• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Health care repeal will cost $230 billion

The Giant Noodle said:
Have READ the bill? Have ANY of the conservative read the bill? Because it people dont understand it! HERE IS THE BILL:
http://docs.house.gov/rules/health/111_ahcaa.pdf
Click to expand...

Thanks, now the question is have you read the 1990 page bill you just posted. You seem to have a lot of passion for this bill and the question is why? Why are you buying the CBO numbers 10 years out and what happens if you and the CBO projections are wrong? Do you think it is the role of the Federal Govt. to mandate what someone else purchases? Do you think it is the role of the Federal Govt. to take on personal responsibility issues. You claim to be a libertarian, where in the libertarian platform does it support Govt. doing what this bill does?
 
Boo Radley said:
Name another service every man wonman and child uses. You still don't see the point. The only reason all are required is becase all use it. If all had no choice but to drive, all would be required to purchase auto insurance. But regardless, government still removed the choice of someone to drive without insurance. You can't deny that. And you may continue to ignore the point, but it doesn't help your case any.
Click to expand...

Hmm, how about water, sewer service, food, housing, electricity, gas..... Do I need to go on ?? Each of these is required by everyone, but the federal government does not mandate we buy any of them from private companies.
 
Conservative said:
Really? So drug abuse, obesity, smoking, and drinking had no affect? Life expectancy in this country has increased every year. You really think that liberals give a damn about people living longer? They want the revenue and the power and that i what it is all about. Healthcare is a personal responsibility not a Federal Responsibility. Now if you want to pay for my healthcare, send me a check. Thanks.
Click to expand...

Duh. Sure those things have an effect - a fatal effect when combined with no medical care.
 
Gill said:
Hmm, how about water, sewer service, food, housing, electricity, gas..... Do I need to go on ?? Each of these is required by everyone, but the federal government does not mandate we buy any of them from private companies.
Click to expand...

seems to me, however, that at various times, various governments have tried to interfere with all of these industries based on Boo's logic that the Government must make sure that they are available to all.


how did those efforts work out, i wonder? :)
 
haymarket said:
Duh. Sure those things have an effect - a fatal effect when combined with no medical care.
Click to expand...

Medical care is available millions CHOOSE not to purchase it. Millions more are illegals getting healthcare in the ER's. We don't need this monstrosity for those that cannot afford to purchase their own health insurance.
 
indeed. if you are a 23 year old whose combined medical expenses over the course of a year come to $600, why in the world would you want to pay $5,000 for health insurance, or $8,000 for Obamacare 'exchange' insurance?
 
Conservative said:
Medical care is available millions CHOOSE not to purchase it. Millions more are illegals getting healthcare in the ER's. We don't need this monstrosity for those that cannot afford to purchase their own health insurance.
Click to expand...

Are you so intellectually without a clue that you don't get it that tens of millions cannot AFFORD to purchase private medical insurance?

Are you so intellectually without a clue that you would rather people get rushed to the ER in life threatening conditions which cost a whole lot more than simple early treatment would have cost?

You and many on the far right here get your impressions of society from sources that have nothing to do with the day to day reality of millions of peoples lives.
 
Last edited:
cpwill said:
seems to me, however, that at various times, various governments have tried to interfere with all of these industries based on Boo's logic that the Government must make sure that they are available to all.


how did those efforts work out, i wonder? :)
Click to expand...
The Tennessee Valley Authority seems to be still going strong
 
haymarket;1059204973]Are you so intellectually without a clue that you don't get it that tens of millions cannot AFFORD to purchase private medical insurance?
Click to expand...

Cite your source and how do you know the personal finances of someone else? I offered private insurance to over 1200 employees and paid 80% of the cost. Everyone was paid a good wage and could afford the premiums but half of them CHOSE not to participate because they were part of the invincible group.

Are you so intellectually without a clue that you would rather people get rushed to the ER in life threatening conditions which cost a whole lot more than simple early treatment would have cost?
Click to expand...

Intellectual honesty seems to be missing in the fact that MA is a living example of what Obamacare will be like, ER usage has skyrocketed because they cannot get into seeing a doctor. Suggest better research.

You and many on the far right here get your impressions of society from sources that have nothing to do with the day to day reality of millions of peoples lives.
Click to expand...


And what makes you an expert on the day to day reality of millions of peoples' lives? My experience trumps your view of reality.
 
haymarket said:
Are you so intellectually without a clue that you don't get it that tens of millions cannot AFFORD to purchase private medical insurance?

Are you so intellectually without a clue that you would rather people get rushed to the ER in life threatening conditions which cost a whole lot more than simple early treatment would have cost?

You and many on the far right here get your impressions of society from sources that have nothing to do with the day to day reality of millions of peoples lives.
Click to expand...

The difference is that under this boondoggle, people that can't afford health insurance will be forced to buy it whether they want to or not.
 
haymarket said:
Are you so intellectually without a clue that you don't get it that tens of millions cannot AFFORD to purchase private medical insurance?
Click to expand...

As I recall there were some 46 million people in america without health insurance, of those some 10 million are illegals/non-citizens.

Aproximately 15 million make enough to afford, but choose not to purchase for one reason or another. Some 15 million qualify for government assistance (this was pre-Obamacare) such as Medicaid, etc, but haven't yet been signed up. They will be signed up automatically once they need it.

I'm not sure that the number that can not afford insurance is quite as high as you were led to believe.

Are you so intellectually without a clue that you would rather people get rushed to the ER in life threatening conditions which cost a whole lot more than simple early treatment would have cost?
Click to expand...

This same thing is currently happening in MA under Romneycare, which is basically a copy of Obama care. Apaprently you're biggest concern will not even be solved as you were led to believe.
 
buck said:
As I recall there were some 46 million people in america without health insurance, of those some 10 million are illegals/non-citizens.

Aproximately 15 million make enough to afford, but choose not to purchase for one reason or another. Some 15 million qualify for government assistance (this was pre-Obamacare) such as Medicaid, etc, but haven't yet been signed up. They will be signed up automatically once they need it.

I'm not sure that the number that can not afford insurance is quite as high as you were led to believe.



This same thing is currently happening in MA under Romneycare, which is basically a copy of Obama care. Apaprently you're biggest concern will not even be solved as you were led to believe.
Click to expand...


I dont believe that illegals are covered man. You could change my mind if you can show me where that is in the bill.
 
The Giant Noodle said:
I dont believe that illegals are covered man. You could change my mind if you can show me where that is in the bill.
Click to expand...

Illegals aren't covered but illegals are included in the count of the Uninsured. Further Illegals' make up a huge cost in the current healthcare system as they get their care from the ER's along with a lot of insured. Difference is the Hospitals get repayment from the insured.
 
Conservative said:
My claim was that construction was stopped on 45 hospitals and I further stated that other hospitals are dropping Medicare as are doctors. Then I pointed out that in MA the ER usage is way up with Obamacare style healthcare. Seems you are too busy responding to pay attention to what is being posted. You have way too much invested in this disaster and the question is why are you defending this program and the empty suit in the WH?
Click to expand...

No, you went further. You said hospitals would close. Close. That is what you have to support. And conservative hack sites saying the construction stopped for the reasons you claim don't equal evidence either. You need more, much more. :coffeepap
 
The Prof said:
then why did KATHLEEN SEBELIUS exempt the 200+

LOL!

Approved Applications for Waiver of the Annual Limits Requirements of the PHS Act Section 2711 as of December 3, 2010

including the SERVICE EMPLOYEES INTERNATIONAL UNION

you don't know what you're talking about

would a person who is demonstrably unfamiliar with MISTER mccaskill even know who sebelius is?
Click to expand...

When will you actually address what is being said. Stuff like what you post here doesn't do that. Anyone can say anything and exempt for any number of reasons. You actual evidence and actual logic, and not just mindlessly quoting people.
 
apdst said:
Do you realize that most American want it repealed outright?

Why is it that alotta Libbos didn't get the picture on November 2?
Click to expand...

Not quite accurate. This is a case of you not actually listening to the people. They state clearly and repeatedly that they want much of what is in the Bill. Yes, they have a serious disconnect about having the parts they want and not what would pay for it, but you misrepresent when you say the American people don't want anything in this bill.
 
Boo Radley said:
No, you went further. You said hospitals would close. Close. That is what you have to support. And conservative hack sites saying the construction stopped for the reasons you claim don't equal evidence either. You need more, much more. :coffeepap
Click to expand...

Of course in your world more evidence is always necessary yet when proven wrong it is on to some other leftwing social program. The cost of Obama being wrong would be a disaster for this country. Seems that the majority agree with me so tell me what they know that you don't? Whether or not hospitals close isn't known but what is known is that construction has stopped on 45 physician owned hospitals and both doctors and hospitals are dropping Medicare patients. MA is a perfect example of what is going to happen with Obamacare.
 
Conservative said:
Illegals aren't covered but illegals are included in the count of the Uninsured. Further Illegals' make up a huge cost in the current healthcare system as they get their care from the ER's along with a lot of insured. Difference is the Hospitals get repayment from the insured.
Click to expand...

If you took out all illegals, you'd hardly even notice it. However, as I've told you before, that's a another issue altogether. And not one fixed by repealing this reform.
 
Boo Radley said:
If you took out all illegals, you'd hardly even notice it. However, as I've told you before, that's a another issue altogether. And not one fixed by repealing this reform.
Click to expand...

If you took out only the people that really cannot afford healthcare coverage you too wouldn't support this monstrosity. Seems Indiana is doing quite well without Obamacare. how can that be?
 
Conservative said:
Of course in your world more evidence is always necessary yet when proven wrong it is on to some other leftwing social program. The cost of Obama being wrong would be a disaster for this country. Seems that the majority agree with me so tell me what they know that you don't? Whether or not hospitals close isn't known but what is known is that construction has stopped on 45 physician owned hospitals and both doctors and hospitals are dropping Medicare patients. MA is a perfect example of what is going to happen with Obamacare.
Click to expand...

Look, you take a wild claim made by a less than accurate source, and you accept it because it suits you, and make digs at me. Fine, but I challenge you to find any credible accurate source that backs up the claim, and not just quote the inaccurate source either. If the claim is true, you should be able to present what I ask. If it is not true, you won't be able to, and that shoudl cause you pause, if you care about truth that is.
 
Boo Radley said:
Look, you take a wild claim made by a less than accurate source, and you accept it because it suits you, and make digs at me. Fine, but I challenge you to find any credible accurate source that backs up the claim, and not just quote the inaccurate source either. If the claim is true, you should be able to present what I ask. If it is not true, you won't be able to, and that shoudl cause you pause, if you care about truth that is.
Click to expand...

Sorry but most of what you post is from unreliable sources that want a single payer system which will destroy this country just like it has the socialist countries of Europe. I provided you the link to information but because of the source the data is inaccurate yet you have no problem quoting Obama who has yet to tell the truth on any issue along with any other leftwing site that wants this country to go down the path Europe went down years ago and is now dismantling.

When you fook around with 1/6 of the U.S. economy you better be right and there is no evidence that Obama is right on this or any other issue. Take the blinder off.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom