late Democratic Sen. Edward M. Kennedy almost led to the collapse of Obama's plan, said his opposition to the new law is over tax increases, Medicare cuts and federal overreach on a matter that should be left up to states. Not so much the requirement, which he voted for as a state lawmaker."

from that article.

I wonder how many other people in congress share his opinion?
 
Ockham said:
Ya. Seriously.

You apparently do not quite understand the concept of "evidence". You writing someting and attributing it to someone is not evidence... and I'm sorry but, you're way to new to this board for me to take you word on anything.



Show me the source pal, or zip-it with the "it was a Republican idea" nonsense.
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Man, you are too much. Even by fright-wing standards you take the cake. You apparently do not understand what evidence is. It's not an opinion. It's fact. I posted NUMEROUS fact-based articles where even REPUBLICANS (including one of the Republican architects of the mandate) are quoted admitting that the mandate was a Republican idea. That's called proof. Do you get it yet? I have already shown all the evidence that a normal person would need. Unless you can prove wrong the articles that I cited, zip it yourself. You are completely wrong and you know it. You ought to be embarrassed. Hell, at this point I'm embarrassed for you.
 
Sgt Meowenstein said:
Man, you are too much. Even by fright-wing standards you take the cake. You apparently do not understand what evidence is. It's not an opinion. It's fact. I posted NUMEROUS fact-based articles where even REPUBLICANS (including one of the Republican architects of the mandate) are quoted admitting that the mandate was a Republican idea. That's called proof. Do you get it yet? I have already shown all the evidence that a normal person would need. Unless you can prove wrong the articles that I cited, zip it yourself. You are completely wrong and you know it. You ought to be embarrassed. Hell, at this point I'm embarrassed for you.
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I gave him a source he didn't dispute. What he was asking for honestly wasn't that difficult to find. Maybe 30 seconds on google.
 
Ockham said:
Beautiful. This at least provides a starting point - now I can go back and look at alternatives to Hillary Care and what arguments Republicans gave at that time. And for the record: The Mandate was a Republican idea.
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Yeah, no **** sherlock. I cited numerous articles proving exactly that. But you continued to say that I didn't prove anything. But now that you see one from Fox, you finally admit that the mandate was in fact a Republican idea. Typical conservative.
 
iamitter said:
I gave him a source he didn't dispute. What he was asking for honestly wasn't that difficult to find. Maybe 30 seconds on google.
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I gave him no less than 5 different sources. He tried disputing every one of them. I even provided one that had a quote from one of the Republicans who came up with the idea of the mandate. He still said I didn't prove it. I guess after getting it hammered into his skull over and over, he finally got a half of a clue.
 
half trillion in cuts to medicare, all the while obama simultaneously expands its already teetering enrollment by millions:

Capitol Briefing - Senate votes to keep Medicare cuts

er costs increase:

ER visits, costs climb - The Boston Globe

doctors refuse new medicare patients:

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/02/business/retirementspecial/02health.html

the doc fix passes, another quarter tril unaccounted for:

Senate passes doc fix - The Hill's Healthwatch

another quarter T double counted:

Budget Office Rebuts Democratic Claims on Medicare (Update1) - Bloomberg

our already broken backed states are burdened with 200 billion in the form of brand new medicaid enrollees

Governors balk over what healthcare bill will cost states - The Boston Globe

live it, libs, love it

it's all YOURS
 
Sgt Meowenstein said:
Yeah, no **** sherlock. I cited numerous articles proving exactly that. But you continued to say that I didn't prove anything. But now that you see one from Fox, you finally admit that the mandate was in fact a Republican idea. Typical conservative.
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Glad to see you can discuss things calmly. Here's a tip for you, when you're asked to provide "evidence", look up the definition of the word when you obviously don't know what it means. Second, when asked multiple times, point the person back to the # of your post if you claimed to have already posted something. See each post has a # in the blue bar on the right. Third, learn that everyone doesn't take what you say as the word of God - you're just another progressive Ed Shultz type with an internet connection, eating cheetos in his mothers basement.

Do me a favor will ya pal? Go into your user control panel, and put me on ignore. The kind of stupid your selling is of no interest to me. I give you 3 months before you're out on your ear.

:bon_voyag
 
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the mandate was a Republican idea.
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So the liberal horde let the Conservatives put a poison pill in Berry’s health care takeover bill???? They had all the votes and let this kill card be played by the Republicans?? I guess the dems are as stupid as I thought.
 
Iron River said:
So the liberal horde let the Conservatives put a poison pill in Berry’s health care takeover bill???? They had all the votes and let this kill card be played by the Republicans?? I guess the dems are as stupid as I thought.
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Do you even bother to read?

I don't know what anyone else was trying to prove, but all I did was show that the mandate originally stems from a republican idea in the 90's and that not all the republicans voted against this bill because of the mandate. Many actually declared their reasons as the tax hikes.
 
in the 90's...

of the last century

LOL!
 
The Prof said:
in the 90's...

of the last century

LOL!
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I've got a quarter here. Says it was made in 1994. Guess that makes it pretty LOL! to you, no?
You know, just cause something's in the past doesn't make it untrue.
 
Well, a past president is known to have said, "I didn't leave the democratic party, the democratic party left me." I think that throws a huge monkey wrench in the gears of people who want to go back 15+ years. Why stop at 1993-1994? Why not talk about things that happened in the 50s? 20s? Roaring 20's right?
 
dontworrybehappy said:
Well, a past president is known to have said, "I didn't leave the democratic party, the democratic party left me." I think that throws a huge monkey wrench in the gears of people who want to go back 15+ years. Why stop at 1993-1994? Why not talk about things that happened in the 50s? 20s? Roaring 20's right?
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You know, the past always looks better than it was. Just saying . . . . ;) :coffeepap
 
Ockham said:
Glad to see you can discuss things calmly. Here's a tip for you, when you're asked to provide "evidence", look up the definition of the word when you obviously don't know what it means. Second, when asked multiple times, point the person back to the # of your post if you claimed to have already posted something. See each post has a # in the blue bar on the right. Third, learn that everyone doesn't take what you say as the word of God - you're just another progressive Ed Shultz type with an internet connection, eating cheetos in his mothers basement.
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Here's a tip for you, champ. Before you go around accusing me of not providing evidence, stop and look at the evidence that I already provided just for you. I Linked NUMEROUS articles about the mandate. Every single one of them was enough proof to satisfy a ****ing five yr old. But you.. Oh you're so ****ing special that you ignored every single one of them because you were too blinded by your own partisan views. I'm not going to link my previous posts just to have you ignore them again. If you want to see the evidence that I provided just for you, then read the posts that I already made. I don't expect anybody to take my word for anything. Which is why I cited articles as proof. Not my word. Articles. Evidence. Proof. Let me spell it out for you again: I didn't just say "The mandate was a Republican idea" and leave it at that. I cited articles with quotes from Republicans who said that the mandate was their idea. DO you get it yet, or do you need sock puppets to help explain it to you?

Ockham said:
Do me a favor will ya pal? Go into your user control panel, and put me on ignore. The kind of stupid your selling is of no interest to me. I give you 3 months before you're out on your ear.

:bon_voyag
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Yeah, you ****ing wish, PAL. You want to ignore me, then do it yourself. Personally I enjoy reading your ridiculous posts. It makes me feel better knowing that I'm not you. You gonna throw me out on my ear? Well come and do it, tough guy. I'm not going anywhere. Deal with it.
 
Ockham said:
The kind of stupid your selling is of no interest to me.
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By the way, before you go around calling me stupid, you should learn the difference between 'your' and 'you're'.

smiley-laughing025.gif


teabaggingcc5.jpg
 
One more thing, Ockham. I just came across this post of yours.

Ockham said:
I'm totally willing to accept that it was initially a Republican idea... I just want to see someone other Meowmix [Sgt Meowenstein] over here show me a source.
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SO all that time you were whining that I didn't prove anything (even though I did repeatedly), you knew good and well that I proved my argument. You just chose to ignore the evidence because it came from me. Epic failure. You should be thoroughly embarrassed at this point. Man, I owned you big time. BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA FAIL
 
iamitter said:
You know, just cause something's in the past doesn't make it untrue.
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it's just such a loser, sir

you're never gonna convince THIS electorate that the republicans have smudged a fingerprint of responsibility on THIS pig of an obamacare

not after what's gone down the last 2 years

1993 is history, not politics

americans TODAY are concerned with:

Capitol Briefing - Senate votes to keep Medicare cuts

ER visits, costs climb - The Boston Globe

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/02/business/retirementspecial/02health.html

Senate passes doc fix - The Hill's Healthwatch

Budget Office Rebuts Democratic Claims on Medicare (Update1) - Bloomberg

Governors balk over what healthcare bill will cost states - The Boston Globe[/QUOTE]

Director's Blog » Blog Archive » Additional Information on CBO’s Preliminary Analysis of H.R. 2

i really don't think senator mccaskill, et al, is taking her stand AGAINST the mandate because bob dole, or some equally obsolete figure from antiquity, once in the days of hillary-care floated a trial balloon for a couple weeks

bottom line---why is everyone running away?

look it like this---you won't hear a one of em, mccaskill, nelson, nelson, webb, manchin, lieberman, tester, budget chair kent conrad, etc---mention a word about this mandate being "a republican idea" when they take to the floor, whichever way they ultimately fall

it's simply too ludicrous

ie, a loser

stay up
 
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I never said anything about convincing the electorate. I just wanted to straighten out the facts.

The American population isn't informed a lot of the time and there's not much we can do about it.


And what Americans are concerned with 'TODAY' can be found here Most Important Problem
Healthcare only 13% list as most important and most of those people are probably those who can't afford it (thought admittedly this is just a logical conjecture on my part)
 
iamitter said:
I just wanted to straighten out the facts.
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i know, but it's a point, in today's politics, with no direction

The American population isn't informed a lot of the time and there's not much we can do about it.
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well, YOU could read the LINKS from nyt, wapo, the globe, the hill, bloomberg, the hill, the cbo...

Healthcare only 13% list as most important and most of those people are probably those who can't afford it (thought admittedly this is just a logical conjecture on my part)
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so now obamacare is a small concern...

please

the passion on these pages exposes that particular as specious

too much microscopic argumentation i'm hearing

tsuanmi tuesday told the truth

stay up
 
iamitter said:
I never said anything about convincing the electorate. I just wanted to straighten out the facts.

The American population isn't informed a lot of the time and there's not much we can do about it.


And what Americans are concerned with 'TODAY' can be found here Most Important Problem
Healthcare only 13% list as most important and most of those people are probably those who can't afford it (thought admittedly this is just a logical conjecture on my part)
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Your right if the public and been informed Obama would not be president.
 
I'm not sure why you're harping on me for this so much. I don't even support the bill.
I just like the facts to be on the table when discussing these things so at the very least the citizens on these forums aren't misinformed.
 
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