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White House to Push Gun Control

Johnny Centrist said:
I am a gun owner and recreational shooter and personally I think that guns should have annual registration requirements like vehicles do. People buy guns and then there is no accountability on that gun again to make sure its still in a qualified person's ownership. Many guns end up in criminal hands because criminals use legitimate people to buy their guns and then they pass them on to criminals who use them in crimes. Why not hold people accountable to their firearms every year like we do with their cars?
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Wow. I did not expect this coming from a libertarian. I'm pretty liberal and even this would probably piss me off lol.
 
Ockham said:
Filing off the serial number? Off the hook? You're aware that such serial number removal is not an effective way to disguise a weapon's orgins and hasn't since the 1950's. Acid etching has been around since the 1950's and has been used on cars and firearms. Been watching Jimmy Cagney and Humphrey Bogart movies again? :lamo

Good idea. Let's get rid of cars too. Cars kill 30,000 people a year, and injure 2.3 million adult drivers and passengers every year and is the leading cause of death of those ages 5-35 in the United States. If cars were not everywhere, it would not be so easy for people to have accidents and kill themselves and others in them. We need to ban all moving vehicles immediately!

CDC - Motor Vehicle Safety
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I am well aware of acid burning, just making a quick point, but if that made you feel better about yourself, I am glad I could help.
 
Catz Part Deux said:
Or rattle snakes.

I know people who've had intruders come into their home in the middle of the night. I'd damn sure wish I had a gun if that happened.
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You said most murders were caused by domestic disputes, so why do I wnat a gun in the house.......? I am married!
 
And all of this self-protection talk makes me wonder where you guys live, Beirut?

And Catz if violent crime is more prevalent in big cities, why do we need guns in the burbs to protect ourselves?
 
tlmorg02 said:
And all of this self-protection talk makes me wonder where you guys live, Beirut?

And Catz if violent crime is more prevalent in big cities, why do we need guns in the burbs to protect ourselves?
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just in case, you never know I guess.
 
Johnny Centrist said:
If that's what it takes to keep more guns out of the hands of crazies and criminals and ensure they are in law abiding citizens hands, yes. Cut out bureaucracy where its not needed and put some in where it is. Then learn how to spell bureaucracy before complaining that we have too much of it.
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See, the problem is that with ever new tweak of the laws, they accomplish nothing. It's all rhetoric and BS. In the end, they don't stop anything and merely make the wait longer. People like you get all worked up over something that simply will not go away.

Johnny Centrist said:
Then learn how to spell bureaucracy before complaining that we have too much of it.
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So...you're like a douche in training? Or just hoping to be the most clevererist person in the whole wide world? Meh. I don't worry about the spell check sometimes. Typically I throw it into Google to get it. "Ahmenadejed" is another one I tend to massacre. I just rely on people to be less sophmoric and mature enough to overlook such trivial things in order to actually have the discussion. Obviously, maturity may be lacking for some. Careful to check all my spelling,now. Maybe make sure my sentence grammer is perfect while you're at it.
 
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tlmorg02 said:
So you think it is bad to stop mentally imbalanced people from obtaining assault rifles?
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I guess you don't have much of a clue of what an assault rifle is

read the 1934 NFA and the 1986 Hughes amendment so you won't make another mistake of such proportions again
 
tlmorg02 said:
And all of this self-protection talk makes me wonder where you guys live, Beirut?
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Well, Republicans tend to believe that Al-Queda, black people, and Democrats are hiding in the bushes. Liberals tend to believe that utopia is just one absent gun away. ......Hey Johnny Centrist...how's my spelling? Am I doing OK for ya?
 
MaggieD said:
One nut case? Surely you jest. I can understand why strong supporters of gun rights see every regulation as the camel's nose under the tent; but, in reality, mentally unstable people should not be allowed to purchase or possess firearms. Argue that point, and one just looks foolish.
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all these laws do are hinder and infringe on the rights of honest people--which is what many on the left want

I have a great idea-YOU CANNOT BUY COCAINE UNLESS A DOCTOR PRESCRIBES IT TO YOU

THAT WILL STOP ALL THOSE CRACK HEADS FROM ABUSING COCAINE BASE
 
Johnny Centrist said:
I am a gun owner and recreational shooter and personally I think that guns should have annual registration requirements like vehicles do. People buy guns and then there is no accountability on that gun again to make sure its still in a qualified person's ownership. Many guns end up in criminal hands because criminals use legitimate people to buy their guns and then they pass them on to criminals who use them in crimes. Why not hold people accountable to their firearms every year like we do with their cars?
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since a criminal cannnot be forced to incriminate himself your silly idea cannot even be applied to criminals.

no one is trying to ban cars and cars are not constitutionally protected

your suggestion has no merit
 
TurtleDude said:
all these laws do are hinder and infringe on the rights of honest people--which is what many on the left want

I have a great idea-YOU CANNOT BUY COCAINE UNLESS A DOCTOR PRESCRIBES IT TO YOU

THAT WILL STOP ALL THOSE CRACK HEADS FROM ABUSING COCAINE BASE
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IMO, even the staunchest supporter of gun rights, even the most governmentally-paranoid, should not object to keeping guns out of the hands of people who are mentally unstable. FOIDs issued and renewed by simply paying your fee...no background checks...

If legislation can be developed that plugs some holes, why would anyone oppose it??
 
TurtleDude said:
all these laws do are hinder and infringe on the rights of honest people--which is what many on the left want

I have a great idea-YOU CANNOT BUY COCAINE UNLESS A DOCTOR PRESCRIBES IT TO YOU

THAT WILL STOP ALL THOSE CRACK HEADS FROM ABUSING COCAINE BASE
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Don't get worked up. The morons are merely grandstanding until other morons start grandstanding on flag burning and until other morons start grandstanding on abortion laws.

But it is funny how we celebrate the skilled surgeon for his use of the instrument, but hate the instrument of the murderer. If they had it their way, the surgeon would get no credit. It's all in the scalpel. How's my spelling Johnny?! I have to admit that I had to Google "scalpel," but I made the effort just for you.
 
Car Crash Stats: There were nearly 6,420,000 auto accidents in the United States in 2005. The financial cost of these crashes is more than 230 Billion dollars. 2.9 million people were injured and 42,636 people killed. About 115 people die every day in vehicle crashes in the United States -- one death every 13 minutes.

The most recent records I can find are for 2004, all told 29,569 people were killed by firearms that year . of that number nearly 14,000 are suicides
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looking at those two stats, wouldn't we be better off banning cars? Look at the benefits, people would move closer to work, lessening urban sprawl. they would either bike or walk to work, putting them in better health, reducing out health care costs. We have just ran those evil oil companies out of business, no need for gas anymore. Ohhhh we saved the world too .. because we just made it much more "greener" global warming would come ot a screeching halt.
All of our grain production could now go to food .. thus reducing the cost of our food in the markdets. ALL THIS besides stopping over 40,000 needless deaths per year.

Boy I just bet every liberal should be 125% behind this right ?? . Don't ban gun ban cars far more benefits.
 
MaggieD said:
IMO, even the staunchest supporter of gun rights, even the most governmentally-paranoid, should not object to keeping guns out of the hands of people who are mentally unstable. FOIDs issued and renewed by simply paying your fee...no background checks...

If legislation can be developed that plugs some holes, why would anyone oppose it??
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It's not that. It's because the Left constantly goes after gun laws whenever the time is right (as if they don't own guns) and they usually try to get extreme along the way in their rhetoric. In other words, every dead gang banger in L.A. is because some hunter in Georgia has too many guns. Then the Right throws up the shields and the issue goes no where. In the end, we still all have ourguns and we can always go get more. It's a game of BS for which Americans allow themselves to get sucked into.

Like I've stated...when do we start the great Washington flag burning debate again?
 
The Barbarian said:
looking at those two stats, wouldn't we be better off banning cars? Look at the benefits, people would move closer to work, lessening urban sprawl. they would either bike or walk to work, putting them in better health, reducing out health care costs. We have just ran those evil oil companies out of business, no need for gas anymore. Ohhhh we saved the world too .. because we just made it much more "greener" global warming would come ot a screeching halt.
All of our grain production could now go to food .. thus reducing the cost of our food in the markdets. ALL THIS besides stopping over 40,000 needless deaths per year.

Boy I just bet every liberal should be 125% behind this right ?? . Don't ban gun ban cars far more benefits.
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Well, that's not the way it works fella. You see, it's not the scalpel, it's the surgeon. It's not the car, it's the driver. It's not the brush, it's the painter. ......It's not the killer, it's the gun? But what if I jab a paint brush into a person's eye? Can I then blame the brush? Or can the scalpel take the blame if I use it to slash a neck?

The way this works is that people genuinely feel as if they are above the rest if they call for further gun laws. That somehow that makes them more civilized than those who have never killed a thing in their lives, but own guns. It makes themfeel as if they are taking charge of the situation or gaining control of society's wreckless abandon. Most may profess to only care about the looseness of the laws, but ultimately the majority of them are of petrified of guns and simply wish to remove their fears by making everyone else suck on it.

**I know I used a lot of bigger words in here Johnnie but maybe you could help me out and check my spelling?
 
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tlmorg02 said:
I am well aware of acid burning, just making a quick point, but if that made you feel better about yourself, I am glad I could help.
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If you were well aware of it, you probably wouldn't have made the cliche comment about filing off serial numbers. I see you didn't feel like commenting on the automobiles following your logic. And yes, it does make me feel good that I've helped educate you in some small way.
 
I oppose FOID, especially at the national level, for reasons I've already explained elsewhere. It turns a right into a privilege and makes it too easily infringed upon.

If FOID ever becomes national law, I will not cooperate with it. It is a needless and excessive intrusion on a fundamantal right.

We already have background checks via NICS. NICS shows if you're a convicted felon. NICS may show if you've been involuntarily committed or had your gun rights removed by a court. NICS does NOT show things like "considered creepy by everyone who knows him". How exactly can we get stuff like that in NICS?

Character references? Please. Almost anyone can get three people to sign off on "he's a jolly good fellow."

There are some things for which there is no reasonable legislative fix.
 
MaggieD said:
IMO, even the staunchest supporter of gun rights, even the most governmentally-paranoid, should not object to keeping guns out of the hands of people who are mentally unstable. FOIDs issued and renewed by simply paying your fee...no background checks...
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It depends. If you define "governmentally-paranoid" as being mentally unstable; then they'd oppose it.

MaggieD said:
If legislation can be developed that plugs some holes, why would anyone oppose it??
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It would depend on the specifics of the legislation, what it authorizes the government to do, and the effects that it would have on the ability of the individual to exercise their rights and liberties.
 
Ockham said:
If you were well aware of it, you probably wouldn't have made the cliche comment about filing off serial numbers. I see you didn't feel like commenting on the automobiles following your logic. And yes, it does make me feel good that I've helped educate you in some small way.
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Anyway...returning to adult land, using the automobile example is a farse, it is not designed solely for the purpose of death. But I needed to educate you in that small way.
 
Ultimately, I am not for hindering people from owning guns. After all the hoorah I will admit that I am an avid gun owner. They are fun at the range and most people do not use them for bad. My point to all the debate, besides being fun, is that we always have the same discussions over guns and insane people, yet nothing gets done and another crazy shoots up a mall and what is the most egregious for me is that a CHILD got killed. We need to take a second look when a 9-year old cannot go see her representative without being safe.

As to the machine guns and bannanna clips, banning them would make no real difference, but like my shooting partners and I like to say, never fear the guy who needs fifty rounds, he probably can't shoot for s**t! Fear the guy with the single shot rifle, cause he only needs one!
 
tlmorg02 said:
Anyway...returning to adult land, using the automobile example is a farse, it is not designed solely for the purpose of death. But I needed to educate you in that small way.
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You're right, it is unreasonable... because owning a car and driving are not Constitutional rights, so they are less important than gun rights.
 
So basically this is a "Won't someone PLEASE think of the children" argument?
 
tlmorg02 said:
Anyway...returning to adult land, using the automobile example is a farse, it is not designed solely for the purpose of death. But I needed to educate you in that small way.
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It's "farce", and guns are a tool and not made for the sole purpose of death. Just as a knife is not made for the sole purpose of death. Guns are used as a tool, for sport, at one time for hunting and survival, and are now used for competition, self defense and yes, for war too. To simplistically say guns have one purpose is obtuse. Apparently my work with you is just starting - just call me sensei.
 
Goshin said:
You're right, it is unreasonable... because owning a car and driving are not Constitutional rights, so they are less important than gun rights.
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Easy killer, no one wants to take your gun. We would just hack eachother up with swords.
 
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