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Bin Laden threatens France in new message

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/22/world/asia/22binladen.html

PARIS — An audio message attributed to Osama bin Laden warned Friday that the fate of French hostages held by Islamic militants would hinge on the withdrawal of French forces from Afghanistan. In response, the French government promptly reaffirmed its commitment to the military mission there.

“We are determined to pursue our action in favor of the Afghan people, with our allies,” Bernard Valero, the Foreign Ministry spokesman, told reporters. About 3,750 French soldiers are stationed in Afghanistan.

And according to Peter L. Bergen, AlQaeda is not in the best of shapes and is making enemies left, right and center. So who cares what their retard "leader" says?:

How to lose friends and alienate Muslims - The Globe and Mail

In recent years, there has been a wave of criticism from within the Muslim world, much of it from militants and clerics once considered allies by al-Qaeda's leaders. To a large extent it was because al-Qaeda and affiliated groups increasingly adopted the doctrine of takfir, by which they claimed the right to decide who was a “true” Muslim, something that in mainstream Islamic theology only Allah can truly know. Al-Qaeda's Muslim critics knew what resulted from this takfiri view: First, the radicals deemed some Muslims apostates; after that, the radicals started killing them.

Given the religio-ideological basis of al-Qaeda's jihad, the condemnation being offered by religious scholars and fighters once close to the group was arguably the most important development in stopping the spread of the group's ideology since 9/11.

These new critics, in concert with mainstream Muslim leaders, created a powerful coalition countering al-Qaeda's ideas. Simultaneously al-Qaeda began losing significant traction with ordinary Muslims. The numbers of people having a favourable view of bin Laden or supporting suicide bombings, for instance, in the two most populous Muslim countries, Indonesia and Pakistan, dropped by at least half between 2002 and 2009.

By the end of the second Bush term, it was clear that al-Qaeda and allied groups were losing the “war of ideas” in the Islamic world, not because America was winning that war – quite the contrary: most Muslims had a quite negative attitude toward the United States – but because Muslims themselves had largely turned against the ideology of bin Ladenism.
 
So, what side where they on during the vietnamese war?

They were nationalistic Viet Minh who were allied with the communists. After the French were driven from North Vietnam they were rudely surprised by the communist seizure of exclusive power. They moved to South Vietnam. The war followed them. They ended up as boat people.
 
Wow, what a shocker. A thread full of French bashing and surrender jokes....

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Digs, the "world" doesn't think any such thing. This is some weird American construct that's always kinda baffled me.

It's true -- most of the world sees France as an old hand at military dominance. As well, I think the intelligent people in America, do, too. I don't think too many Americans actually believe the ridiculous rhetoric about the French being cowardly, that sometimes pops up in conservative circles. I think it's all due to a rivalry between France and America. Both nations were born by revolution, and both had a common enemy in the British for the longest time. Both nations see themselves as the beacon of freedom, humanity and equality in the world, and both see themselves as the world's current ideological role model. As well, the French won the American War of Independence for the Americans, and the Americans sent millions in material aide to France in the Second World War.

So I don't think the two nations really hate each other -- and in fact, I think they're two of the most similar countries, ideologically and politically speaking, on Earth. It's the sense of rivalry and one-upmanship between them that causes all the bashing.
 
It's true -- most of the world sees France as an old hand at military dominance. As well, I think the intelligent people in America, do, too. I don't think too many Americans actually believe the ridiculous rhetoric about the French being cowardly, that sometimes pops up in conservative circles. I think it's all due to a rivalry between France and America. Both nations were born by revolution, and both had a common enemy in the British for the longest time. Both nations see themselves as the beacon of freedom, humanity and equality in the world, and both see themselves as the world's current ideological role model. As well, the French won the American War of Independence for the Americans, and the Americans sent millions in material aide to France in the Second World War.

So I don't think the two nations really hate each other -- and in fact, I think they're two of the most similar countries, ideologically and politically speaking, on Earth. It's the sense of rivalry and one-upmanship between them that causes all the bashing.

Pal, conservatives compose half of the American populace. And we don't like the French at all.
 
Even though the French President is Conservative...

Talk about your problems with solidarity.

Conservatism in Europe plays within the political parameters established by the European left. Conservatism in American plays within the political parameters established by Ronald Reagan. Conservatives in Europe and America are strangers to each other.
 
Conservatism in Europe plays within the political parameters established by the European left. Conservatism in American plays within the political parameters established by Ronald Reagan. Conservatives in Europe and America are strangers to each other.

I'm well aware.

But are you sure the vast American public knows that?

The word conservative gets tossed around for a lot of things these days. Same with liberals.
 
Saw this on TF1 yesterday but i didnt really pay attention. Bin Laden has been sending threats since last year. However we havent Heard a thing from Sarko. But no France most likely Will not leave. Thé troops are supposedly there on a trip to aiding thé people in need, not fighting...
 
It's true -- most of the world sees France as an old hand at military dominance. As well, I think the intelligent people in America, do, too. I don't think too many Americans actually believe the ridiculous rhetoric about the French being cowardly, that sometimes pops up in conservative circles. I think it's all due to a rivalry between France and America. Both nations were born by revolution, and both had a common enemy in the British for the longest time. Both nations see themselves as the beacon of freedom, humanity and equality in the world, and both see themselves as the world's current ideological role model. As well, the French won the American War of Independence for the Americans, and the Americans sent millions in material aide to France in the Second World War.

So I don't think the two nations really hate each other -- and in fact, I think they're two of the most similar countries, ideologically and politically speaking, on Earth. It's the sense of rivalry and one-upmanship between them that causes all the bashing.

I don't think the two are similar at all politically, socially or ideologically. The only similarities are in the arrogance and sense of "we're number 1 and everybody else sucks" attitude. :lol: Could you expand on the political and ideological similarities that you see? I see France as more similar to Canada than the US.
 
It's true -- most of the world sees France as an old hand at military dominance. As well, I think the intelligent people in America, do, too. I don't think too many Americans actually believe the ridiculous rhetoric about the French being cowardly, that sometimes pops up in conservative circles. I think it's all due to a rivalry between France and America. Both nations were born by revolution, and both had a common enemy in the British for the longest time. Both nations see themselves as the beacon of freedom, humanity and equality in the world, and both see themselves as the world's current ideological role model. As well, the French won the American War of Independence for the Americans, and the Americans sent millions in material aide to France in the Second World War.

So I don't think the two nations really hate each other -- and in fact, I think they're two of the most similar countries, ideologically and politically speaking, on Earth. It's the sense of rivalry and one-upmanship between them that causes all the bashing.

I think General Patton summed up the French well:
"I'd rather have a German Division in front of me than a French one behind."

Not cowards, but incompetents.

ChIraq was a nuisance, and his behavior during Gulf War II was despicable, to America and the eastern EU allies that assisted.

Sarkozy seems OK... I'd rather have him than Obama, and I never thought I'd prefer a French leader over an American... but it is what it is.

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