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Chinese Pianist Plays Propaganda Tune at White House

StillBallin75 said:
Second this thought. Ludahai, can you elaborate on the meaning of the lyrics and how exactly they are anti-American in the extreme?
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no time to go over all of them and deal with the translations because I have to prepare for class... the wolves reference that was already pointed out was specifically pointed at the U.S. This was one word used to describe the Americans in the 1950s... furthermore, this has a long history of being included in anti-American propaganda... saw it first hand when I lived there in May 1999...
 
ludahai said:
In no way should a state dinner be given for dictator Hu.
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You're entitled to you opinion, but thankfully our country is run by people who are a bit more on the ball than this.
 
ludahai said:
The symbolic nature of the language and the song would be lost on those not familiar with it

note: just noticed someone posted the part about 'wolves' You simply don't understand the importance of this song in Chinese anti-America propoganda... I heard it several times in May 1999 following the bombing of the embassy...
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Are you familiar with it? Could you please enlighten us as to what the lyrics are actually referring to? Just curious, since there doesn't seem to be any actual reference to Americans in the lyrics.
 
Hatuey said:
Anybody care to tell us what is actually anti-American about the song itself?
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This line:
But if the wolves come
What greets them are the hunting rifles
 
StillBallin75 said:
Not so much "illegally forced down" as much as the dumb fighter jock had such balls that he ended up colliding with it. But I agree that the CCP are some of the greatest propagandists in human history.
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I have some information on this. The tactic used by the PLAAF pilot was a tactic the Chinese air force practices. The problem for the Chinese pilot is that he came too close. I discovered this from talking to Chinese on AsiaFinest and ChinaDaily BBS. They have used this tactic previously and didn't cause a collision.

The Chinese are determined that New American military forces are going to stay at least two hundred miles away from the Chinese coast. New America doesn't have the balls to deal with Chinese nationalism.
 
ludahai said:
In no way should a state dinner be given for dictator Hu.
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Sometimes you just have to be the better man and be courteous even to those you see as your adversaries. Especially when you're trying to extract concessions and influence someone else's policy. It's just an inherent part of the give-and-take nature of international relations.
 
Hatuey said:
.... yes... I sense the anti-American attitude...

o.o
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You're being unreasonable if you are trying to claim that the song does not have an anti-American association. At the same time it is a huge overreaction for some of these other folks to think that allowing a Chinese pianist to play an anti-American song at a state dinner makes us "look weak."
 
Albert Di Salvo said:
I have some information on this. The tactic used by the PLAAF pilot was a tactic the Chinese air force practices. The problem for the Chinese pilot is that he came too close. I discovered this from talking to Chinese on AsiaFinest and ChinaDaily BBS. They have used this tactic previously and didn't cause a collision.

The Chinese are determined that New American military forces are going to stay at least two hundred miles away from the Chinese coast. New America doesn't have the balls to deal with Chinese nationalism.
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The 200-mile thing is BS and has little basis in international law. International law only recognizes airspace and waters out to 12 nautical miles off the coast as being territorial. As for the fighter pilot, his balls were obviously too large for his own good.
 
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It was wrong for the Chinese to do this and I don't think Obama should allow them to treat him, and the United States like that.
 
digsbe said:
It was wrong for the Chinese to do this and I don't think Obama should allow them to treat him, and the United States like that.
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There's an old expression, "You have to pick your battles." I think Obama is wise not to make a big deal out of this.
 
digsbe said:
It was wrong for the Chinese to do this and I don't think Obama should allow them to treat him, and the United States like that.
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Somewhat agree. However Obama in all likelihood probably didn't know what was going on, and who can really blame him? It's a song that he's probably rarely or never heard before.
 
Guy Incognito said:
There's an old expression, "You have to pick your battles." I think Obama is wise not to make a big deal out of this.
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I think he's wrong to not. He invited the Chinese to a State dinner in our country and they publicly flex their muscle and offend us in our own capitol by playing their propaganda. Would China take it kindly if we played "America, **** YEAH!" From Team America World Police over in Beijing if Hu invited Obama over there for a Chinese state dinner? I think it's highly disrespectful and almost like "international trolling" in regards to what China did.

StillBallin75 said:
Somewhat agree. However Obama in all likelihood probably didn't know what was going on, and who can really blame him? It's a song that he's probably rarely or never heard before.
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I agree, but I feel that knowing after the fact he should do something or at least go to Hu privately about what happened.
 
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StillBallin75 said:
The 200-mile thing is BS and has little basis in international law. International law only recognizes airspace and waters out to 12 nautical miles off the coast as being territorial. As for the fighter pilot, his balls were obviously too large for his own good.
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The Chinese intend to remake the international order. Ultimately they will succeed. The old international order created by the West is losing its power. Look at what the Chinese did to America and the Europeans at the Copenhagen Global Warming Conference in December 2009.
 
Guy Incognito said:
There's an old expression, "You have to pick your battles." I think Obama is wise not to make a big deal out of this.
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Obama is deadly effective in beating up American conservatives. He is ineffably weak in dealing with China.
 
Albert Di Salvo said:
Obama is deadly effective in beating up American conservatives. He is ineffably weak in dealing with China.
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If it was Sarah Palin playing the same song on the piano the Left would have been in an uproar.

But get anyone else doing it and they'll quickly back off and look the other way with their 'nothing to see here, folks' clumsiness.

They always manage to get around with one foot in their mouths but occasionally, and almost miraculously, they frequently fit the other one in there as well.
 
digsbe said:
I think he's wrong to not. He invited the Chinese to a State dinner in our country and they publicly flex their muscle and offend us in our own capitol by playing their propaganda. Would China take it kindly if we played "America, **** YEAH!" From Team America World Police over in Beijing if Hu invited Obama over there for a Chinese state dinner? I think it's highly disrespectful and almost like "international trolling" in regards to what China did.
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Well that's just it. Let's assume the worst here (and there is at least some evidence that Lang was unaware of the political associations of the song, but for the sake of argument let's assume) that this was a deliberate attempt of the Chinese to thumb their noses at the United States. What then? Cancel the performance? Cancel the state dinner? Economic sanctions against China? What would satisfy you? War?

It's nonsense. Proper diplomacy demands that the Chinese be given the benefit of the doubt. The role of the president at a state dinner is to be the gracious host, not to be prickly or boorish. If the Chinese were rude in their choice of song, that does not mean that retribution must be exacted. That is not how international diplomacy works. The fact is that the US is so strong that we don't even need China's respect. But we'd be a lot less likely to get it by acting like petulant children over a perceived insult. If it looks weak to permit such a thing, it looks far, far weaker to lose one's cool over it.
 
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The Chinese intend to remake the international order.
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No doubt. Who doesn't want to be more powerful?

Ultimately they will succeed.
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I'm not so sure. Just because one has intentions doesn't mean one has the ability. Their economy is not innovation-based. After awhile they will be stuck in the middle-income trap if they think that maintaining their manufacturing dominance is the way to go, instead of moving to high-tech service-based economy. Even if their GDP exceeds ours in 20 yrs, their per capita income and living standards will still be a lot lower.

The old international order created by the West is losing its power. Look at what the Chinese did to America and the Europeans at the Copenhagen Global Warming Conference in December 2009.
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No disagreement here. It's what happens when u owe some guy trillions of dollars.

Obama is deadly effective in beating up American conservatives.
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Haha, funny. From my perspective Obama is deadly effective at caving in to conservatives, who in general play the politics game much better than liberals/Democrats. The idea of Obama "beating up" on anyone, to me personally, is laughable. His governing style has been anything but aggressive or assertive.

He is ineffably weak in dealing with China.
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Who isn't? If I were China i'd just keep ****ing around and doing what i'm doing to make myself stronger. When you owe someone trillions of dollars you're not really in a position to bargain for anything...
 
Grant said:
If it was Sarah Palin playing the same song on the piano the Left would have been in an uproar.

But get anyone else doing it and they'll quickly back off and look the other way with their 'nothing to see here, folks' clumsiness.

They always manage to get around with one foot in their mouths but occasionally, and almost miraculously, they frequently fit the other one in there as well.
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I highly doubt Sarah Palin would be playing anti-American propaganda.
 
:lol: That's hilarious, well done that piano player. To put it in the local vernacular:

successful-troll-is-successful.jpg
 
Guy Incognito said:
You're being unreasonable if you are trying to claim that the song does not have an anti-American association. At the same time it is a huge overreaction for some of these other folks to think that allowing a Chinese pianist to play an anti-American song at a state dinner makes us "look weak."
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Maybe it's my lack of knowledge in regards to Chinese culture. I just don't see it. The song sounds like a regular 50s song. Bland. Melodic. Nothing inherently 'anti-American' about it. However I do find it funny that ludahai, defender of both catholic and anti-semitic historical revisionism is now pretending that history actually matters. I guess it's easier to complain about a song than it is to build up enough strength to call out the pedophile priests in his church.
 
Hatuey said:
Maybe it's my lack of knowledge in regards to Chinese culture. I just don't see it. The song sounds like a regular 50s song. Bland. Melodic. Nothing inherently 'anti-American' about it.
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I can't speak to other posters on this forum, but the song in question needn't be inherently anti-American in order to have a history of use in anti-American propaganda, as the evidence indicates certainly seems to be the case. I can also see how the song may have been written as a generally patriotic song that was appropriated for propaganda purposes.
 
ludahai said:
Not the same...
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How exactly is it different? Read the lyrics for the Star-Spangled Banner very carefully.

The Chinese government has and still does regard the U.S. with disdain.
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Not true at all. This is not to say China does not consider the U.S. a threat, it would be stupid for them to consider otherwise. Still, their attitude is hardly one of disdain, more like restrained optimism.

I was living in China when the bombing of the embassy in Yugoslavia occurred and the anti-American propoganda (which this song played a part) that went on for weeks on end.
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Why is it that whenever the Chinese explode in a nationalist fervor it must always get described by people like you as being against something? I mean, we bombed their embassy and killed several of their people. They had a right to be pissed. Expressing pride in your country is a normal response in that sort of situation.
 
Likewise, would the reverse be interpreted the same and accepted?
 
Demon of Light said:
How exactly is it different? Read the lyrics for the Star-Spangled Banner very carefully.



Not true at all. This is not to say China does not consider the U.S. a threat, it would be stupid for them to consider otherwise. Still, their attitude is hardly one of disdain, more like restrained optimism.



Why is it that whenever the Chinese explode in a nationalist fervor it must always get described by people like you as being against something? I mean, we bombed their embassy and killed several of their people. They had a right to be pissed. Expressing pride in your country is a normal response in that sort of situation.
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The Chinese Communist Party would call you Lao Peng.
 
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